waiting list experiences / help!

[pearlsthatwerent]

Just after a little advice - anecdotes - stories - cheerful reflections...

My daughter wasn't offered ANY of her preferred secondary schools (we weren't fussy - would happily have sent her to all of them - and we did include her catchment school). Instead she's been offered a place at a school across town (c. an hour's bus ride) with a less good reputation. We're in Cambridge, which seems to have had an absurd bulge year.

She is 10th on the waiting list for our 1st preference (240 PAN), and I'm just trying to understand how these waiting lists work. Does anyone have any insight?

In particular: are places offered as soon as they become available, or do schools / LAs wait until after certain dates - perhaps the deadline for acceptances?

If we decide to home-school or manage to find (and indeed afford) a place at an Independent, can we remain on the state waiting list?

Does 10th sound hopeful in this situation - bearing in mind the almost general over-subscription here? I'm torn between remaining optimistic and gently preparing my daughter for a change of plan, but I've no idea how much movement is usual on these lists, or when it happens (why would anyone change their mind in July??).

I'd be so grateful for any thoughts anyone wanted to share - we're thinking about an appeal too, but just hoping against hope that won't be necessary.

@shockeditellyou i’m glad the LA responded and were nice. Better than being ignored. I’m hoping that many appealing will withdraw as will get WL offers before hand.

@Rinse123 thanks. How are you doing today?

@shockeditellyou not much better sadly. I feel like we won’t get a WL offer - I go from positive to really negative in waves. Thank you for asking

It's just rubbish. Totally understand how you feel.

Sending hugs to us all today. It's hard when it feels like most people are sorted and here we are in limbo land. Prolonged uncertainty is a known factor in poor mental health. Obviously there is going to be unavoidable uncertainty around outcomes. But why should parents and children's uncertainty be prolonged around process like this? It's so unfair. There is a co-ordinated admissions day. There is nothing to stop co-ordination of the process thereafter to deal with surplus places.

Thank goodness for this thread and the support we can give each other. Everyone is doing their very best to piece together what we can and hopefully we can all move forward bit by bit together. So far as I'm concerned, there is still hope up and until the end of December and I'm going to work on that basis.

Admissions for second choice place just emailed to let me know DS has moved from 24th to 15th. Quietly joyful but working on the appeal meantime.

keep going everyone

@AllSuggestionsTaken thats great movement huge congratulations on hearing there has been progress. It’s radio silence here but I’m doing much better today. Beautiful day today. Easter decorations are out and I’m feeling optimistic about the new beginnings springs brings. I’ve planted a few flowers today with youngest as it’s my day at home with her on Wednesdays so I’d strongly recommend a bit of gardening and sun to lighten everyone’s mood.

@shockeditellyou you must be near the top so fingers crossed for you! Thanks for the update, I will email LA to ask if we have a new WL position.

Does anyone know if you win an appeal do you have to take the place? I'm still wondering what is best to do.

https://www.cambridgeindependent.co.uk/news/parents-demand-action-on-lack-of-cambridge-school-places-9357496/
A spokesperson for the Eastern Learning Alliance, which runs Chesterton Community College, said the college has taken on more students each year that planned for in its Pupil Admission Number (PAN).
“We have currently offered 190 places to Year 6 students, with an expectation that up to 20 additional students will be placed at Chesterton as part of the EHCP process. In addition, a number of students will rightly win their appeals for places with us. The combined impact of this is that Chesterton is operationally full,” the spokesperson said.

Anyone think CCC reverted to PAN this year because they are expecting a lot of appeals allowed? I didn't realise ECHP cases were in addition to PAN either. They took 240 on 1st March last year so does that mean they took an additional 20 ECHP cases on top of that? Plus appeals? Hmm.

@Secondarywoes Chesterton would appear to have a actual PAN of 180. This year they have over-offered to 190, which is a standard thing many schools do in oversubscribed areas. They are not allowed to keep places back for EHCPs or appeals, but they haven't - they only need to offer to PAN. I assume they know from previous years and current insight as to how many EHCPs they might be asked to take, though another 20 does seem ridiculously high given the national average is only about 3% per year group in mainstream schools. An EHCP that names the school would be in addition to PAN, so any more now would increase their intake.

With ref to appeals, again they can't keep places back for potential appeals to be won, but I think the comment was probably made as a spirited defense to a question about why they didn't take another 2 bulge classes this year (which if they took 240 last year that would have been the effect). I don't imagine they are expecting considerably more appeals to be won this year than any other year.

You would need to check the situation in your LA with what happens If you win an appeal. In my LA you would get to then chose whether to take it, but I know LAs are more hard line about taking the previous offer away if you get another (arguably against the admissions code but there you go).

So if a school has a PAN of 180 and has offered 180 places, is that an indication they may be expecting appeals?

Not at all. It's actually more normal to allocate just to PAN, and then fill from a waiting list. Some schools in oversubscribed areas do over-offer to help the LA out, to ensure every child gets an offer on offer day, as they know a certain % of child will move/go private in that area. Usually the intention is to fall back to PAN, so not to offer another place until acceptances are one under normal PAN.

Most oversubscribed schools "expect" appeals. It's down then to the relative strength of their case and the appellants. Some schools will always be able to produce a very strong case not to admit any more, some won't.

@Secondarywoes @PatriciaHolm This is interesting and useful, many thanks for posting: though I have to say it all sounds rather complicated and oblique. Strange for a school to announce they are expecting to respond to appeals! We are in catchment for Chesterton and live under a mile away, but are still 45 on the WL, so there's clearly a bit of over-crowding going on.

Looking back over past numbers, it seems Chesterton take a 'bulge' year three years in a row, and then revert to the adversited PAN, or near enough - and this is one of those years.

@AllSuggestionsTaken Rocketing up the WL - wonderful! And @Rinse123: very glad to hear you're feeling more positive; I'll try and find some of that springtime joy myself.

@pearlsthatwerent

I suspect it may just be as simple as "A spokesperson for the Eastern Learning Alliance" being whoever answered the phone, and not someone who actually knows much about admissions!

Just had an email from admissions for first choice - DS hasn’t moved on the WL and is still 29. Admissions email advises ‘there may be some movement after Easter but not a lot’.

Ugh.

Urgh. That is demoralising. I am sorry. What is the second choice like? It looks like you’re in with a fighting change there?

The second choice is fine, it’s actually where most children have applied to. The big downside is that the child that bullied DS badly has a place there.

The first choice is better for DS due to the distance and the extra curricular offering.

But anywhere other than allocated would be wonderful!

That's not ideal about the bully, at all. Sorry to hear that. I would hope in old be easier to avoid bully if it is a bigger school than primary school but still so unsettling and unpleasant

It's so up and down. You feel you get one step forward and 10 steps back. I go from feeling quite hopeful to the depths of despair. Just got to keep on going.

It's so up and down. You feel you get one step forward and 10 steps back. I go from feeling quite hopeful to the depths of despair. Just got to keep on going.

This exactly!

I'm off to see Shit School (our catchment choice that we have been offered) today. Partly for reassurance in case we do end up there, and partly to see what they don't have! To be fair they have been extremely accommodating.

That’s good. I need to go and visit our allocated school. I would like to do it myself dnd then take DS if needs be - but I’m worried that’s a bit much to ask!

I felt a bit more positive a few days ago but now I’m back to feeling crap. We should find out about waiting list etc on Tuesday/Wednesday and I’m now dreading it in case it’s awful news

Hi everyone how are you all doing this week. Another week done in limbo. I’m looking forward to the Easter holidays as a distraction then I’ll be back to freaking out after that I’m sure. Thinking of you @Gobbolinothewitchscat for Tuesday please do update us. Hope your training session is a welcome distraction.

@shockeditellyou how was the school visit?

Thank you. I really appreciate you thinking of me.

I am now having a complete freak out and wondering if I should put DS down on the waiting list for schools that we had ruled out. If he ends up going non-selective, would a difference of 5% between GCSE level 5 pass rates be something that would think very material in chosing a school? One is round 47% and the other 51%? But the level 8 score is better in the school with the 47% rate. Can't think straight.

Still waiting to hear about the private option too - that is going to mean cutting back if we send him there if he gets an offer. Would we better to use some of that money for tutors and enrichment activities etc and send him to the non-selective?

I was feeling a bit better this week and now I'm back going round in circles and panicking 😵‍💫. DH keeps telling me just to not bother thinking about this stuff til we hear next week about the grammar but I can't get it out of my head. I feel I've messed up chosing an alternative school as assumed DS would get into the grammar

Yes - would be interested to hear re this. Hope it went well

@Gobbolinothewitchscat so we have declined the non selective comp we were offered and both 1st and 2nd are grammar. We have an offer from a semi selective private. I know that DD will do well and be happy with the private but it will stretch us. If she gets an offer on 1st choice either WL or appeal we will do it.

logical mind I think with the academic support of us DD will do well wherever she goes but we are a London borough my biggest worry is getting stabbed - our non selective comps have metal detectors. So I’ve decided it’s selective or private. If I was in an area where safety wasn’t my biggest worry I would think DD will be fine well support her can get tutors as you say. It’s an incredibly hard choice and ultimately we have 3 DD’s so what we do with one impacts all. There’s a lot to think about. I’m here for you.

@Gobbolinothewitchscat and@Rinse123 - same boat here! We've just got an offer at a private school, which in one sense is a huge relief; but we have another DC and would have to do it for him too, in fairness. So life would change quite a bit (more borrowing, no holidays etc); I feel lucky we can even consider this option, but can't help the sense of dismay, when we wouldn't be facing any of this if things had been just a little bit different. Looks like we'll have to pay a term's fees to keep the place before there's a chance of finding out about the waiting list, too.

I also have a DH who's in the 'just don't think about it for a bit' camp: a tolerant, glazed sort of expression comes over his face when I try to talk through my latest bit of mad statistics dredging. Very annoying.

And @Gobbolinothewitchscat , remember that bright children do well even in bad schools - statistics (much though I love them) only tell half the story. I think if our place were a bit nearer I'd be seriously considering it - but at least an hour each way (I did the morning bus route!) is too much. Good idea to visit / engage with allocated school if you're appealing, I think.

Sending calming and positive thoughts to you both, and all others trapped in this particularly unpleasant headspace.

@pearlsthatwerent agree entirely we are so privileged to have an offer from a private school and be in a position to offer that to DD but I feel upset that it’s come to me needing this insurance policy as I see it and the cost it’ll have to us as a family as they’ll need to be cut backs