From the random box of covid restrictions we now get....

[WaxOnFeckOff]

Facemasks in shops.

I mean really, what is the point now? If they were useful then the time when they were useful was months ago.

Surely the chance of catching covid in a shop is minute, the chance of then being ill is more minute and the chance of dying is vastly remote.

It just feels like it another thing to say just to keep control? I have no problem doing things that make sense and protect others, but really? Public transport where you may be in the vicinity of someone for longer seems fair enough but shops doesn't make sense.

IME so far, having a mask dangling from your neck without even being worn seems to give people carte blanche to stand less than a foot away from others.

Rates are very low here. There's no evidence of transmission in shops. It's alien to our culture. I find it freaks me totally. I think it's a fig leaf. The virus isn't very deadly. They're not hygienic. They discourage shopping. I don't think they should be compulsory.

I rest my case so no worries

But is this happening in Scotland? Please link so we can respond. I am glad you feel welcome in Scotsnet Helena but we had to fight to get our first thread moved back here to prevent confusion. Posting links from NHS England can be conflicting to NHS Scotland.

Sorry, By the look of it no. Such differences between England and the rest of the country.

To all those ignorant people above about hidden disabilities, I've had to do all the following, at great distress to me, but to keep YOU lucky non disabled ignorant insensitive morons safe.

1. get a lawyers letter from the Disability Law Centre to prove I am deaf and that I need the other person to remove their mask so I can lip read

2, gotten a mask that says 'lip reader' on the front from etsy (was not cheap)

3, gotten badges with my disabilities on them (again not cheap)

4, gotten an exemption letter from my doctor, oh and a new prescription for ADs which I had hoped I no longer needed, oh and a new referral to counselling

5, downloaded the thistle app

6, bought a sunflower lanyard

7, downloaded some apps that are meant to help transcribe voices but each app actually misspells words and dont recognise Scots.

Are you all happy now?

@username2020 I'm really sorry you've had to go through all that. I'm one of those that is just being stubborn though I do find wearing a mask unpleasant. It's horrible that you've had to do all that and also bad that there are people who have unrecorded reasons that they can't wear one and will be unable to jump through any of those hoops.

@YonBonnieBanks are you a scientist? I find your sweeping statements that masks don't work a little bit concerning. Lots of experts think that they do.

Hopefully the need for them is short lived. If we make it through lockdown easing with no second spike and our test and trace continues to stay on top of things hopefully the appetite for them will wane.

I do wholeheartedly believe they will be helpful though. I think the relatively low level of infection in Asian countries where mask etiquette is more embedded shows that.

People seem to be cutting off their nose to spite their face a little bit with this whole 'they weren't recommending masks before'. I think it was pretty clear that they were trying to avoid a PPE panic / shortage. Masks aren't 100% effective but they are certainly better than nothing particularly with a high compliance rate.

plenty of scientists have said they make little difference. Plus, as I said, in countries where mask wearing is more common, they have still had new outbreaks.

are we to wear masks for years, if no vaccine is ever found? Will we still be championing masks in 6 months, a year, 2 years? I think people are going along with it for now as they think/hope its a temporary measure. Wait a month, or two, then things will change!

I think it was pretty clear that they were trying to avoid a PPE panic / shortage.

And yet it doesn't need to be a mask/official PPE, they could have advised in March for people to use a doubled up piece of cloth to cover their mouth as much as possible. Not all mask wearing countries have been successful and not all successful countries routinely wear masks.

More successful than non mask wearing countries. I have great sympathy for people. They're horrible things but if they help stop the spread then they are worth it.

Those asymptomatic care home cars show us that we have to be very very careful. Easing lockdown could really start another outbreak. People are totally scunnered, going out more and breaking 2m distancing. Masks help mitigate that.

But there have been asymptomatic people throughout that they believe don't really pass the disease on and we have so few cases that it's not like there are people out spreading it regardless. There is not a vaccine and might not be for a long time. We can't throw people's mental health under the bus for the current level of risk.

People will go out less and spend less, thus impacting retail and hospitality.

Those that do go out, are being drawn into a false sense of security and will take more risks.

Those asymptomatic care home cars show us that we have to be very very careful. Easing lockdown could really start another outbreak. People are totally scunnered, going out more and breaking 2m distancing. Masks help mitigate that.

Okay so where do we draw the line between physical health and mental health? I don't have the answers and I don't profess to understand people's extreme anxiety surrounding masks. What I do know is that coronavirus can be really bloody awful. It has killed thousands of people in the UK and I don't want any of my loved ones to become part of those statistics. Many more appear to be suffering strange neurological and vascular reactions and I don't think we know enough about this illness to take risks.

I don't think masks do mitigate it I'm sorry, people wearing masks are not observing SD and also wearing masks incorrectly or wearing dirty masks that they are then touching and touching items and getting closer to people.

Where I have been people have been wearing masks properly. I've seen very few folk with noses sticking out etc. Maybe I've been lucky.

Agree @WaxOnFeckOff

Maybe you have been lucky, the only close encounters I have had with people have been with folk wearing/half wearing masks.

Okay so where do we draw the line between physical health and mental health? I don't have the answers and I don't profess to understand people's extreme anxiety surrounding masks

I don't know either. I'm accepting that for the moment shops and the nhs aren't for me but if it's long term I've no idea what I'll do. I'd wear one if I could and I've got the scars to prove it. I hadn't self harmed in years until I decided to see if I force myself into a mask. Coupled with the fact that there is very little mental health support atm, I'm sinking back into a very bad place. I've never thought of myself of as disabled and I suppose I still struggle with the idea but there is now a huge list of places I can't go. I can't shop, I can't go to the doctor's or hospital should I need, I can't pick up takeout and I presume when museums open, I won't be able to go there either. I honestly don't feel I have anything to live for. I'm a burden on my family. My daughter was screaming for me in a shop yesterday and I just stood outside, against every instinct feeling like a worthless failure. My husband is doing all the shopping which he hates. Can't even get antidepressants because my psychiatrist is working from home so the GP has to prescribe and she won't unless she can see me in person to assess my mental state.

Sorry you are feeling so bad @Dinosauratemydaffodils. You are worthwhile and people do love you and you will get through this. Your DH might not enjoy the shopping but then who does, he'll just have to suck it up and it wont kill him. That's what marriage is and there are things you can do. Parks are open with no masks, the open spaces are free, please keep getting out in the fresh air. I'm crap at advice, but there are boards on here with people who are much better that will say the right things :)

I'm so sorry you feel like this dinosaur. You're not a burden. Not at all. Your family love you. While the onus shouldn't be on you to solve this problem a pp mentioned maybe some kind of visible universally accepted badge or lanyard to allow people to not wear masks unchallenged. This might be worth pursuing with MSPs? Maybe that's something useful that could come from this thread?

Could you push GP for a video call?

Could you push GP for a video call