Shocked at university entry requirements

[BeardedMum]

So DD is applying for university next year and has started to look at which open days to attend. DD has good grades (I thought!) and wants to do Science subjects possibly physics or engineering.

When looking at university courses it looks like a lot of them wants all A’s or A*AA. I thought those were Camebridge grades. DD is more likely to be predicted AAB or maybe ABB. Are really all the university students straight A students?

Also what happens if your predicted grades are not enough to get an offer from your chosen university, but you manage to pull yourself up. Let’s say you are predicted ABB and manage to achieve AAA.

I am so confused. If it helps she got all 8s and 9s for GCSEs.

BeardedMum I think the point you make about experiencing university is a valid one. DD's BF has done very well out of his apprenticeship but low wage at the start meant he was forced to stay at home so he has never had the experience of living on his own. He has never left the small town we live in.

Apprenticeships are by their nature vocational but for them to have worth you need to stay in that vocation.

So why is a degree from one university worth more than from another if two people have the same A level grades, achieve the same Uni grades and it’s accredited? Does that not mean the degree have to meet a certain official standard?

Maybe some exceed the standard?

Degrees are not externally validated. The universities award degree classifications as they see fit.

For example, there are no national exams for physics.

So, physics degrees are not all equal.

I personally wouldn't worry too much about the teachers.

I did no biology, chemistry and maths a-levels. Yes, teachers can make a difference but you basically just need to learn the text books. Teachers can't cover everything anyway so she needs to be memorising the text books on her own time. It's more about learning in your own time than what you learn in lessons.

Well thanks for insinuating my ds only got into Exeter as they needed to 'fill places'. Funnily enough he's actually reasonably bright

There will be unis offering abb or bbb
She needs to research to find them
Then she can include in her 5 choices at least one that offers lower than the highest. Typical offers are listed.

Also some might offer uncondional . So it will be fine if she gets bbb for example if she goes down that route.

www.northampton.ac.uk/courses/engineering-bsc/

See requirements
DdE

So there will be unis offering lower.
Research is all important

Heriot watt offers BBB

www.hw.ac.uk/study/uk/undergraduate/engineering-physics.htm

So no not all unis offer AAA even for engineering
Some Bbc
Some ccc
Etc

I want my DD to have the whole university experience

Is it what she wants too?

Well obviously it’s her choice. Are you implying something? 🙄

It’s common knowledge some universities cannot fill places. Some universities have better reputations for some subjects above others. Of course they lower grades to fill courses. Courses that don’t fill up are cut. Stem in some universities don’t fill up and MFL doesn’t either. That’s why MFL courses are reduced. I’m amazed anyone takes this personally. I would just be pleased DC got a place on the course they wanted where they wanted. Whether it’s bums on seats or not, who cares?

There are plenty of Engineering courses that are not AAA. If they were all AAA they wouldn’t have many students on them! With Engineering, consider which engineering discipline is most likely to suit and then look at the guides and league tables. Kent won’t be high up and don’t just follow the herd. Be choosy within reason and match likely attainment to somewhere that’s aspirational for the discipline. Don’t just go somewhere because it’s easy and your mates are going.

There has been loads of comment on here about universities giving places where students have well below the asking grades and Exeter is one as they start with very high grade requirements in the first place.

I’m sure some courses interview some students but the vast majority do not interview and state this quite clearly. Oxbridge and some courses are always going to interview but these days few do routinely because of time, logistics and cost.

Those Northampton and Herriot Watt courses are BSc - I doubt they have the full CEng Accreditation that MEng courses have. (IEng is a lower level, and there are also 'partial' accreditations for BEng)

This is the IET accreditation list, other institutes will presumably have similar lists.
https://www.theiet.org/media/4030/accreditedprogrammess_weblist.xlsm

That doesn't mean they're not worth doing, but all engineering degrees are not the same.

@BeardedMum it may be worth your DD looking at courses with a foundation year if she has concerns over the teaching for her A levels. As an example:

www.sheffield.ac.uk/prospectus/courseDetails.do?id=H3012020

Entry requirement is BBB-BBC

The foundation year is to bring students up to the level for starting the degree course.

Courses do get dropped if they prove to be unpopular. DD is on a course of just one and the course has been dropped for subsequent years which means that DD wont be able to do a year in industry as there wont be a cohort to join on return.

I disagree about your point on teachers coral13.
DD really struggled with chemistry A level at first, and was working at a C to start with. She had a fantastic chemistry teacher who was able to explain things to her in a way that the books couldn't. She ended up with a high A.

I am extremely proud of him and that he chose Exeter and was accepted as it seems to have a very good reputation, and despite it being 300 miles away (sob) he is extremely happy there, which is all that matters .

Yes... science and maths aren't a matter of 'memorising books', the concepts need to be understood and put into practice. A very able student may be able to self-teach (DH had a crap chemistry teacher, taught himself and a couple of classmates ... a lot of work and he's a really good chemist - we met on our degree) but most pupils do need teaching.

@GnomeDePlume, thanks for the link. I suppose I expect her to get back on track next year and achieve good grades again but it seems most universities offer based on predicted grades?
She thinks she has done well in the mocks so far so fingers crossed.

We hired a tutor 3 weeks ago for chemistry and she says she has learnt more in those sessions (2 a week) than the whole year😟

A levels are not just about memorising the subject. It's about truly understanding concepts. From what both my DDs have said (both chemistry scientists albeit from different angles) chemistry was the hardest of their A levels. A higher grade A level does really need good teaching focused on achieving that grade.

Chemistry is my subject too, I think more than any other it requires comprehension of abstract concepts and mathematical ability and memory. You can't remember everything unless you understand it.

Offers will be based on predicted grades but it is also up to your DD to decide how much salt she wants to take with the predictions when it comes to applications.

Encourage her to really do her course research. Also try and fit in as many open days as possible. The course talks really helped DD to firm up her ideas and also formulate her back up plan. At one stage she had a plan listed out by potential grades in each subject.

"DD is more likely to be predicted AAB or maybe ABB"

Did teachers already tell your DD exact those letters, what has your DD been told?

University of Bradford, smack in middle of league tables, Mech Engineering, offer = BBC. Exeter (10th in league table) typical offer = ABB. Plenty of opportunities, imho.

www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings?s=General%20Engineering