Salmond v Sturgeon Round 3 — Comment along with Sturgeon

[PolkadotsAndMoonbeams]

Previous thread here.

I think it's going to be a damp squib and the Tories will look silly calling for her resignation before she had even been given her chance to speak.

Orcadianrythms I take entirely the opposite view. As a woman of similar age and professional standing to Nicola and her and Alec's senior staff I never needed anyone to step in and fight my battles. It is naive in the extreme and deeply patronising to assume on balance these professional women did. Ime that would not be the norm. We are not talking about starry eyed 16 year old ingenues on the casting couch.

There is another prevalent double standard at play. Why is it OK to refer to Alec as "difficult" or "bullying" when he was 100% measured in his public dealings, including on Friday but not OK to refer to Nicola's hectoring and snide (yes bitchy) insinuations?

It’s frustrating that basically if she doesn’t feel she should resign then she doesn’t have to. And I’m not saying here that she should or should not. But I’m losing sight of how exactly power can be held to account. The whole system here is failing.

@PolkadotsAndMoonbeams

I feel a bit sorry for her really, because I think that other people were doing their jobs poorly to make it get to this point.

I agree. I'm very concerned about how much scrutiny will be put on the civil service. I think serious questions need to be focused on them.

@PolkadotsAndMoonbeams

I feel a bit sorry for her really, because I think that other people were doing their jobs poorly to make it get to this point.

I'd have more sympathy if she was showing any sign of dealing with them. Instead she is standing steadfastly behind her team.

@Orcadianrythyms

I don't think this has made things much clearer. I still think Salmond is a odious misogynist and Sturgeon not clear on events. I find this forum weird, particularly the hatred of Sturgeon who although I've raged at some decisions has provided leadership and compassion during the pandemic beyond any other government figure. I don't post often now cause it's all a bit 'Us for Them' and I don't see voices that reflect my experience.

Can't believe the vitriol against Sturgeon here whilst Salmond gets a much easier ride. He was patronising, awful on Friday with his disdain of women all over his answers. Not even prepared to apologise when offered, taking the chairs 'guidance' and showing his true feelings of woman getting above their station and not rolling over.

Huge kudos for posting this.

Totally agree.

I've just tuned in...she looks like she hasn't slept for weeks.

You’d think they would try and be a little less obvious...

@ATieLikeRichardGere

It’s frustrating that basically if she doesn’t feel she should resign then she doesn’t have to. And I’m not saying here that she should or should not. But I’m losing sight of how exactly power can be held to account. The whole system here is failing.

There are elections just a number of weeks away though.

Yep full Trumpian. The electorate is going to be the final arbiter and potentially wipe the slate clean. This is why the SNP have played the long game because earlier in the electoral cycle this would not have been an option.

@StatisticallyChallenged I feel like if she did otherwise she'd be accused of throwing people under the bus to save her political skin.

@Dinnafashyersel it's not about you though. It's about how women are treated in the media, in the workplace, in the family.

Even the language used in your response is steeped in misogyny.

Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it isn't there.

I don't like her or her politics but I don't want her to be corrupt in this case. It will do so much damage to women wanting to lead.

Anyway, this thread is about the inquiry, not the iniquities of the posters in Scotsnet.

In Scotland...

Counsel = QCs as has already been described.

Law Officers are The Lord Advocate (James Wolffe) who gave evidence to the committee last week, and The Solicitor General (Alison Di Rollo). The LA can attend meetings of the Scottish Cabinet.

Scotland has a Fixed Term Parliament for Holyrood with all that entails in terms of VoNC leading to political wrangling rather than elections.

deflect deflect deflect

Thanks @Paleodiet

Getting slightly pissed off with being accused of misogyny to be frank.

It's not misogynistic to think an individual woman hasn't done her job well. It's not misogynistic to think multiple women haven't done their jobs right. It's not misogynistic to question whether every allegation made by a woman is true. Women are perfectly capable of fucking up and are also perfectly capable of lying.

@StatisticallyChallenged

Getting slightly pissed off with being accused of misogyny to be frank.

It's not misogynistic to think an individual woman hasn't done her job well. It's not misogynistic to think multiple women haven't done their jobs right. It's not misogynistic to question whether every allegation made by a woman is true. Women are perfectly capable of fucking up and are also perfectly capable of lying.

Totally agree SC

@WouldBeGood

Anyway, this thread is about the inquiry, not the iniquities of the posters in Scotsnet.

It's about wherever the conversation takes us. The poster made a valid point within the context of the inquiry. People are commenting on the similar misogyny within the thread. It's all connected.

I'm not disputing the existence of misogyny. Far from it. I'm saying viewing all women as victims all the time is of itself misogynistic and perpetuates the notion that all power is gifted by men. It robs women of agency and respect and perpetuates the glass ceiling.

Even now we are all supposed to be grateful Biden chose Kamala. How much better if the Democratic Party had nominated her in the first place?

the idea that Nicola as head of the executive of the Scottish government is somehow being treated in a misogynistic way is crazy - an inquiry into how these complaints were handled by parliament has got zero to do with how women are treated in the media. This looks like a last ditch effort at defending her to me.

I'd rather she'd handled this better and the case against Salmond had been proven, but the Scottish government handed Salmond the ammunition, not the media or misogyny or the tories.

Well yes, of course they are. Nobody said they weren't. Just that it would defy the history of humanity for a female leader to be viewed through exactly the same lens as a male leader. That's why I said 'subconsciously' as I don't think it's the deliberate intention of anyone here. I do it, everyone does it, that's the patriarchy for ya.

@StatisticallyChallenged

Getting slightly pissed off with being accused of misogyny to be frank.

It's not misogynistic to think an individual woman hasn't done her job well. It's not misogynistic to think multiple women haven't done their jobs right. It's not misogynistic to question whether every allegation made by a woman is true. Women are perfectly capable of fucking up and are also perfectly capable of lying.

Yes.

Especially given that some of the women involved had a day in court and at least one was proven to be lying.

I don't dislike sturgeon because she is a woman but I damn sure don't feel like I should be obliged to give her the benefit of the doubt because she is a woman.

Let's remember once again. Salmond attended as a witness, he is on on trial in this process.