Apologies to Cambridge matmos.

[grovel]

I just loved being number 1000. Such power!

Ok - a 3 tier system with a completely comprehensive outlook (as you would like Seeker). There are only a few left in the country so I am sure you could find out if you put your mind to it! I would appreciate it if you didn't shout about it on here though as I, like you prefer to use mumsnet in an anonymous way. Thanks.

Just out of interest, how many of us are here talking about education because we can't talk about it in real life because of professionalism etc.?

Pugs, nobody is saying that you local school sounds good.

If others locally are also saying that it wasn't great, that sounds entirely reasonable.

To extend your conculsion it in any way beyond a poor local school (within a single tier of a 3 tier system), though, to indicate any type of 'systemic' failure is to extrapolate WAY beyond your data

I don't ever say anything in here that I wouldn't say in real life.

Pugs, your anonymity is probably safe, as there are more 3 tier areas than you might expect:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_middle_schools_in_England

Ditto to webwiz on what I say here vs real life.

Blimey! The OP was so trite - and now look!

Wow - there's that many? I thought we were pretty much the last ones standing!

Apologies to anybody that thought I was talking about the state system as a whole. I've only ever been talking about my experiences of that state system (grammar system for me & dh, 3 tier comprehensive for dd). I do make comparisons between the 2 like anybody would. And yes I thought the comprehensive system all used baseline assessment at 5 to predict gcse grades because it is such a well known fact locally! The only experience I have of 2 tier comprehensive is as a visitor to many schools over the years, not all of them positive experiences.

My interest has always been about how to find & then stop kids from falling through the gaps in the state sector. Private schools generally manage to help every child be successful in a way the state can sometimes fail!

I don't have all the answers but I do like to ask the questions. What failed dd might help the school/system/whatever improve the situation for someone else in the future

Pugs, I would therefore concentrate on finding and understanding where the real gaps are in the system - rather than constructing a story based on misunderstandings and a single example - if you genuinely want to make a difference.

Understanding assessment processes, measurement of level and progress, and what Ofsted looks for in a school, plus school funding and the different types of differentiation, might be a starting point. Oh, plus how predictions and progress tracking is used in good schools.

is = are in last sentence, sorry.

"Apologies to anybody that thought I was talking about the state system as a whole. " we'll I though that because you have said it vociferously in the past.

And just because something is "we'll known locally" doesn't mean it's right. The "system" does not use assessment at 5 to predict GCSE grades. It just doesn't. Not in your area. Not anywhere.

My interest in education tends to focus on understanding what on earth Michael Gove has been saying and getting DS to concentrate in his GCSE year. I don't personally have any experience of gaps in the state system as its working/has worked fine for me, DH and the DCs.

I was just tempted in by the idea of what you do at 5 having any bearing on later schooling. I think DS cried a lot at 5.

The OP was horrible and the thread has gone much the same way, I'd say. From sweeping inaccurate generalisation to sweeping inaccurate generalisation with a soupcon of insulting those with SEN issues along the way.

Even if the governors agree with me Seeker? Off the record of course! Why can you not believe that education for some revolves around the gamble of which cohort you happen to be in & how successful or not previous year groups have been? As I have said before, there is a lot to be said for being open minded to other ideas. & who is to say it doesn't work perfectly well for most?

Russian, I never meant any offence to anyone. Certainly not SEN students! Pray how???

"Why can you not believe that education for some revolves around the gamble of which cohort you happen to be in & how successful or not previous year groups have been"

Because that's not how it works! You are saying things which are just not true.

Sounds like gossipy nonsense to me but quite inventive. Imagine getting three separate schools to do all that tracking and making sure absolutely nobody overachieves. Nothing like a bit of conspiracy theory to liven up a Sunday afternoon.

Pugs Don't assume all rewards will flow to the most deserving in the indies either. Bit galling when the disruptive child who has stolen your DDs equipment and then orchestrated a sending to Coventry of her by the cool gang when someone else reported it, gets the year prize for Endeavour, as opposed to expelled. But then it was a very sad and angry DC and the school is probably the only source of competent parenting and confidence building, and the indies also take their pastoral responsibilities seriously. Actually the message I gave to DD was to understand, not envy or be angry.........

Presumably your experience means you condemn all private education, copthall?

You just keep those blinkers firmly on Seeker. Safer that way!

Obviously seeker

Pugs- if anyone is wearing blinkers, it's you! You refuse to believe that your experience is not universal. Or even ordinary. Or even how the system is supposed to work. You won't tell us where this happened, or even contemplate the suggestion that you might be wrong.

Of course state schools can be crap. Any school can be crap. But a state school that is operating within the rules just can't be crap in the particular way you are outlining. It just can't

I was also realising that Pugs takes everything absolutely literally [pugs, note - I think Copthall and seeker were being facetious in their last couple of posts] - might be where some of the misunderstandings lie.....

Pugs. In the last couple of days you have been wrong about the characteristics of the top 5% of intelligence (as measured by conventional tests). You have been wrong about the Oxbridge admission processes. You have been wrong about the suitability of some forms of ore-assessment for dyspraxic children. You have been wrong about the way in which baseline assessments at 4 years old influence a child's future academic path. You will admit to none of this.

I don't think it is seeker wearing blinkers.