The DfE needs to stop the farce of compulsory Maths and English GCSE resits

[noblegiraffe]

Another year, another 124,560 students failing their GCSE maths resit and 99672 students failing their GCSE English resit.

Colleges have been saying for years that this government policy is a failure, that students are entered into cycle of resits and failures that does nothing to boost their confidence or enhance their qualifications.

If you get a 3 in maths or English GCSE you have to resit GCSE. If you get a 2 or below, you can take other qualifications like functional maths instead.

The government argues that GCSE is the key to opening doors and as many students as possible should be resitting to get that opportunity. But wouldn’t a qualification that they are actually likely to pass be better?

The resit pass rate for English dropped from 35.5% to 33.1% this year and for maths dropped from 37% to 22.7%. This is not an improving picture!

www.tes.com/news/gcse-results-english-and-maths-pass-rates-drops

cakes no teacher wants to leave perfectly capable children on the scrap heap. We also don’t want to persistently enter them for exams that they won’t pass. Thousands upon thousands of children.

Autism is indeed relevant to the discussion, as other SEN. Because ASD it is not intellectual impairment as such, but a different processing style, different mechanism. Autistic people need different, adapted teaching methods early on to succeed. But often it is diagnosed late, so DD for example was failed by her primary and got 96 in Maths and English SATs, while Educational Psychologist assessed her ability as 61%-tile (above average of 50%), in average range, she should be getting SATs in 105 range. But with 96 they put her in bottom set and on the 'flightpath' to nowhere. This is discrimination.

You would think potential depends on IQ, but then again, the actual measure of IQ is also affected by the autistic style and the 'measuring' method, so CAT for example puts autistic DC at a disadvantage, because there is no research whatsoever as to how it affects DC with ASD. As a result they get lower CAT scores due to test format, especially computer adaptive, with a score that in effect caps their progress due to artificially suppressed flightpath. Instead of putting SEN provisions in place early and accelerating progress after a set-back pre-diagnosis, they leave DC to rot on the low flightpath, which leads to a 3. Now you argue they should be left to their misery all together.

Families with SEN children and disadvantaged families are also taxpayers and voters. The education system should work for their children, give them opportunity. But the policy in reality is such that GCSE are designed to fail 40% and teachers salaries are linked to the success of the top sets, so they don't give a dam about children in the lower 40%, even if they are there for being failed by the system in first place.

Surely all DC with a 'normal' (forgive the word) IQ, above 80 or 70 should be getting a good GCSE pass and teachers should be penalised for failing those children, so they would support and accelerate the progress of those likely to get a 3 early on, to get them to a secure a 4 or 5.

It isn't the fault of the DofE that employers and most colleges ask for maths and English GCSE's as part of their admission criteria.
I don't understand this, especially if the course/job doesn't require them.

What alternative is there for employers? They need employees who have at least basic levels of numeracy and literacy, if only to read warning signs/instructions, etc. That's why I've long advocated a lifestyle skills type of certificate/diploma confirming at a person has achieved the minimum standard where they can do basic things in the workplace. GCSE's in English and Maths aren't this, but employers need something.

teachers salaries are linked to the success of the top sets, so they don't give a dam about children in the lower 40%

This is not only bollocks, it is also incredibly offensive to teachers.

pacer I think the qualification you are looking for is called ‘Functional skills’. Level 2 functional maths/English are perfectly good qualifications which test the skills employers say they want. Lots of places accept it as an equivalent.

But only students who get a 2 or below at GCSE are allowed to sit them. Students who get a 3 have to resit GCSE.

I did some supply doing maths resits.

I asked why students on a 2 year course had to resit at every opportunity rather than having a year or 2 year long course - apparently that is policy.

What alternative is there for employers? They need employees who have at least basic levels of numeracy and literacy, if only to read warning signs/instructions, etc.

Functional skills literacy and numeracy.

Don't get me wrong I love maths but for most jobs you don't need calculus.

Employers can also devise their own tests.

I did a summer working for National Express, everyone started by doing numeracy, literacy and geography tests.

This was things like reading timetables, knowing what time someone needed to leave to make a connection, where the major airports are.

I realise that not every employer could do this, but maybe they could buy off the shelf tests

cakesandtea

We don't all think like that, if fact I think most don't.

On the placement above there was one student who clashed with just about everyone. In a maths class she said, "finished" in half the tmime it was taking others, I looked at her work and she had finished, and everything on it was perfect. I explained iteration to her and she spent the rest of the lesson manually calculating the square root of 5.

I flagged it with the staff that she obviously had ability if she cope with iteration.

Also cakes

One of the other students said in a lesson, "I get that, I never understood that at school" that's what I as a teacher live for, when the penny drops for someone. There is no feeling like it.

Compulsory re sits make a nice profit margin for the exam boards, though, OP.

I'm AWFUL at maths and always have been, even with a consistent tutor throughout my primary school years. Yet English was my thing and something I really enjoyed. I have an English GCSE but not maths. All the uni courses I want to apply for need GCSE maths grade c or above and for 3 years since leaving secondary school have been unable to meet that criteria :( it means no university will accept me (even with all my other relevant qualifications). I want to study veterinary science for reference. (Also considering law!) I have a level 3 extended diploma and also a higher education diploma in psychology and criminology.

DD (dyslexic) just got a B in English Language and an F in English Literature. I was bowled over by the B, but the gap almost doesn't make sense. I think she really can't deal with complex multi-layered poetry and textual analysis, although she is [now] quite a competent reader.

She just resat Maths Foundation for the second time, this time getting a high 3. She drops small mistakes all over the place, but she is very consistent, manages the whole paper and actually is entirely competent in Maths after many years of struggling. It is going to depress her horribly to have to take it all over again. She's really had great maths teaching to get this far but of course the rest of the world doesn't really see it.

I have clients who only have "functional skills" English
actually at least one is illiterate
they earn good money using their physical and coordination skills

these resits are just CRUEL
the son of a friend got top grades in all of his creative 6th form subjects
but failed his maths again
WHY does he need that silly GCSE when his income will come from drawing ?

Noble

Is the functional maths level 2 in any way similar to OCR level 2 also equivalent to a GCSE pass.

If so, I can agree that these are not only acceptable by employers and colleges for further and higher ed courses, but also to teach (post compulsory).

Romany OCR level 2 is a functional skills exam.

Other exam boards are available.

I'm just wondering if it's across all undergrad entrance criteria for a level 2/ GCSE in Maths.
If it doesn't list Maths, does that mean you don't need it.
I've seen one that just says so many GCSE's but doesn't say including Maths and English.

Couldn't agree more.Don't know what to do. Am really upset for my DS who has so mnay problems and really went through hel to take these exams - and what now. ?? I don't even know where to start. Do I put him back through it and watch him fail again. And again? So does this mean he cannot study anythign else? Or get any sort of job?

Irony is, these exams which cause so much expense for the tax payer, illness and distress to our kids, are worthless in our local EU employment and future studies market post March 2019.

EU Mutual recognition of qualifications ends with brexit.

Universities need to start recognising functional skills as a relevant qualification unless you’re going to be studying something where very high levels of maths or English are required too

My son has to resit English (got a 6 in lit but 3 in lang, seems loads did) but I've just found out the other local secondary school isn't making kids who didn't get a 4 resit English? Going to confirm if that's right because I thought all schools had too resit

You have to get a 4 in Either Lit or Lang to not have to resit by Government rules.
But
Many employers will be asking for Eng Lang, so schools not making kids pass Lang may be doing them a disservice in the long run.

My son is autistic & despite being highly intelligent & talented in music & drama & on course got a Grade 8 in maths he will struggle to pass GCSE English.

As others have said, it’s the structure of the exam that children like him struggle with.

Unfortunately he needs at least a Grade 4/5 to get onto a drama course.

I don’t think that a functional qualification is putting them on the scrap heap. It would actually give them a chance to acquire the basic skills they need for their working life.

Some odd discrepancies in grades for English Language and Literature here . I found it confusing ,it may bring the constituency of some marking in to question. This being to point out how grades for the two English GCSE can be so widely different for some pupils !

As a parent of a so to be year 11, who bless him is stuck on 2+ for English and Maths, we dread this. He just can't deal with the new harder exams, but he is brilliant with kids and animals. Got lovely thank you notes from his work experience in a primary school.

I, personally blame Politian's and the likes of mumsnet, not teachers and FE colleges Why? Because they and most on here are only obsessed with high achievers, how many blood threads have there been about Grade 9, FFS.
These stupid plans where only ever about M Gove's personal vanity, and trying to get sodding private schools to drop Igcses. No one really cares about kids like mine, or else spending on teaching support and vocational training would not been slashed.
But the Tories only care about posh schools and attending Oxbridge/Rg universities.

user1471450935 to you and your son. In decades of working in this, I have never seen it so weaponised, toxic, dodgily scrutinised and a great money spinner (@MichaelRosen has much more on this) and just plain wrong.

You have to get Eng Lang not to have to do a resit. Eng Lit or the combined one do not count.

Also remember FE colleges do not get funding to do the Maths & Eng resits. So many have run out of money in the last few years. They do however get fined if 5% of students run away from Eng and Maths.

No, you don’t have to resit if you get Lit but not Lang. However, if you fail both you have to resit Lang to meet the conditions of funding, you can’t resit Lit.

Noble Good to hear that has changed since two years ago.