Candidates flying from overseas to sit super-selective grammar 11+

[PopcornPoppingInAPan]

A friend told me for one of the super super selectives in London that some candidates who live overseas had flown in to sit the 11+ exam. If successful the whole family was relocating here. (This is foreign nationals, rather than “ex-pat” British families living overseas.) The school has no priority area.

I wondered if anyone had heard this and whether it was credible or if it’s one of those internet rumours?

I was also wondering if it’s even possible to do this. Obviously families do relocate to the UK and assuming they and the kids have a right to reside then the kids will be entitled to a school place. But can you do it before you’ve moved here?

I guess if you can put down a relative’s address as your address for the purpose of sitting the exam and then submitting the CAF maybe that’s all you need. I wasn’t sure if LAs did any more checks on candidates who aren’t already on their books at state primary, IYSWIM.

I have heard of a family moving from Yorkshire when their DC got a place at the same super selective school so perhaps this is just an extension of that.

It doesn't remove your chance to move between non grammar school also.

Why not move to Dubai then, for the better for both world 😂

The government will get more on the VAT on Eton fee, save up some free state funding place.

Honesty, I wish I could bus you all in to see it yourselves. They don’t value themselves. No respect for themselves or where they live.

Actually, just watch some old Jeremy Kyle episodes. They used to get them in off one of the local estates, lots of familes from dds primary were very proud to have been on it.

“Even if what you said is true (which I personally doubt, given your random and inconsistent points, perhaps you change the definition of tutor ), the vast majority of students require some form of tutoring to gain admission. This is a fact, and there’s no point in pretending otherwise.”

DH got a first at Oxbridge, DS must have inherited his brains. Clearly it cannot come from me, with my anecdotes and emotional form of reasoning. In case that is what you were thinking.
We bought some CGP books, did them over the summer holidays, borrowed some past papers from a friend and did one of those paid for mock tests. And yes, he got into all grammars, no problem.

The uniqueness lies not in the existence of such a place, but in your unwillingness to move away from a place you desperately dislike.

Why would I want to do that? Dd has got a place at one of the best grammars in the country, hopefully my youngest will go there too when her time comes, and if she doesn’t, the secondary schools in that area are a world apart from where we are now.

@Dtnews I’ve been reading this thread with interest. I think in a recent post you’ve basically laid out the position that you’ve been somewhat dancing around throughout.
You would prefer there to be no grammar or academically selective schools. Your stated justification is that they are of no real benefit.
However in this post you state that if the sort of parents who care about their children’s education enough to send them to selective schools would instead send them to non selective schools, it would raise the standard of the non selective schools.
Of course there are lots of parents who care very deeply about the children’s education who actively choose to send them to non selective schools (as you clearly do). But there are also lots who don’t really value education that much. And there are less of those types of parents in selective schools. That’s a fact.
You want to take the choice away from a group a parents so that it will have a positive impact on non selective schools (in your opinion).
Just be honest and admit it.

I have cancer. I’m undergoing treatments. My life is very uncertain at the moment. It’s not unwillingness, it’s very difficult right now to think about moving.

Here you go, no tutoring actually has it.

With full sympathy, it is still a unique circumstances.

Not all children, however well tutored or behaved, could get into a grammar. Two of mine probably would have, no problem, if we had them. They are both straight A pupils. My other is very well behaved, very hard working, very well liked by teachers, very well supported at home, and tutored in three subjects. We will be delighted if he achieves a pass in any of his exams. He also deserves a chance to learn in school, to get the grades required for college courses he enjoys even if that course leads to him working in a shop, fast food restaurant or as a care assistant, rather than as doctor or a lawyer..

You want to take the choice away from a group a parents so that it will have a positive impact on non selective schools

Nobody dismisses this idea. However, it is not at the expense of the former group of parents (at least, there is no evidence to suggest this). Moreover, the positive impact does not rely on 'these' parents lifting others up but rather stems from the absence of educational segregation and the broader social benefits it brings.

Sorry, how does me, wanting to send my child to a grammar, stop your child from achieving?

You don’t sound like the sort of parent to go shouting your mouth off at a teacher. I’m sure your child will do just fine and be happy.

Which would be a solid argument if it were 50% of all children going to grammar school. But it’s not. It’s only a small proportion.

Of course they value themselves, they just use different criteria to you. As you say, they were proud to be on Jeremy Kyle. It is respect for their culture and where they live that stops children wanting to ‘improve themselves’ as this would be considered a rejection of the community.

Why are you sure a child like mine would do just fine and be happy, but a child with the greater skills and abilities of your daughter would not?

“Not sure why getting rid of grammars would be such a big deal? They would simply be banned from using academic ability as a selection criteria, or required to use banding. Teachers would have to adapt to a broader range of abilities and the school might have to change its subject choice offer and SEN provision.”

@AshKeys - so it is an attack on the spoilt grammar school teachers now is it? Cannot handle SEND etc? You do realise there is plenty of SEND in grammar schools you know. Just more ASD, it’s partly why many parents choose it in the first place.

Also I wouldn’t stick around for that kind of disruption for my child’s education. I can’t comment more widely but I already have 3 colleagues going abroad for work as a direct result of the private school VAT. But you guys carry on. You will be the ones paying for this.

I’m assuming you don’t live where I do. I work here, in a role in schools. My dd would be one of the girls who gets ripped to shreds. I’ve seen it, sadly. I’ve seen girls like her get bullied. They usually dumb themselves down to fit in or just has a really hard time of it.

Her teachers have said the same. They knew years ago we wouldn’t be sending her to school locally, I know some of them really well now, and I’ve discussed all this with them.

It’s extremely common for secondary. It’s why our local schools require evidence of having lived at an address for 2 years prior to acceptance of a place.

Sounds like it is win win suitation.

A win win for who? A Russian social media agitator per chance?

It’s only a small proportion

So, what’s the issue with having the same system implemented across the entire country?

Yeah, it was the same when I was in London. My eldest is in their 20s, I remember the days when parents would rent a studio flat for a few months just for an address to apply from. By the time ds started secondary, they had really cracked down on it.

Where you are maybe. But as I said earlier your own experience isn't evidence of this being a national issue. I would suggest that only a small majority of wealthy middle classes can afford to this. I might be wrong but I await evidence to demonstrate that..