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Secondary education

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Original poster

Do you agree the school completely messed up ?

133 replies

Alonggoesthetit · 19/04/2017 15:19

On Mother's Day, we were told that my fil was terminally ill and only had weeks to live. One of his last wishes was to see the kids (13 and 10) before he got too ill. We have organised to go on the Tuesday and to come back on the Thursday. Eldest 's school is very strict about absence so I called the attendance officer and explained that my father in law was dying that he wanted to see his grand kids a last time before things got really bad. It's relevant to say that ds had 100 % attendance, he never missed a day at school even when ill.

I was confident that this 2 days and a half absence was going to be accepted. I picked ds up at lunchtime on the Tuesday. I saw him and he still didn't have the authorisation. He got told by the secretary that if he couldn't find his head of year, he had to get his authorisation from the deputy head.

He did that but got told no I won't sign that. Ds was tearful, I was completely stunned. He invited to the conference room to talk. I explained that ds's grand dad was dying and that we all needed to go to spend some time with him. It was one of his last wishes. The deputy head refused to authorise the Wednesday and Thursday off...he only authorised the Tuesday afternoon, suggested we go then come back in the evening (it's in Devon)... He said that if ds didn't come back, he will be given 15 hours after school, we will be fined, he will be considered a truant.

At that point, ds was really upset and I was shocked. We went to meet dh then we left for Devon. All we talked about was the situation at school when we should have been trying to spend quality time with my fil. My father in law was to ds, don't worry go back to school, it's shocking but I don't want you to be in trouble because of me. Ds was also adamant he was going back to school as he didn't want to be in trouble.

So we went, we caught an early train and ds was back at school on time. I left my dh and my other ds there.

Things went from bad to worst for my fil and he passed away in the night Thursday to Friday..2 days after we last saw him.

I complaint to the school and we are going to meet with the school this week. I don't know what I want from this thread just acknowledgment of our treatment. We have been treated dreadfully ? We had the right to make my ds miss school isn't it ?

OP posts:
Astro55 · 20/04/2017 09:38

You can refuse detentions and there's nothing they can do about it

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 09:38

I'm reading more and more stories of academies and draconian approaches based on them being in charge - end of.

I thought ds and my experience was an isolated case but sadly it seems they really are very autocratic institutions with no flexibility for reality to exist.

Traalaa · 20/04/2017 09:39

They can Astro! At my DS's quite liberal comp kids who don't go to detentions just get longer detentions, then Saturday detentions, then if they fail to turn up are excluded.

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 09:40

EFA will only investigate if school doesn't follow the complaint procedure correctly.
Not if they investigate and find themselves totally correct in what they did!

Traalaa · 20/04/2017 10:00

Sounds like a nightmare for you youarenot. I hope your son's okay now and that you are too. I have heard similar stories about our local Academy, including quite a few kids who have left due to stress, etc.Sad

MovingtoParadise · 20/04/2017 10:05

I'm very sorry for your loss Flowers

I think the school governors will have (reasonable) questions that you will need to be prepared for. I'm sure you've got reasons for this.

In your original post you said you'd been informed on Mother's Day about his terminal illness. That's 4 weeks ago with a two week Easter holiday in it. They're going to ask what prevented you visiting in the last month and necessitated you visiting in school time.

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 10:07

My ds is extremely intelligent. He has asd and MLD - basically they wanted the kids who would give them a return on their investment in results - that's not my ds!

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 10:09

Paradise further up thread this was cleared up. This happened a few weeks ago and found out Sunday and they went the following Tuesday. Since then FIl passed away, complaint was made and she's waiting for meeting as school shut for holidays.

MaisyPops · 20/04/2017 10:09

Astro55
You can't refuse detentions unilaterally. Fact. If you want to refuse detentions then the school just moves through the behaviour policy with the child. If that means being suspended then it means suspension.
The laws say schools can use detentions and don't need parental consent.
They just have to make it clear that school policy includes detentions. That way if parents want to think their kid is too precious for detection they know not to send their kid there.

Can see how some kids are under the impression that sanctions never apply to them when you have adults denying the law.

MovingtoParadise · 20/04/2017 10:10

Oh good. That makes sense then.

prh47bridge · 20/04/2017 10:18

I haven't read the whole thread. However, looking at your posts, I would definitely lodge a complaint about the deputy head's behaviour on the following grounds:

  • He said it was illegal to authorise this absence. That is wrong. Absence can be authorised in exceptional circumstances. The school has discretion to decide what is exceptional. He chose not to exercise that discretion but clearly it would not have been illegal for him to do so. Whether or not he should have authorised the full 2.5 days is another matter. Personally I think he was unreasonable not to authorise at least 1 or 1.5 days given the circumstances.
  • He said you would be fined if you took your son out of school unauthorised. Without knowing which LA you are in it is impossible to be sure but that is almost certainly a lie. The school has to follow the LA's code of conduct on fines. Most require at least 5 unauthorised days of in one term or 7 over two terms before a fine can be imposed.
  • He said your son would be regarded as a truant. Whilst that is technically true it was a very insensitive thing to say to you and your son given the circumstances.
  • He said the school would impose 15 hours detention. That is clearly excessive. It is more than the amount of teaching time your son would have missed. I doubt the school would actually have followed through on this.

It sounds to me like he bullied you and your son. I would make that the focus of your complaint.

iseenodust · 20/04/2017 10:21

I am sorry for your loss and the way you were all treated.
Deputy head completely screwed up. I would ask to see the school pastoral guidelines and also the curriculum for PHSE which should cover emotional well-being and mental health. Then politely ask how the DT's decision & threats embodied any of that.

SparkleSoiree · 20/04/2017 10:30

I'm very sorry for your loss. Flowers

I'm also sorry that your DS is so stressed about ensuring no rules are broken at school. I understand about following rules but kids shouldn't be scared or anxious in that way.

But I have to ask, if the passing of a family member, parent at that, does not construe exceptional circumstances, then what the heck does?!

MaisyPops · 20/04/2017 10:37

SparkleSoiree
The school have behaved awfully. I'd be willing to bet that it's probably staffed with inexperienced leaders who need a crib sheet to make decisions because they lack the sense to use the discretion that they have.

They probably justify it to themselves as "being tough". It's a total joke and the OP absolutely needs to go through formal complaints proceedings for it.

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 10:46

My mum has been a teacher for over 40 years. She said the past decade has seen leaders come in having gone on leadership courses who do run a school like an office full of 100/1000's staff. She said the same thing about them following manuals!
She said gone are the days of HT etc being experienced teachers who can run schools through knowledge and experience (partly because the job is so difficult nowadays many in their 50's don't want to take that on) and now you get 30 year olds as leaders who have only been qualified for a few years and who's sole leadership experience is a course. She said leaders are great at paperwork nowadays - very few are the inspirational motivating teachers who've take the next step up the ladder as a natural career progression.

But I've found schools in general have lost their pastoral care of the staff.

Astro55 · 20/04/2017 10:48

*Schools can punish pupils if they behave badly.

Examples of punishments (sometimes called ‘sanctions’) include:

a telling-off
a letter home
removal from a class or group
confiscating something inappropriate for school , eg mobile phone or MP3 player
detention

IF THEY BEHAVE BADLY

prh47bridge · 20/04/2017 10:54

IF THEY BEHAVE BADLY

I'm not sure where this is copied from but schools have the right to regard taking unauthorised time off school as "behaving badly" and impose sanctions. I think the deputy head's threat of 15 hours detention was unreasonable and unlikely to be followed through but the school could have imposed a punishment if the OP's child had not returned after the authorised half day off.

MaisyPops · 20/04/2017 11:02

Astro55
I'm not saying the school was right in this situation. They weren't. They acted appallingly.

I'm staying fact which is that schools do not need parental consent to run detentions as long as it is clear that detentions are part of their behaviour policy. That's the law.

You said parents can outright refuse detentions and schools can't do anything. That's not true.

It is an entirely separate issue to the OP situation where she should be taking formal complaints against the school for the way they classified this absence and their subsequent actions.

RaspberryIce · 20/04/2017 11:02

The mind boggles at the thought of a school giving 15 hours detention because they were spending time with their dying grandpa.

youarenotkiddingme · 20/04/2017 11:05

From what I've seen locally Raspberry it doesn't surprise me - sadly.

Some common sense and compassion has completely gone out of the window in some schools.

Ironically the one ds now attends who is far more relaxed has better behaviour and better attendance and better results.

And by relaxed I don't mean soft - they have high eclecticism and clear and consistent consequences.

RaspberryIce · 20/04/2017 11:21

The teachers at dd's school seem quite reasonable so far, although I suppose you might not know until something had happened to test this out. Eldest is only year 8 though so we'll see.

RaspberryIce · 20/04/2017 11:22

Actually i really don't think they'd behave like this though. They seem normal and nice

Original poster
Alonggoesthetit · 20/04/2017 14:56

I have checked for the 3rd time their policy in attendance and punctuality. I haven't found anything on compassionate leave or authorised absence for extreme circumstances. So unless you are dead, you have to attend school.

OP posts:
MaisyPops · 20/04/2017 14:59

Alonggoesthetit
That is awful!
Out of interest is it a free school or part of a large academy chain? Those types of school seem to be worse for things like that.

The thing to remember is that there are about 15 different attendance codes which they WILL use e.g. if they want a child educating off site/school trip/ illness/ medical app / other authorised/dual registration etc.
It sounds like they'll be using the other codes with the kids it suits them to not have on site

Original poster
Alonggoesthetit · 20/04/2017 15:07

It's a big academy yes ! I don't understand the attendance code system you are mentioning !

OP posts:
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