IB or A Levels

[Veronica25]

What are people experience of IB or A levels and their opinion? how do they impact work and university choices?

DD is looking at Sixth Forms and doesn't know yet what she would like to do as a career. She enjoys various subjects including DT, Geography, Maths, Chemistry, Spanish, have thought of economics and business but researched them yet.

I would be grateful for opinion on both.

@Veronica25
One of my DC went to Dartford Grammar and loved it. Fully IB at 6th Form (which I am sure you already know) and great support with all aspects of the IB. Great teachers, in my experience, who know the criteria and syllabus of the IB very well.

The school achieves a very high average points score each year - I recall it being over 38 for the last few years, which will get you into a vast majority of universities - although obvs you do need to take into account university requirements for Higher level subjects as many do not just base their offer on overall points.

Lots of girls join from other local (and not so local) schools at 6th form - in my DC's year it was an almost 50:50 gender split at 6th form.

A huge variety of different universitites and courses from amongst the peer group - check out the school website, they show destination data in good detail.

@FitAt50

Husband (Deputy Head) just said "Very prentious to to the IB in Britain".

Well, there you go then. Must be true!

The school achieves a very high average points score each year

Well it is very selective, so you would expect that. I imagine that anyone not doing well will be managed out.

@RampantIvy
Yes, it is high at 52 points across 8 gcse subjects. So a 6.5 average. I guess there are requirements for subjects that the students want to do at higher, but then many schools might say the same for A level requirements.
I’m not sure how that compares to other grammar schools for 6th form entry, or 6th form colleges. Though there aren’t really any 6th form colleges hat do A levels or IB in this area, a vast majority of those students taking those pathways will stay at school, or move to another school.

[quote TizerorFizz]@Dancingdreamer
I think it’s difficult measuring success by first class degrees too. It wholly depends on university attended. As I mused above, the IB suits very intelligent all rounders who seek out schools offering the qualification. They have the advantage of being bilingual as evidenced by Ofsted at the Cambridgeshire school. They might have very intellectual parents too! The DC who couldn’t achieve very highly elect not to do the IB and change schools. So it’s a bit like saying grammar school DC do better then secondary modern DC. Of course they do.[/quote]
The research I found (can’t remember where as it was a few years ago) compared results within institutions not generally across all universities and looked at 1sts and 2.1s.

Thank you everyone for the advise. It has been very helpful.

I am glad we started researching it this year as it is a big decision; she does not need to apply until next year.

I feel it is a great qualification, albeit not for everyone and not necessary give them more advantages at university. I think being able to do 6 subjects instead of 3 is great opportunity; specially if they don't know what they want to study as a career yet.

We saw TGGS but unless we move closer, the commuting may be a a bit much on top of all the work. I hope we can see Dartford grammar this year but have been unable to book, I have emailed them to see if there is a cancellation. This is definitely closer and involves one train instead of 2.

A bit late to this but...
My dd was absolutely an all-rounder although she was pretty set on her uni subject choice quite early on. She felt really sad at having to give up so many subjects at sixth form - I wondered about IB but locally she would have had to go to an independent school (which we couldn't have afforded) and in any case there was no way she would have agreed to leave her school which she loved.
So she picked her A levels and didn't regret them. The one subject she missed the most at A level she is now doing as additional study at uni.
She is at uni with a lot of IB students and I gather that they have all found the workload very intense and the expectations very high. She doesn't seem to feel that anyone has a particular advantage/disadvantage. I think doing NEAs as part of her A levels has been beneficial though (but possibly only because of the type of subject she is doing).

IB is harder! My brother is super smart (went on to Cambridge/Harvard) and still found it hard and didn't get top top marks in his IB

I think Cambridge and Harvard probably ARE hard though, whatever qualifications you had to get there.

I think doing NEAs as part of her A levels has been beneficial though

I agree, especially if the student didn't do an EPQ.

@Kikkomam I meant to say my brother found the IB hard. He obtained top grades throughout his undergraduate/postgraduate degrees (all Firsts) but found the IB at school hard

Thank you.

It is a difficult decision. I am glad she doesn't need to decide until next year as she is really unsure what subjects to choose and having to choose 3 make it harder. I think the IB will suit her better as she will have more choice and will have more options for unit, but I am worried about he workload.

We only managed to see this year TGGS which DD really liked and Bullers Wood for A levels which is also a very good school; but the DT department didn't impress us much. We will have to see Dartford Grammar (couldn't get a ticket as it was fully booked) and other A level schools next year.

DD very much wanted to do IB, but no state school offers it nearby and I can't afford private. She really struggled to narrow down her choices to 4 A levels and doesn't know what career she wants to go into to. But she unexpectedly struggled with one of her A level subjects and has dropped it, if she'd been doing IB she might have struggled. Her sixth form has also picked up a few private school kids who can't couldn't cope with the IB, but who are flying with more limited subjects.

Great thread thank you! We are dealing with this dilemma at the moment. School offers IB only and we definitely prefer it in terms of content and overall philosophy. DD would like to stay where she is and do IB but is worried about workload despite being fairly academic because she has ADHD and everything takes her longer and causes stress. On the other hand, there is less independent study and that might possibly be a plus. A levels would allow her to drop some core subjects she isn't as interested in (English and maths) but overall it is so hard to work out what would suit best. Would be interested to hear from anyone who has done IB or at least deliberated over it with ADHD or something similar. Is the amount of free/independent study with A levels also a problem?

I’m an English teacher and teach both IB and A level. While I love the international nature and broad range of texts at IB I do think the standards are lower than A level equivalent. You whizz through lots of texts so I never feel I’ve really taught something in the same way as I do with A level. Having said that some students do thrive on it.

@Pickle1216 As I posted above we considered IB seriously for my DS. He has a severe processing disorder although did manage to get a reasonably good set of GCSE results. However with IB he would have had to take English where he only got a 6 and his chance of getting a strong grade even at SL would have been hard. A levels allowed him to focus on 3 of the subjects where he got a 9.

He values the free time he gets with 3 A levels. His learning difference means it takes longer for him to read and absorb information and the free periods in A level give him time to do his homework properly. It also gives him time to do his sport which really helps with his general well-being. He currently has extra SEN classes for one subject because of his processing issues and there was time to do this because he has plenty of free periods.

@Pickle1216

Great thread thank you! We are dealing with this dilemma at the moment. School offers IB only and we definitely prefer it in terms of content and overall philosophy. DD would like to stay where she is and do IB but is worried about workload despite being fairly academic because she has ADHD and everything takes her longer and causes stress. On the other hand, there is less independent study and that might possibly be a plus. A levels would allow her to drop some core subjects she isn't as interested in (English and maths) but overall it is so hard to work out what would suit best. Would be interested to hear from anyone who has done IB or at least deliberated over it with ADHD or something similar. Is the amount of free/independent study with A levels also a problem?

According to what I have read the IB it is much more work and will require much more organisation. I would not choose it if my child had special needs or it is already getting stressed with secondary school and GCSEs. There is plenty more studies/learning to do with university and work later on , so better not to put them off learning. Chose 3 subjects that.

Pickle. Last sentence meant to say. In your daughter's case I would go for the A levels.

I have taught both the IB and A Level. IB is a wonderful range of subjects but it did cause much more student stress than A-levels. It is also not great for a student who wants to specialise in Maths or languages.

I have a DS and I will choose a secondary that does A-levels for him. They are easier and universities value them the same as IB. In fact, some universities don't really understand the IB and can ask for higher comparative grades in IB than A-level.

I started on A levels, swapped onto IB as it was really being pushed on me as a "more prestiguous" qualification but ultimately swapped back and got 5 A top grade A levels instead - I would never have got a comparable score with the IB. As others have said, it's a great course for able all-rounders but if your child is highly specialist (in my case, in humanities but frankly shocking at STEM), they won't get a qualification representative of their talents.

Thanks all. Not really what i hoped to hear! But better not guess to have my fears confirmed. It’s difficult as she also doesn’t want to leave her friends and the stability that gives her. Thank goodness we don’t have to decide quite yet .

I taught A levels for 6 years and then IBDP/CP for the last 8 years or so. I've also been Head of Sixth form at a DP only school. The IB offers more breadth than A levels, if the centre offers a wide range of subjects. The DP is rigorous however if time management is a strength, it's more than doable. I've seen relatively weak students pass and gain the diploma- if your child has an idea of the university they might like to go, check what they require. Most well known will want 30+ plus points, the "good" one 35+ and the exceptional ones 40+. Passing score is 24 (with the CAS signed off, and the EE and TOK essay complete) I wouldn't say it's intellectual snobbery, it's more that in the UK the IB is nowhere near as well known as it is in other countries so people aren't sure about it.

What is the difference between IB/CP and IB/DP?.

I really like the IB and possibility of doing more subjects for DD but I just had a quick look at university requirements and some ask for 35 total with higher level maths 7, also high level chemistry. It seems to me that it may be to be lots of pressure, work and stress to get the required score for a good university. Not sure how much free time will she get, we still want her to go out with her friends and enjoy the last 2 years of secondary school. She is ambitious and academic but we don't want her to burnt out before she starts Uni.

It looks like A levels will be more secured/easier for university.

Seeing what DD likes and enjoys I was thinking of this combination:

If she chooses IB

High Level:
Maths
Chemistry
Spanish ( She speaks Spanish)

Standard level
DT
Geography
English

Will that be too much?

If she goes for A levels I was thinking: Maths or economics, DT, Chemistry.

She is relying on me for advice and I am relying on mumsnet as I didn't grow up in the UK.

Thank you for all the advice you have provided so far. It has been really helpful.

Also, does anybody have experience of Weald of Kent Sevenoaks or Tonbridge Sixth Form. I believe the Sevenoaks one will have a Sixth Form next year. They didn't have an open day this year unfortunately .

The DP is the diploma programme - so the full 6 subjects with all the extras mentioned. The CP is the careers programs where the student does less subjects, usually a careers based btech and doesn't have the same core requirements. It sounds like your daughter would do the DP. It is pretty intense, especially if the deadlines are at similar times.

@loverofpants

The DP is the diploma programme - so the full 6 subjects with all the extras mentioned. The CP is the careers programs where the student does less subjects, usually a careers based btech and doesn't have the same core requirements. It sounds like your daughter would do the DP. It is pretty intense, especially if the deadlines are at similar times.

Thank you. Yes, didn't even know an IB CP existed. The ones we looked at are the DP.