Shocked at university entry requirements

[BeardedMum]

So DD is applying for university next year and has started to look at which open days to attend. DD has good grades (I thought!) and wants to do Science subjects possibly physics or engineering.

When looking at university courses it looks like a lot of them wants all A’s or A*AA. I thought those were Camebridge grades. DD is more likely to be predicted AAB or maybe ABB. Are really all the university students straight A students?

Also what happens if your predicted grades are not enough to get an offer from your chosen university, but you manage to pull yourself up. Let’s say you are predicted ABB and manage to achieve AAA.

I am so confused. If it helps she got all 8s and 9s for GCSEs.

My perception of uni offers is that, very broadly, there are 3 categories.

Courses which 'select'. These are the ones which are oversubscribed with students predicted high grades - Oxbridge, Imperial are the prime examples for STEM. They can take their pick from students with good predicted or actual grades, may have extra criteria such as their own aptitude tests and interviews. There's probably little point applying without high predicted grades.

Courses which 'recruit' - ones which don't attract high tariff applicants, and are likely to end up with places in clearing. They want to attract students to fill their courses.

Those are the usual labels but in reality many very good courses will do a mix of both. Somewhere like Southampton or Manchester will seek to recruit high tariff applicants and their headline offers will reflect this. But they are likely to be the insurance choice for the Oxbridge and imperial applicants. So, they will probably need to also select from students with slightly lower grades, and on results day may drop a grade rather than fish from clearing, maybe admitting to the BEng with chance to trade up if you do well. Not sure, but if they do have places in clearing they may prefer candidates who applied to them. And so it goes down the rankings.

Great to hear he is really happy Lepit as that is indeed what we all hope for a happy young adult on the right course in the right place the them. DS is hoping to go to Exeter to study physics so I am reassured by your posts.
Bubbles I have seen an increase in Russell group uni's that interview across some subjects. I think it helps them select those they would be happy to drop a grade or two but also is a way to get students to seriously consider them ( perhaps as an Oxbridge back up) as going to the interview/ marketing sessions requires a bit more investment than putting an option on your choices.
Also noticed an increase in unconditionals e.g Nottingham so could be worth OP seeing which good universities are following that trend if DD is worried about actual grades due to teaching gaps.

Nottingham have dropped unconditionals as they aren't getting the right calibre of student. This was big news earlier on this year.

DD will be doing biomedical science in September, but was surprised when we looked at Manchester to hear that they interview for the course. She already has her A levels at the right grade, and Manchester took so long to reply to her application that she withdrew her application and accepted an offer from elsewhere (she wasn't fussed about Manchester anyway). I still don't understand why Manchester took so long though.

Note - the general engineering ranking can be a bit misleading because some very good engineering unis don't offer it, and some unis only offer it. That list upthread is not indicative of 'which unis are generally best for engineering'! Take a look at the tables for the different fields to get an idea of whether it's overall a strong engineering department.

(And that's before you get to which rankings tables to trust most...)

Afaik Birmingham is now the only red brick type uni with a strategy of unconditional offers - and they're probably of little use for the OPs DD as they will be for applicants with good predicted grades.

Courses which offer unconditionally against low predicted grades are (IMO) probably best avoided in the main.

I humbly suggest that the link I posted earlier is a starting point not the end of research. Not clear that OP knew those league tables exist,. The overall rating tends to be ordered by descending offer, so tables are quick way to find the range of exam results expected and other general features.

OP also mentioned physics for her DD. League table for physics. Smack in middle of that table = Loughborough, with typical offer = ABB. There are plenty of opportunities for ABB students to do physics.

The links are really useful thank you.I am soaking it all up and will show DD once her exams are over.

Afaik Birmingham is now the only red brick type uni with a strategy of unconditional offers

This must be for engineering or physics only, as anecdotally I can say they are very stringent for other courses.

My daughter, and two of her friends applied, one for law, one for history, one for maths, all got conditional offers. They had all received unconditional from other unis, my daughter for law from reading.

The girl who wished to do maths, got one grade lower than anticipated, and this was the first b she'd ever got, she was straight a or a star throughout and they dropped her. She ended up at a much much lower tiered uni through clearing, and it was a very painful morning when she tried to get that, literally it was a race . And she's now doing her masters at UCL.

During my daughters time there she didn't meet anyone who got an unconditional that she was aware of, but the students she hung with were medicine, Chem eng, law, economics etc.

So I wouldn't say Birmingham have a strategy of it, I'd say it's more course dependent. My daughter was predicted AA A and got a conditional offer dependent on her getting three As, as did the other girls.

Sorry that's a star a star, A prediction and still didn't get an unconditional.

This must be for engineering or physics only, as anecdotally I can say they are very stringent for other courses.

No, actually it's rather the reverse - their courses which require specific subject knowledge and to hit the ground running (maths would also be in this category) are less likely to give unconditionals, it's more the ones like philosophy where they were giving unconditionals - to applicants with very good predicted grades but not the same subject knowledge.

The numbers of unconditionals by various unis are known, Birmingham is definitely the only redbrick which really went for this. Probably not the majority of their offers but a significant number. They may be backing off from it following bad publicity.

Looking at General Engineering is a very restricted list. There are twice as many universities offering Civil Engineering for example. Add in the other precise engineering degrees and you see a picture of the top 20. You can become Chartered after a BEng but it takes longer. You may not need a foundation if you drop to BEng. AAB might well be fine for MEng anyway. Just look at possible courses and qualifications.

Some Uni's advertise AAA* grades but in reality if a child gets AAB they may be let in if they have been offered a place already.
Half the battle with my son was for him to get the teachers to give him the predicted grades to apply for the Uni he wanted as his end of year exams were graded lower (C's).
He went to all the revision classes, asked and did extra homework, worked hard and they gave him a 3 A's prediction & he has been offered a place.
I think that it's really important that she pins down the course she wants pretty quickly and what grades she needs and communicates this to her teachers and gets them on board.

Thanks for starting the thread OP as I was thinking the same as you. The entry requirements look scary. My advice is to talk to the school sooner rather then later about your DCs likely outcome. My DS had target grades BBB at beginning of y12, but his form tutor thinks he should be aiming for As as he has the aptitude. She also said the school will be strategic in their predicted grades that they give to UCAS depending on which Unis he applies to.

please also make sure that schools are aware of the taster weeks and weekends that a lot of universities are offering to girls interested in STEM subjects. My nieces have both been on several, at Russell group , one is half way through AL the other hasn't taken GCSES yet! Some universities are it seems very keen on persuading and catching them young. Good thing too IMO.

I'm not sure how much being 'known ' to a department could help if there was a problem with final grades, or indeed for initial offers, but presumably the universities are running these weeks and weekends with a view to spotting potential as well as raising awareness of STEM courses