Is it a good London comp - only 70% of pupils got into 6th form?

[Sirine1708]

Good morning, we are currently renting in SW6 but I'm looking at comps in cheaper areas around London where we could afford to buy 2-3 bedroom and first I was looking mostly at A-level results.

Then I decided to check what % of pupils actually get from secondary school to the 6th form.

Much to my surprise I've found out that less than 70% ks4 pupils from popular in Sutton Glenthorne and Greenshaw High got into school's own or any other 6th form - the same or less then in our local very average secondary.

www.find-school-performance-data.service.gov.uk/school/136914/glenthorne-high-school/secondary/pupil-destination

Also those school have less than 90% "happy" parents according to locrating, that is also quite low in comparison to other schools.

Do you think those numbers are worth paying attention to? My child is average in a good way :) he has no learning difficulties so far but doesn't stand out as gifted either.
So I would prefer school that pays attention not only to the top cohorts.

What do you mean by 'got into 6th form'? Do you mean to do A levels?

Given that 1/3rd of pupils fail English and/or Maths GCSE nationally, there will be a good chunk for whom A levels are not suitable. Plus then some people who could do A levels will still choose not to.

BTECs / T-Levels at college are a perfectly good destination.

Kids aren't sat around on the streets doing drugs if they aren't at a school 6th form.

Bear in mind that not every young person wants to go to sixth form and do A levels.
Apprenticeships and college are also options at 16.

Sutton has a grammar system. That takes a lot of the children who would go into 6th form. A lot of privates, too. And then there's the Catholic schools.

You're looking at different cohorts in each secondary to 'normal'.

There are several 6th form colleges in the area which many kids go to instead of staying at school.

Have a look at the GSCE results ((2019 for pre covid results) to see how the schools do.

That what I was thinking.
But actually Glenthorne got the same 34% of "high attaining" students in Y7 as some popular comps in the North or say West Londone Free School.
But all of them got 80% or more students into 6th form.

Does it mean those schools support pupils of all abilities and background better?

Yes and this stats shows all students who transferres both to 6th form schools and colleges, not only the ones who stayed at the same school for A-levels

Could it be a difference between what type of FE providers there are in the catchment area?
e.g. Could a college that provides a mix of A level & vocational be classified under FE college rather than 6th for college? Or vice versa?

But I was not looking at average UK school, at least mumsnet doesn't think so.

That link you've posted shows 96% of glenthorne pupils went onto further education/work in 2020?

Sorry. I was going off the title which was a comp.

A comp by definition takes all ability so I'd expect a significant % not to go on to A levels.

The ones I'm comparing have all ability intake based on catchment. I'm not looking at grammar and religious schools.

That's right.

And below there are numbers - of 91% staying in education after ks4, 22% went to FE, 65% to 6th form schools, 3% to 6th form colleges

Not all DCs want to stay in a school environment. Taking a levels at a 6th form college or FE college is just the same. Also other qualifications maybe available at those establishments that aren't in schools - T levels, BTECs etc. All still allow uni progression.

Maybe there actually is a good FE college in the area, wonder how to look it up.

I cannot only really comment on greenshaw but I would say greenshaw it has a very mixed intake.

The school only offers traditional a levels (no btecs etc) so I would expect a large number to go to colleges to do more vocational subjects in 6th form.

I don't hear grumbling about it's reputation locally - if people ask on local Fb groups it's usually positive feedback.

If you are going standard catchment not 11+ to get in you need to live very close - think 1300 metres.

Glenthorne has banding entrance tests so distance may differ for each.it also has some performing arts places but I think you need to score high on those to get in.

Greenshaw has just been given government funding so much of the school will be rebuilt over next few years.

NESCOT
Reigate
Coulsdon
Croydon
All colleges used by Sutton pupils for a start

If Glenthorne has performing arts speciality, the some pupils could go on to the BRIT school in Croydon too.

Too add to the list of colleges

Kingston
South Thames
Carshalton

When choosing a mixed comp you need to look at progress scores, GCSE results, local reputation, leadership (read a recent Ofsted report) go and visit and get a feel for the place and how the pupils are presented, behave moving between classes and act in class. A sixth might only offer limited A levels which won't appeal to many (including those with the grades to take them) - 91% in FE sounds pretty good for a mixed entry comprehensive especially in an area with lots of private & grammar schools.

I’m not in your area of London, but I’d say 70% is a good number. Lots from my DC’s highly regarded comprehensive would choose FE college instead of a school sixth form, yes, even the high attainers. My own high-achieving DC left to go a specialist dance school after GCSE.

I wouldn’t worry about A-levels, there are lots of options post 16. Look at years 7 to 11 instead and GCSE results, what opportunities are on offer, what are the results like. Even if the school has a sixth form, there’s quite a bit of movement as some pupils change school for example because their school doesn’t do the options they want, some go into work, some go for vocational options, some simply fancy a change. Because every school sixth form is different and offer a range of options, it’s very difficult to compare them. However your DC will have to do GCSEs in that school, so it’s more important to get that experience right, they can always move for sixth form.

Thank's for you input, Wandsworth schools also have banding intake but it doesn't seen to impact their intake dramatically.

I also noticed that Glenthorne have smaller 6th form intake compared to y7 intake (167 pupils doing A level in comparison to 249 finishing ks4), maybe it's the case here. I didn't compare this ratio for other schools though.

Is that the size of the 6th form or just those doing A levels at Glenthorne?

Again, this is really normal. It's very unusual for a school, even one with a good sixth form, to have a Y12 comparable in size to Y7.

As others have said, there at lots of other options available at 16 than staying on in your school to do A-levels. A proportion of students will want to do something more vocational- that could be anything from an apprenticeship, to going to a specific performing arts school, to a more vocational course at a local college. Some may also be involved in high performance sport academies etc. There may also be students who want to pursue different academic qualifications, like IB.

In London, there are probably more opportunities for young people compared to the traditional routes of school vs college- there will likely be some companies offering really exciting apprenticeships, there are lots of opportunities for music/acting/dance etc, there are probably more opportunities relating to sports, and so on.

Even in a high performing school, A-levels will not be for everyone- and not everyone will want to stay on and do them in a school environment. Some students will want to do more niche A-levels e.g. something like Environmental Science, which the average state school sixth form can't offer, as it won't be financially viable.

To be honest, I think 70% is a pretty high percentage of students going into sixth forms, and 167 is a good sized Y12 which suggests the sixth form is viable and will offer a wide range of subjects. I think this is really positive data, which you're perhaps taking negatively?

It says "Students reaching the end of 16 to 18 study in 2020 and staying in education or employment for at least 2 terms after this."

So I assumed it shows yearly 6th form intake.