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Secondary education

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Original poster

GCSE "compulsory" subject. DS doesn't want to do it.

213 replies

sugarhopper · 04/10/2023 20:57

DS is in top set for French at school. School says that if you are in the top set in year 9 then you HAVE to take French as one of your GCSE choices.

Now, while DS is good at it, he doesn't like or enjoy it. Top set of any other subject aren't forced into a GCSE, only the MFL classes.
Also doing French will mean he will have to drop one of his other options (probably Design & Tech or Computing) which he really wants to do. (Also, top set for these subjects)
I know we're going to have a fight on our hands over this, but any advice will be welcome.

OP posts:
Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:01

What does he want to do?
GCSE French is more useful and better thought of than computing. Not doing computing won’t close any doors to him. Not doing GCSE French would.

Octavia64 · 04/10/2023 21:09

Well, obvious answer is to really really badly in the tests and get put down a set.

WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 21:14

I flat out when on strike when my school forced me to do a subject. Eventually they let me not do the lessons as I was disrupting everyone else (I got a* in all my other subjects)

If necessary say you will support him in not doing any work and arrange for him to do the GCSE he does want to study privately. The school won't get that grade in his results then

WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 21:19

*went

(It wasn't English I skipped Blush)

Original poster
sugarhopper · 04/10/2023 21:22

Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:01

What does he want to do?
GCSE French is more useful and better thought of than computing. Not doing computing won’t close any doors to him. Not doing GCSE French would.

He wants to do some sort of computer engineering. My eldest DC works as a designer in the aviation industry, and he's thinking along those lines.

He's a quiet, well behaved kid and would struggle to play up or deliberately flunk tests.
I'm not so quiet and am quite happy to make a fuss if needed.

OP posts:
shockeditellyou · 04/10/2023 21:22

I think this is because the school want to look good in the Ebacc results- pupils only hit the Ebacc target if they do a MFL.

like a PP said, time to fail a few exams.

WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 21:22

Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:01

What does he want to do?
GCSE French is more useful and better thought of than computing. Not doing computing won’t close any doors to him. Not doing GCSE French would.

French doors, mainly Grin

Doing a subject that engages you is far more likely to be useful than one that doesn't.

(Interestingly I was the opposite of op's son and would have gladly done more languages but flat out refused to do DT)

clary · 04/10/2023 21:24

What other options - ie how many - will he have? A lot of schools still insist on more able students taking history or geog + MFL - which can leave only one or two max option choices. So DS2 had this and took PE and computing.

If he takes French, will that leave him only one free choice in effect?

If he really doesn't want to take it, I would be prepared to argue it. It saddens me esp if a student is able - MFL is my subject and I truly love it and believe in its importance. However, even I recognise that forcing a student to take French against their will is not going to end well - for them, for the teacher or for the rest of the class tbh.

Not taking French, let's be honest, will (obvs) close the door of French A level/degree - but I imagine he is fine with that. Not having GCSE in MFL will not be an issue at all when applying for even the most popular unis - so don't let school tell you it will.

Millybob · 04/10/2023 21:24

GCSE French won't get him to a level where he can do anything useful with it. Maybe stumble through asking directions on holiday and even then he probably won't understand the reply.
And as he doesn't like French, presumably he won't be taking A-level.
Dig your heels in.

WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 21:24

sugarhopper · 04/10/2023 21:22

He wants to do some sort of computer engineering. My eldest DC works as a designer in the aviation industry, and he's thinking along those lines.

He's a quiet, well behaved kid and would struggle to play up or deliberately flunk tests.
I'm not so quiet and am quite happy to make a fuss if needed.

Show quote history

So was I to be fair, but the injustice inspired a side I didn't know I had!

I would indicate you are contemplating moving schools if they don't sort it...

parietal · 04/10/2023 21:25

If he wants to do computing or DT, he should be supported for that. It does sound like the school policy is driven by ebacc. If they aren't amenable to discussing it, he will have to rapidly go down in sets.

WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 21:25

Millybob · 04/10/2023 21:24

GCSE French won't get him to a level where he can do anything useful with it. Maybe stumble through asking directions on holiday and even then he probably won't understand the reply.
And as he doesn't like French, presumably he won't be taking A-level.
Dig your heels in.

I studied french to degree level and that's all I can manage these days Blush

DelphiniumBlue · 04/10/2023 21:26

If they think they might lose him as a pupil, and the funding he carries with him ( and the kudos from the grades he is likely to get at GCSE) they might reconsider.

Dotcheck · 04/10/2023 21:27

Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:01

What does he want to do?
GCSE French is more useful and better thought of than computing. Not doing computing won’t close any doors to him. Not doing GCSE French would.

No, it won’t.

Which doors do you imagine will be closed?

Brilliantlydone · 04/10/2023 21:29

At my school they would not bend on this. At all. You have to prepare yourself that they might not allow him to not do it. Best bet would be to move sets now.

clary · 04/10/2023 21:31

GCSE French won't get him to a level where he can do anything useful with it.

People often say things like this on MN but I don't agree. Yes, if you don't use your French (even your degree!) at all for some time afterwards then you will forget. I can't recall much chemistry, having not touched it a great deal in the last 40 years, but no one says I shouldn't have studied it. Including me btw.

A student who passes French GCSE with a grade of 7 or above will be able to speak for a few minutes about subjects such as hobbies, school, the environment, holidays and their family. They will be able to write a few paragraphs on the same subjects with reasonable accuracy. Yes, speaking with a French person might be a challenge because of their speed of speaking, but they would be able to be understood and have a meaningful conversation.

(I am not saying this ability will last forever - like any skill, if not exercised, then yes, it will atrophy).

underneaththeash · 04/10/2023 21:31

Millybob · 04/10/2023 21:24

GCSE French won't get him to a level where he can do anything useful with it. Maybe stumble through asking directions on holiday and even then he probably won't understand the reply.
And as he doesn't like French, presumably he won't be taking A-level.
Dig your heels in.

Exactly, just say he won't be doing it.
They'ew making him do it due to this Ebac thing, so they get extra money if children do a certain range of subjects. Unfortunately, modern language teaching seems to be so awful in the UK that I would certainly do something else.

RainbowUtensils · 04/10/2023 21:33

Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:01

What does he want to do?
GCSE French is more useful and better thought of than computing. Not doing computing won’t close any doors to him. Not doing GCSE French would.

Which decade are you living in? Computing will be a much more useful qualification than French. I did French and German at GCSE out of choice, and a short course ICT that was compulsory which I put the bare minimum of effort into.

Guess how often I use French or German in my daily life? Yes, that's right, never.

Guess how often I use computing / data skills? Yes, that's right, every day.

Needmorelego · 04/10/2023 21:36

I agree with @Octavia64 . Start being crap at French. That's kinda what I did - but I was actually crap at French. One decent possibly accidental test mark put me in top set - but I really was terrible.
(btw - I got Grade D 😂)

Flaskfan · 04/10/2023 21:37

Ds will have to do Welsh as a gcse. He hates it and is pretty shit at it, despite having allegedly been taught it since he was 5. We live right on the edge of Wales and he will, in all likelihood, end up working in England like most people round here. I did 2 other languages at gcse, and continued one to A level. I dropped Welsh in yr 9.I have never needed it.

Lamelie · 04/10/2023 21:38

RainbowUtensils · 04/10/2023 21:33

Which decade are you living in? Computing will be a much more useful qualification than French. I did French and German at GCSE out of choice, and a short course ICT that was compulsory which I put the bare minimum of effort into.

Guess how often I use French or German in my daily life? Yes, that's right, never.

Guess how often I use computing / data skills? Yes, that's right, every day.

Show quote history

And you could learn those skills in an afternoon. We all use IT.
OP if he wants to work in computing he could still do A Level Computing. Although maths, sciences and humanities would be even better.

clary · 04/10/2023 21:39

I don't think schools do get extra money based on numbers of students sitting ebacc subjects? I've never heard that.

It is a measure that schools are judged on tho - but that shouldn't worry you @sugarhopper , it's your son not the school you need to be thinking about.

ItsNotRocketSalad · 04/10/2023 21:39

I'd support him 100% and fight the school on this all the way. They're not doing this because it's in his best interests.

Vriddle · 04/10/2023 21:40

The only thing that matters is what your ds wants to study, to take him where he wants to be. Not what the school wants for itself.

Does not having Ebacc close any doors (for unis, A level colleges, etc)? I shouldn't think so, but that would be my only hesitation. Easy enough to find out.

Iloveanicegarden · 04/10/2023 21:42

What do people think D/T is? Taught properly it develops all kind of skills that are in short supply. It is not solely about cutting up wood/metal/plastics to make second rate artefacts.