Is this punishment 'fair enough' and normal practice?

[youarenotkiddingme]

So a child in yr 7 is walking through school with friends.

See's older pupils wearing something non uniform policy. It's very obviously not in keeping with the school. The school have a massive image complex and drum it into the pupils.

Pupils makes a comment to friends about how come they get away with it, they don't like the image and then says it makes them look like (but not racist/ disablist or anything)

Teacher overheard the comment (or rather the context of conversation) and pupil out on harshest detention they dish out for using an unkind word.

I'm being vague as don't want to be outed.

But I'm wondering if it's normal to punish children so harshly for a comment made in passing to friends in a corridor?
(Teacher admits they didn't actually hear word first time and only know exactly what was said as pupil asked and she told her)

I wouldn't walk into a board room wearing a micro mini, but equally, I wouldn't expect to be called a tart if I did.
Inappropriate for the context, fine. A wardrobe malfunction, if you like.
A judgement on my sexual availability? Absolutely not.
I'm with school on this one.

For the latest comments if your RTFT you'll see I accepted the word is a massive insult about 24 hours ago.

I wasn't the only one who didn't realise describing a type of clothes as tarty was associated with prostitute.

But this is an 11yo who was describing a 'look' and not even calling the other pupil the name. An 11yo who didn't realise the full meaning of the name. And 11yo who was just reacting to a comment made by a friend as a response to a whole school attitude encouraged by school.

And she certainly won't be doing it again. She's really upset and horrified at herself.

I don't think she's ever been in trouble in her life before this!

I have RTFT. But I still don't think you've fully grasped why what she said was wrong.

Hint - it's not because some other people think it's more of an insult than you do. It's because it's a misogynistic comment about another girl. I'm sure you would expect her to be punished if she said something racist, for example?

venus I accepted over 24 hours ago the meaning and connotations of the word. I've spent time reading the dictionary definitions. I didn't know what its root was and neither did some others on this thread.
I do now. I can't change the past.

I learnt the word from my own mum - who's a teacher!
I've been on MN long enough to know plenty of people use words unwittedly not knowing just how bad they are in societal norms. Threads like these are educational. I've been educated. I've said I'm educated.

What more exactly do you think I need to grasp?

Dcs secondary sounds very similar - mad strict uniform policy and different 'harshnesses' of detention.

If a pupil was overheard using a misogynous term towards or about another pupil then they would likely get a 'headmasters detention' or if they were very lucky, a HOY detention.

It is not the business of some random Y7 kid to make comments about whether they do or do not find other pupils dress attractive. It is not their place to say they look like a prostitute. Girls should be free to walk about school without their uniforms being fetishised, and no, the other kid was not 'asking' for misogynous abuse by rolling her skirt up. She is not a lovely girl, she is a judgey, sneery girl and the fact that her mother thinks it's fine speaks volumes.

That's good. You've been educated as to why perpetuating misogynistic ideas about women is wrong, and so has your friend's daughter. Win win! So the punishment was sensible, proportionate and fair enough. I have no idea whether or not it is normal practice.

But this is an 11yo who was describing a 'look' and not even calling the other pupil the name. An 11yo who didn't realise the full meaning of the name. And 11yo who was just reacting to a comment made by a friend as a response to a whole school attitude encouraged by school.

That's all well within the normal bounds of detention. She insulted "the look" of a girl who had just been pointed out, whether she named the girl or not. She said something she knew was insulting, even if she didn't realise just how insulting it was. And it's not the friend's fault for commenting on other girls breaking the dress code, nor the school's fault for having a dress policy, because the friend and the school didn't say anything about "tarty". She did.

And she certainly won't be doing it again. She's really upset and horrified at herself.

Lesson learnt then, which is the purpose of a detention. And she'll get over the upset. One detention hardly makes her the school delinquent.

I do hope someone explains to her about the misogyny though. Her own mother can't because her own mother doesn't understand it.

"It is not the business of some random Y7 kid to make comments about whether they do or do not find other pupils dress attractive."

This. The sooner she learns that she is not the uniform police the better.

And as far as adult life goes: I am in a profession where a certain decorum is expected. If I turned up in revealing clothes I would probably get a quiet word from my HoD. If I made audible comments about my colleagues' clothing in a public space. I'd probably be up for a disciplinary. Public name-callin absolutely not allowed. Very bad for morale, very poor impression on outsiders. (And incidentally, exactly the kind of thing that would pull a school down in an Ofsted inspection.)

So yes, she does need to learn about the adult workplace.

The Year 7 thought she was a "holier than thou"and therefore felt in an ideal position to judge the other pupil as not coming up to their standard of dress - hopefully the detention will teach her that her judgey ways are maybe something she needs to work at - imo she is not well behaved and saintly as she might like to think.