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Original poster

Saint albans boys v haberdashers boys

171 replies

bulletpoint · 02/12/2011 20:58

does anyone have any experience of these schools ? And would they be a good second choice to harrow school ?

OP posts:
happygardening · 14/12/2011 14:52

Schools always tell you things about your children that you never knew. Both my DS's full boarded from 7 I was always having to listen to to that kind of stuff at times I hardly recognised DS2 from their description. But in my experience what you know about your child is correct not what the school says after all they're only there 31 weeks a year and they not exactly on a 1:1. Go with your gut instinct. Win Coll is not for everyone but in my opinion when it is right it is the best. (Oh God I suppose MrsJ will have something to say about that comment!)

happygardening · 14/12/2011 15:01

nokissymum there are 8 applicants for every place (thats more than for Eton) so there are lots who really like it and the vast majority we know there love it, Trust your instincts I think its great that you've found somewhere that you love, plenty would like to be in your position, hold your head up high and go for it.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 15:04

"sadly i think Harrow is not an excellent school "

mrsjalfred would you care to expantiate on this further please, as it is our first choice.

happygardening · 14/12/2011 15:09

nokissymum dont listen to Mrs J! You know your child and what you are looking for in education not her. She thinks she knows all about Win Coll but I don't recognise it from her description I'm sure she is not going to be any more knowledgable about Harrow.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 15:19

happygardening i dont think we would change our first choice at this stage, not unless there was some awful reason why we should, we really like the school, BUT it is rather unerving hearing everyone on here saying that its not a good school and would never apply to it especially when everyone seems to be keeping their reasons tightly to their chests. What i would like to know is are the boys all dropping out halfway through ? Are they failing their gcse's/alevels ? Are the teachers unqualified ? Are the housemasters peadophiles ? Is there library out of date ? Is pastoral care bad ? Are the boys all lonely and sad and weeping down the phone to their parents ? Do they have inadequate facilities ? Are they struggling later in life due to the trauma suffered at harrow ? What is not right about it ? This would be more helpful.

grovel · 14/12/2011 15:48

nokissymum, in some circles Harrow is thought rather "flash" and that Harrovians have more money than manners. This perception has been around for 40+ years and is very probably out-of-date. There is a joke, around from the 1960's, which you've probably heard:

An Etonian, a Wykhamist and a Harrovian are watching a cricket match. A young woman approaches them. The Etonian offers her a chair, the Wykhamist goes to get one, the Harrovian sits in it.

happygardening · 14/12/2011 16:00

We only know one that has left all the others seem very happy there (too many to count) no paedophiles, boys weeping down the phone to parents or trauma affecting adult life. The bright are really happy, as are the sporty and the musical. It does have a reputation for flashy parents that is generally the most negative thing I hear about it and also parents we know who don't choose it don't because its in London a very tedious journey from certain directions.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 16:02

grovel okay, i can handle that Wink

Colleger · 14/12/2011 16:10

Every time I go to Harrow I leave there wanting to send my boys. I don't know why but I do. However I have listened to the advice from many prep Heads saying it simply wouldn't be right for DS1. I think the school is great, music is phenomenal and especially singing which is a big draw for us. However I dislike nearly every Harrovian I've ever met and as they seem to maintain an old boy admissions place I worry that the next generation will be as arrogant as the last.

There are some areas of Harrow that are far better than the other two though so it just depends what you're looking for. It's a strong contender for us because DS would be nearer the top academically rather than at the bottom of the other two schools.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 16:15

happygardening that's a relief! I think there are flashy parents at probably every indie if one looks close enough, we actually chose Harrow because of its location, its quit a straightforward drive from us. Smile

TheMead · 14/12/2011 16:16

From my experience in pre-school, although all parents love their kids, not all do not notice their child's potential and weakness, regardless their class. Since DS is the only child, we therefore tends to rely mainly on school's comments about relationship with other kids. We've been lucky to have right, if not correct, feedbacks so far, which was very helpful. I feel that it becomes harder as he grows up.

With this reason, I am totally with nokissymum's concern, assuring own judgement and looking out for what I might have missed. I have friends in secondary comps, who had a couple of boys moved from top prestige schools at sixth form. Various reasons, such as finance, dispute with matron, etc. At the end of the day, they are private schools. Whenever "customer" thinks it's not worth its tuition fees, they can pull the plug out. Nonetheless, their systems and rules seem to be pretty good and trust worthy.

happygardening · 14/12/2011 16:17

Music is indeed very strong two of the most musical boys at DS prep went to Harrow. It also seems to take a broad cross section of both abilities and personalities.

TheMead · 14/12/2011 16:25

btw, those boys who moved to the state sixth forms are not from Harrows, for sure.

Colleger · 14/12/2011 16:36

I don't like the whole Pre-testing process. A boy at 10 is totally different from a boy at 13. Everyone thought DS should be at Winchester but in the last two terms he has grown up considerably, been given high status positions of responsibility and has got quite gobby. Win Coll would still be good for him but I see him fitting in well at Eton now. He may never be in "Pop" but he can certainly hold his own and is a wonderful beta male - the type that keeps calm amongst the wolves and is so diplomatic and pleasant that he never has any enemies.

Colleger · 14/12/2011 16:37

Just realised that I've probably described a Wykehamist!

happygardening · 14/12/2011 16:39

The problem is what works for one doesn't work for another. At the independent school I work at the vast majority are happy but there will always those who aren't. Realistically the school just doesn't fit the child and vice versa.
I heard a head once say that if the parents are totally committed and in love with the school then as a general principle not much goes wrong because even teenagers take their cue (maybe subconsciously) from their parents.
Of course we should listen to heads about future schools but definitely follow your own gut feelings if you have any doubts as soon as anything goes wrong then its so easy to think "I knew it wasn't right" rather than "I sure it's right lets solve it."

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 17:04

Thank you all for your honest comments, another school that seems to have bad press is Oundle, when i mentioned it to ds prep head as a possible choice, he immeadiately said NO! Never! When i asked why he said, "its too big" you can get lost" its not very peronal! "ive just never liked it" Confused, from my experience big schools would actually suit ds to a T, sometimes i wonder where the profiling of a school to match your child ends and where the prep heads own personal preferences begin.

Its not coincidence that hardly any children from our prep go to Oundle, Whilst the prep head further up the road cant sing oundles praises enough, you guess..... Quite a large percentage go to Oundle.

happygardening · 14/12/2011 17:11

A friends son in there and very happy although it took him a while to settle he came from a very small prep. The only problem is that there are no exeats which may be difficult if your full boarding and you live along way away.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 17:20

For some reason i thought Oundle did flexi boarding, anyway i think its off our radar now. I didnt like the good schools comment on it something along the lines of "you can't fail, you musnt fail" eek!

TheMead · 14/12/2011 17:20

Sounds similar to my concern (one of several) between WinCol and Eton. Big schools' get-lost issue is often defended by small houses and tutor group. Until now, my DS has only attended small schools, so I cannot imagine how such back-up systems would work. Boys in big school may have to work harder to get noticed at something, I guess. Does my DS need constant attention and appraisal? I don't know...

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 17:36

Aaaah! But mead big school means possible larger social circle for your dc, twice the fun!

Seriously ds1 started reception at a small catholic school, although he was well liked and friendly with everyone he never really had his Own friends, i.e come looking for him at lunch time etc, he moved to another school across the road that had 2 classes for every yr, so from 30 children in his year to 60, within weeks he made 5 firm friends, they would look out for him first thing in the morning and play hide and seek before the bell went Smile ds loved it, i'd never have thought he would settle so well in a big school, he also made friends in the other yrs. Sadly we decided to move him to a prep for various other reasons, he is in a class of 11 kids, fantastic for academics but no reason why he couldnt thrive in a larger environment.

By the way, it Win Col big or small ? Oundle is smaller than eton!

happygardening · 14/12/2011 17:38

Win Coll is significantly smaller than Eton but both have strong house systems and although I personally am not an Eton fan I don't think boys "get lost" because of this. If it helps TheMead we know many from my DS prep, which was very tiny, who have successfully made the transition to Eton. I understand from parents with boys at both that this is the least of your problems when comparing the two.

happygardening · 14/12/2011 17:39

Win Coll 700 Eton ?1100.

MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 14/12/2011 17:41

Colleger- Is your son at Eton? Or about to go? Does he still have to meet the required standard in CE?

Happygardening. I've been very careful not to describe Winchester, so no wonder your son and you don't recognise it. Smile But as you keep pressing, I'll tell you what I think. I'm sure you'll tell me it's nonsense, but it is what I honestly think. I think there's a certain joylessness about them as people and they have a propensity to take themselves a bit too seriously. There is more to life than being intellectually stimulating, in fact it can be a bit of a bore. Grin

And Eton, I can only come up with the tailcoats and the crushing, unyielding weight of expectation placed upon those young men. As well as carrying more than its fair share of stick and derision. The timing for Eton feels very wrong indeed.

nokissymum · 14/12/2011 17:49

Yes i totally agree happy if there is a strong house system then there is no reason to feel "lost" so dont know what head was harping on about, shame there arent any Oundle parents here.