The DfE needs to stop the farce of compulsory Maths and English GCSE resits

[noblegiraffe]

Another year, another 124,560 students failing their GCSE maths resit and 99672 students failing their GCSE English resit.

Colleges have been saying for years that this government policy is a failure, that students are entered into cycle of resits and failures that does nothing to boost their confidence or enhance their qualifications.

If you get a 3 in maths or English GCSE you have to resit GCSE. If you get a 2 or below, you can take other qualifications like functional maths instead.

The government argues that GCSE is the key to opening doors and as many students as possible should be resitting to get that opportunity. But wouldn’t a qualification that they are actually likely to pass be better?

The resit pass rate for English dropped from 35.5% to 33.1% this year and for maths dropped from 37% to 22.7%. This is not an improving picture!

www.tes.com/news/gcse-results-english-and-maths-pass-rates-drops

Oldbird, Alexander My DS is Autistic.

Despite the portraying of glass ceiling of grade 2-3 for Autistic children attained @ level 6 in both English Language and Literature, albeit a year late
If I had kept him at his old school and he was forced to take GCSEs at 16 I doubt he would have even attained at level 2 in English. in Maths a level 1 if lucky

Of a glass ceiling for Autistic children of grade 2-3 in GCSEs.

Let's talk
I don't think there's a glass ceiling for all autistic teens in literacy exams. All autistic kids are different after all.
My DS would have been fine in a coursework based exam process as he can actually write very nicely, it just takes him a long time (yes he already gets his extra time).

Those figures on Maths resit passes are pretty depressing. DD did resit number 3 this year, 2 D’s previous attempts. As she hasn’t got her result yet there is still a tiny little bit of hope that she might have passed but she didn’t come out of any of the papers looking like she thought she’d done ok.

She has Dyscalculia and I don’t know if she’ll ever get it. Luckily for her a good portfolio and understanding admissions Tutor has got her on a degree course in a way that has bypassed the requirement for the Maths. She’s been admitted onto Certificate of Higher Education and just has to do an extra module of 1.5k words then can go onto year 2 of the degree. Can not put into words how relieved I am it wasn’t dependent on the Maths resit .

DS is great at maths but I would be more pleased about her getting a 4 than I would him getting a 9 as Maths GCSE has been my nemesis with DD since year 10. 3 different tutors, school gave her lots of help, as did college. DH, her partner and DH have all spent hours helping her this year.

My daughter is also autistic & she just got Grade 9 for her English Lang & Grade 8 for Lit.

No one is saying there is a ceiling. Just that the current format is not appropriate for all.

Dd did Edexel & could write a theatre review great for her as Musical Theatre is her passion in life).

Leaving this here:

www.tes.com/news/gcse-student-pleads-dont-forget-me-damian-hinds

Alexander

Well done to your dd, I bet you are really proud.
You know me under another nn, I post about my dd/music.

I know your dd is bright but do you know if the entrance criteria for MT/Dance is low in comparison to University.
Atm, as far as we can see the conservatoires aren't asking for too much, I wondered if it was the same.
Last I looked it was 3 GCSE's (old A-C) and 2 A levels A -E

AlexanderHamilton

No one is saying there is a ceiling. Just that the current format is not appropriate for all.

Teachers said that when the new exams came in, but we were just accused of whinging.

Piggy

I posted the same upthread, it really did make me weep.

Don't know if this has been mentioned already, but why can't they have both options? if you fail English/Maths, option to either a)Resit b) Do functional skills. Rather than stipulating one or the other.

For the BA Hons it’s around 120 UCAS points but many do the Level 6 diploma where there are no entry requirements other than audition.

This diploma can then be topped up to a full degree by a 1 year distance learning course.

Oh I didn't see that romany. She is local to me.

Ironically, her mum works in G and T provision and the ex head of the school she attends is a free school Tory arse licker!

Piggy

It's good that her message is getting through, I hope they listen and what an ambassador for the lower levels.
I bet her parents are so proud of her, I'm welling up again and sharing the link with as many as I can

Her mum is very nice !

Alexander

That's interesting and sounds like there are ways in for those without GCSE's.
It's quite good to hear that some institutions don't insist on min level 4's.

Piggy
That is so lovely, I do wish her so well.
Thank you for sharing.

Sorry to go on about this. But Ds2 with no sen is 2+ for English and Maths going into year 11. If he ends up with Gcse grade 2 or 3 this time next year, we a parents will celebrate is amazing achievements.
But if evey fe and future employer only wants 4 or 5 and filters out appliciants on those, whats does Ds2 do?
If 1 to 3 are passes but you cant get a job or course to get you a job honestly whats the bloody point. He has wasted 11 years of his life stuck in an environment designed for bright kids. Knowing he will never be good enough. Christ 33% get 1 to 3, at this rate 33% are going to be umeployed.
When I left school in 1985 you could leave with nothing and get a YTS and learn on the job. Now if you dont have a grade 5 you cant empty bloody dustbins
It's a bloody joke, and it kids like mine who are the butt of it.
All because if you dont meet some privately educated Oxbridge educated tw+ts idea of what an ideal student is.
I despair.

Doesn't matter if you all say 1 to 3 is a pass. If you cant get a job or in further education, because the adults, who decide your future, deem it not good enough. Then surely it is or might as well be a fail.
The claims that they are passes reminds me of below:-
'
1968 RL Challenge Cup, famous watersplash final, Wakefield score a try in last seconds of game. Kick in front of post to win the cup. Up steps Don Fox , a great player, he sadly misses. Afterwards David Coleman tells Don Fox that he has won man of the match award, does it make up for the missed kick? Coleman asks, Don Fox replys "NO, NO NOT REALLY"
Personally I think saying a 1 to 3 is a pass to kids who get them, is exactly like asking poor Don if.winning man of match makes up for lossing cup.

You are actually agreeing with me user although you don't seem to realise it.

I would say you probably could empty dustbins ... but not til you are 18.

When I left school you probably took 8 O Levels.

Someone could have passed 6 not necessarily Maths and or English O Levels.

Then took 3 A Levels from the choice of what O Levels they had passed. From then a degree and or professional qualification.

Now you take 8 GCSEs. If you don't get English and Maths that's it. No A Levels, no degree, no professional qualification. You can't in a lot of cases move on to a trade/vocational course. That's it.

DS1 has left college because of it. He got U in English and F or G in maths 3 times and had enough of it. Function skills etc is all well and good but he just saw it as further evidence of failure, of being in the "thick" group etc. He never got more than a level 1 BTEC because of the amount of time he effectively wasted on resits. I'm all for improving results but not at all costs.

piggy
Yes I probably am. I think I will leave this thread now. I have come to realise, more and more, that mumsnet education threads of all colours isn't for the likes of me. It is only really bothered with middle class high flyers.
Try discussing anything else and it isn't interested. As a dad of 2 middle and low achievers I have nothing to add.
Actually it just makes you depressed.
Bye

I think for some people English/Maths can be a huge stumbling block.
For example not passing English
doesn't mean you cannot string a sentence together or write a report or have any difficulties in every day life. It just means you didn't pass GCSE English.

As I have said some of the brightest and successful people I know failed English O Level.

Dp failed English. But taught himself to pass a professional qualification whilst holding down a full time job with a 2 hour commute in 1 year he had passed all the exams which normally you do over a 5.5 year period.

I would like to ask how having a qualification in English is relevant

Should have said

As I have said some of the brightest and successful people I know failed English O Level.

But because it wasn't seen as a problem they went on to do A Levels, a degree, a professional qualification.

They might not have passed English but were brilliant at other subjects.

One boy in my class at primary had real difficulties with English. Brilliant at Maths and science.

I know he didn't pass English o level
His name came up in passing a few years ago. He is head of a research team trying to find a cure for a certain disease.

Imagine what would have happened if be was a child now. He wouldn't be able to get a job as a lab assistant.

I found only one college in our area that allowed ds on to a course without having passed English or Maths. The course is 2 years but if he doesn't pass English by the end if this year he can part qualify but won't be able to do the 2nd year and fully qualify.

I doubt an English GCSE will have any bearing on how well he would do the job but it will stop him being able to qualify to do the job.

Are children who are still at school allowed to take Functional Skills, or must they be made to try for a GCSE first?

I'm working with a child who is likely not going to get a 3 or 4 in GCSE, though we are working really hard and I'm doing everything possible to get her to that stage. But it means she has to sit through classes that are irrelevant to her level, even in the bottom set, as she really needs mostly one-to-one work on the real basics of the number system, etc.

It would be better in some ways if she could be prepared for an exam that would have more meaning to her.

But I don't know if that's allowed, for funding reasons? (It's a private school, if that matters).

She's on course for 5-7 in all her other subjects apart from science. She would also like to do A-levels in some of those subjects, but I think it will be hard to find a school that will let her do that, as most of the A-level colleges don't do functional skills.

Private schools can do whatever they like because they are not beholden to the league tables or DfE rules.

In my state school we enter bottom set for an entry level maths qualificafion (level 1) as well as GCSE so that they have the chance to sit a qualification where they can answer a reasonable proportion of the questions.