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Salmond v Sturgeon Round 3 — Comment along with Sturgeon

999 replies

PolkadotsAndMoonbeams · 03/03/2021 13:16

Previous thread here.

OP posts:
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11
WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:10

@IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021

I mean we are locked up until the 26th of April so she has a bit of time to deal with the other stuff. Murdo Fraser calling her a liar on Twitter
And he is correct. NS turned his question into one of her being asked to apologise for Salmond which it never was.

He says in his tweet "she was asked to apologise for saying we should trust a man she now denounces as a liar and a fantasist. Shameless."

Which is what we all saw on tv.

I'm now trying to get my head round twitter as it seems like it might be very informative.

IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021 · 04/03/2021 13:13

@WaxOnFeckOff does that mean she just lied to parliament again 🤦‍♀️ follow Murdo then you will get suggestions. Similar to Facebook you can search by names to get the political reporter etc

Scottishskifun · 04/03/2021 13:15

@WaxOnFeckOff

Lets not forget also that "she needs to be doing her job which is handling the pandemic" - i thought her job description was a bit wider than that but I guess it explains a lot.
I agree with her I want her to focus on the pandemic........ But we are still waiting til next week for any hint of post April and what it means for people and businesses yet somehow there is already a document for a future indy referendum.....
TheShadowyFeminist · 04/03/2021 13:15

I think her bravado now she's managed to waffle & obfuscate through 8 hours is ill advised. She's over confident because she think she's got a slam dunk election result pending. People are paying far closer attention to how she's answering Qs than at any other time, and she failed to answer any of the Qs asked of her. Her reputation is not as Teflon as she believes it to be. I'm actually finding her quite off putting, and I'd previously admired her. Genuinely admired her, thought she was a cut above your average politician. But she's as bad, if not worse given the power at her fingertips & how's she's mishandled that.

Anas definitely came across well, but given his predecessor, he's easily cleared the low bar being clung onto.

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 13:19

@TheShadowyFeminist

I think her bravado now she's managed to waffle & obfuscate through 8 hours is ill advised. She's over confident because she think she's got a slam dunk election result pending. People are paying far closer attention to how she's answering Qs than at any other time, and she failed to answer any of the Qs asked of her. Her reputation is not as Teflon as she believes it to be. I'm actually finding her quite off putting, and I'd previously admired her. Genuinely admired her, thought she was a cut above your average politician. But she's as bad, if not worse given the power at her fingertips & how's she's mishandled that.

Anas definitely came across well, but given his predecessor, he's easily cleared the low bar being clung onto.

I s just don't see how she could possibly think this.

I and near enough every other independence supporter I know don't think it will be anywhere close to a slam dunk.

If we can sense that then she must too.

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 13:23

@Dinnafashyersel

I see your point Isurvive. However I have 2 DDs (19 and 20) both heartily sick of their supposed innate victimhood being used by #metoo and the wider political class. Cynicism doesn't even start to describe the eye rolls. Mind the stories they tell about how boys behave in their local comp and how the girls deal with it would make even Sturgeon and Salmond blush.
Misogyny and an acceptance of us living in a patriarchal society does not go hand in hand with victimhood. Not does it mean that women on an individual level can't be strong.

In the example you give the girls are standing up for themselves and giving as good as they get. Fine. The actual significant issue is why do the boys think that it's acceptable to behave that way in the first place?

Girls shouldn't be going to school and having to stand up for themselves.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:23

[quote IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021]@WaxOnFeckOff does that mean she just lied to parliament again 🤦‍♀️ follow Murdo then you will get suggestions. Similar to Facebook you can search by names to get the political reporter etc [/quote]
Thank you for the tips. I am able to search and look at stuff and i've used it for complaint resolution with companies but I always struggle to see comments made and instead just get a box to make a comment.

I'll work it out as I think it's a good source of info and I'm a big girl now and shouldn't have to rely on folks here for the goss.

I don't know if she has lied again but tend to feel the need to fact check everything that comes out her mouth. If she said she was asked to apologise for Alec Salmond then yes, that is a lie. I can't pin to the exact point on the hearing yesterday but it was pretty late afternoon.

IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021 · 04/03/2021 13:25

@kurtrussellsbeard I take your point but I have 2 girls so can't do anything about the way parents raise their boys. All I can do is teach them to speak out

TheShadowyFeminist · 04/03/2021 13:27

She's going by the polls on independence, her own personal approval ratings, intends to 'big up' her handling of Covid to ensure that's the image portrayed for the electorate - she did it in FMQs by continuing to refer to 'her job in handling the pandemic' - the sturgeon loyalists have been posting up the various polls making that very point. Her confidence in standing up in parliament and basically not answering questions asked, with the aggression & snark she dished out tells me she doesn't give a damn how this looks, she feels she has no reason to comply with any Qs asked, will deflect responses & thinks that's her job done.

She is confident she'll be voted back in, and it shows.

StatisticallyChallenged · 04/03/2021 13:28

The report from yesterday isn't up yet, I'll post it once it is. I thought Murdo Fraser asked her to apologise for repeatedly telling us to trust AS, not for his behaviour

TheShadowyFeminist · 04/03/2021 13:28

I don't know if she has lied again but tend to feel the need to fact check everything that comes out her mouth.

Exactly this.

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 13:29

@IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021 of course. And I'm the same: two girls.

We need to operate within the invisible structures that constrain us and we can only focus on what we can control. It's important though to accept that misogyny exists and that we need to do more on a societal level to challenge that. Things like #metoo and thinking about the language we use do chip away at it.

I think most kids today are much more respectful of others and boundaries than they were when I was at school. I'm obviously looking as an adult now though and may miss much.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:30

The thing is, naturally people want to be on the side of victory, so they are swayed by the belief that this or that will be the winning side. So naturally she and other supporters (and would be the same on the other side) will perpetuate the idea that victory is imminent as it sways some of the folk who will then vote believing what is said to be true.

The other parties will push that it's likely to be a defeat for SNP rather than a victory for them as that is clearly not so much a tack they can reasonably take so then their position looks negative. This is why AS getting to decide the question and being able to have the "postive sounding Yes campaign" was potentially a game changer.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:31

I have two boys, one of whom was bullied by girls.

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 13:32

That's horrible @WaxOnFeckOff but it doesn't mean we don't live in a patriarchal society where misogyny is rife.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:32

@StatisticallyChallenged

The report from yesterday isn't up yet, I'll post it once it is. I thought Murdo Fraser asked her to apologise for repeatedly telling us to trust AS, not for his behaviour
Yes exactly that and it was turned into "I'm being asked to apologise for Alec Salmond"
WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:37

@kurtrussellsbeard

That's horrible *@WaxOnFeckOff* but it doesn't mean we don't live in a patriarchal society where misogyny is rife.
I'm not denying that either. I am a child sexual abuse survivor and because of this I grew up with skewed boundaries about a lot of things. My DC are probably not perfect but they have been taught to respect others and themselves. I think DS1 took on board about respecting others (he would never hit back or retaliate) but forgot about himself.

He was bullied by boys as well.

Anyway off topic - big grey rock...

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 13:50

I think we're splitting hairs here with the apology. She was being asked to apologise for him.

She trusted him. He abused that trust. She asked folk to trust in him because she didn't believe he was a sex pest. Why should she apologise for having her trust in a friend broken.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 13:58

I don't think it was splitting hairs and I don't think he was looking for her to actually apologise. He was pointing out that on one hand she supported him and called him a friend etc but at the same time was aware that he might not be whiter than white. So was casting aspersions on her judgement.

I'm sure she would know that.

IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021 · 04/03/2021 14:05

I also don't think it is splitting hairs. It's one of the things I felt she was telling the truth on yesterday about how she lost a friend, mentor and someone she looked up to so to turn it round to say she's being asked to apologise for a man is untrue.

She actually alluded to it herself that maybe she had a higher threshold for his behaviour to others. I would have more respect for her saying look I knew this guy for 30 years of course I did not want it to be true so took my time to think it over. It's all just spin spin spin

StatisticallyChallenged · 04/03/2021 14:08

It wasn't a great question but it is being twisted (as far as I recall) and personally I'm bloody bored of politicians just blatantly twisting questions and answering questions they weren't asked
I know it's typical politics bit it is infuriating - you hear a question (not necessarily this one) and think "I'd like to know that " and get some utter crap in response

LexMitior · 04/03/2021 14:08

@kurtrussellsbeard - I think I understand that but she is the First Minister. The analogy stops because of that. The friendship is drama, but it’s Scotland affected by it.

kurtrussellsbeard · 04/03/2021 14:15

Well I remember him asking her to apologise to the people she asked to trust AS.

I could be wrong.

If that was the question then why on earth should she apologise for asking people to trust a man she trusted.

happygolurkey · 04/03/2021 14:21

the demand of an apology was low. Expected better of Murdo Fraser. Nicola Sturgeon started out her evidence with apologies - for the mistakes, for the cost, and to the claimants let down. She shouldn't have to apologise for Alex Salmond.

WaxOnFeckOff · 04/03/2021 14:23

@kurtrussellsbeard

Well I remember him asking her to apologise to the people she asked to trust AS.

I could be wrong.

If that was the question then why on earth should she apologise for asking people to trust a man she trusted.

That was the question. I think the implication was that she already knew Salmond wasn't to be trusted so therefore the implication was that she had hoodwinked the population (that he was trustworthy) and should apologise for that. Honestly I have no idea whether she did or didn't and I don't think the expectation was that she should actually apologise. It was a grandstanding question to push a reaction.

However at no time was she asked by Murdo to apologise for Salmond's behaviour which is what she turned it into at the time and then (I believe) repeated at FMQs?