The vitriol for SAHPs on this site is insane

[JustSoFrustrated]

So many insisting it “isn’t work” and that we’re lazy, calling us “leeches” on our spouses, saying that “housework doesn’t take that long” and assuming we’re either “faffing about” or filling our time with made-up work or leisure activities…

Honestly, I wish they could all take a turn doing what I do each day and see if they still think it isn’t work or that it only takes “two hours max” daily to keep the house running—Someone told me that it only takes 20 minutes to hoover the entire house! I was like, I could do maybe one room in 20 minutes. Are they not picking things up off the floor first or moving furniture?? It also makes me imagine that their homes are TINY, and that they don’t have much of a garden, or at least not one that’s their responsibility to maintain. They also all have older, more independent children and seem to have forgotten how much supervision and assistance young children need, and how much of a mess they make constantly.

Someone else was like, “It takes five minutes per meal to do the dishes,” and I thought, what the hell are they feeding their kids? Maybe if you microwave cans of soup, or pop a tray of chicken nuggets in the oven on a single sheet pan, or boil pasta in one pot and then dump a jar of sauce over it… And that’s fine to do every once in a while, but not for every meal. If you’re actually cooking cooking— you know, chopping fruits and veggies, working with meat, cooking different components to a meal in the way they taste best, serving them on real dishes, with real cutlery to eat with… Dishes are gonna take you more than 5 minutes per meal, even with a dishwasher (Unless they’re just popping their dishes and cookware in without rinsing them off at all?? In which case I’m assuming their dishwashers are rank inside!)

And when you explain to them, this is how much work I have to do, and how much time it takes me, they either start concluding you’re “plodding around”/doing it inefficiently/incorrectly, or they’ll start suggesting that you downsize your life so that you’re less busy… presumably so you can get “a real job.” But that’s totally not the point; why would I make it so my family has a less enjoyable or less luxurious life, and see my DC less, just so I can go to work to make money that we don’t really need?

I’m tempted to just start insisting to WOHP that their houses must be disgustingly dirty and that they’re obviously cleaning wrong if it takes them so little time… or that they’re “faffing around” at work all day, because obviously if families with SAHP can live comfortably on one income, then their work must be really inefficient…

But that wouldn’t be reasonable, would it?

Or they have cleaners OP so they aren’t disgusting.

I have been both with young kids and sorry but it isn’t a full time 40 hour a week job. And it ain’t as stressful and a lot of those working do all that you do and work so YABU.

I’ve just swept, hoovered and mopped my floor and timed it. It took 7 minutes and not 5. My bad.

You obviously haven’t done it properly if you don’t take at least 30 minutes and you must live in a dirty house the size of an shoebox and feed your kids rubbish.

You’re right. It’s tiny and still filthy. I also only feed my kids chicken nuggets and rice waffles every day. You’ve sussed me.😂

You started this thread specifically to
discuss the amount of minutes it takes to properly hoover a room! Now that’s weird.

I think the problem is working and being a parent is so hard at times. I am exhausted some nights. I love spending time with my children, do extra work to earn attending their school events and have to fit in making tea and housework around everything else.

SAHM have the luxury of time to spend with their children, time to get housework done as and when and the joy of planning their day how they want. I imagine it’s uncomfortable agreeing that it is an easier, less complicated life than those of us who work so they try and justify everything they do, rather than just enjoying it.

Wrong. I wanted to talk about the conversations I’ve had with mumsnetters who are being illogical, assumptive, and/or even hateful towards SAHPs. Part of that includes some of the comments about how long they think it takes to do chores.

How long it takes an individual to vacuum varies on their circumstances.

It’s not uncomfortable to me to acknowledge that working and running a house is exhausting. Regardless of how much you might enjoy your job, balancing so much day after day is tiring. SAHP obviously have more flexibility but that doesn’t mean their contribution is worthless, just because it isn’t offficisly paid.

Millions of unpaid carers of all types are keeping this country going/afloat. It would collapse altogether if people were not willing to do this.

I enjoy tending to my home and family. I appreciate the time I spend with my daughter.

But I don’t get to pick if or when I do the housework. We need groceries when we need groceries. I have to cook and feed my family when they are hungry. The house needs cleaning daily— it gets dirty and disorganized whether I want it to or not. DD and our dogs need medical attention when they need medical attention. They need picked up when they need picked up, and care when they’re sick. Things break or we get pests, and phone calls need to be made. The garden needs tending when it needs tending; I can’t tell the plants to stop growing for a minute so I can do what I want… so on and so forth.

I usually have to prioritize things that need to get done the most, not what I most feel like doing. I have to figure out, how can I do this most efficiently so I can get as much done as possible in a day? There’s never enough time to get to everything, such that I have nothing to do. I’m not going to “admit” that it’s easier or less complicated, because it’s not. It’s a fucktonne of work, and it will continue to be whether you imagine it to be some luxurious fairy tale where I can do whatever I want 24/7 or not.

I do think SAHPs contribute, particularly those with preschool children. I just notice on here and in real life that some SAHPs tend to talk about how much they have to do.

There is all the work that you listed above for parents who work though, we also have to figure out and prioritise all of that and sometimes we can’t get things done when needed because there isn’t enough time. Yes we can see ‘plants have grown’ and ‘things have broken’ but they don’t necessarily get attended to immediately because of the lack of time.

I don’t think it’s a fairytale but im Comparing it to when I’m off work and my children were pre-school age and as hard as it was it was my time to enjoy being with them and to do the cleaning, other jobs when I wanted to (not trying to get things done after spending a long day at work).

I think it’s fine to acknowledge things are easier for some than others. Being a SAHP isn’t easy but it’s a lot easier than working and doing household things, catching up with your children etc. Just like I acknowledge I have it a lot easier than others.

I’m not going to “admit” that it’s easier or less complicated, because it’s not

Of course it's easier if you don't need to squeeze those tasks in and also work full time.

You just listed all the things that need to happen - those things all also happen in working parent households. It's not like WOHMs pets only get sick on schedule, pests wait for a convenient slot to appear and family doesn't need to be fed.

You realise these are the same for everyone? I work full time, I still have to get groceries, tidy the houses do the dishes, maintain the garden, home and car, ensure my pets are cared for etc etc etc. I have to do it outside of work. SAHP don't magically have more to do because they're at home.
I don't really know where you're going with this thread aside from assuming that working parents can't possibly do any of these things.
Oh and fyi Friday night I cooked a cottage pie with 3 veggies and a dessert after being at work. Not a 5 minute chicken nugget meal. Ah, and I washed up. Amazing concept I know!

I think you do need to acknowledge that you are choosing most of the things you do day to day. Most working people work for employers and do not get to pick and choose. When their child is sick they don’t always have the option of staying at home and caring for them.

They are usually having to do both housework snd work all day, it’s definitely harder. Of course it is. Their children will have the same issues yours hsvr, their household appliances break, need maintenance etc and that all still needs to be done too. Whilst I accept your work is not worthless op, you don’t have the same challenges as someone working full
time lets be fair about this.

I can see that looking after babies and preschoolers is hard work and time is spent entertaining with them, feeding, changing nappues etc , they need constant supervision, they make mess ...
With older children at school, I'm sure there is a lot more free time. The examples OP gave are strange, doesn't everyone need to get grocery shopping, attend the needs of sick children or pets and sort out the garden regardless of whether they do paid work or not?

But surely you can understand that all of these things are true for parents that work as well? Having a job doesn’t mean that you can magically stop the garden growing either?!

We have two full time jobs, a 3 year old and a 1 year old, a dog, a big garden, four bedrooms. We cook home made meals pretty much every night. The house is vacuumed every day. But we also have two full time jobs.

I have absolutely no issue whatsoever with SAHP. But you CLEARLY think you are a better parent than those that work, and I do have an issue with that.

As a working parent, I do things like plan a garden that is low maintenance. My plants don't need constant pruning because thier height and spread is self limiting. I don't have to pick up leaves as I don't have lots of plants that drop leaves. I have ground cover stuff to suppress weeds.

The same as people having prechopped veg

It doesn't mean I'm better or worse.

I dont get who has it harder competitionss because what a dissapointing competition to win. I assume it's some cultural protestant worth ethic thing. Where hard work is pious and redemption.

I put quite a lot of value in making things easy for my family so we can enjoy time together. (Obviously I can't get away with no effort at all)

Well good for you.

but as others have said all those things you list are still there to do if you work.

i’ve been both sahm and wohm and it is infinitely easier to get all that done when you aren’t at work and the kids are at school. It’s easier to plan and prioritise how to get everything done in a day when you have that day to do it, and the next day if you don’t manage…

I still manage to get my dog to the vet, feed my children, clean my house, sort the garden, arrange for things to be fixed or the delivery of a new dishwasher.

If sahm is a job, then a working parent has two jobs. You can justify all you like with how much you need to do but bottom line is working parents still do all that too. Like you say it doesn’t go away, plants still grow, houses need cleaning, people need to eat…whether you work or not.

A SAHM that is a lovely person but just doesn’t understand how hard it is to work and do everything else was telling me she was exhausted because her children hadn’t slept well and the house needed a good tidy. Difference is for me is I’d have to work a full day feeling exhausted, then try and squeeze dealing with the house in the evening!

And now try doing all those things with a job to fit it round too. The only thing working parents don't usually have is the child in the house with them. All the groceries still need to be bought, the garden maintained etc. Kids still get sick, pets still get sick. It may surprise you to discover that even people without kids still have to maintain their homes and gardens, and fit it around work too. Whether you can admit it or not, working full time AND running a household is more time consuming than ONLY running a household.

It may surprise you to discover that even people without kids still have to maintain their homes and gardens

I think OPs point is that we just do it all to a much inferior standard than her.

Inspired by this thread, I actually timed how long it took DH to clean the kitchen after dinner yesterday. (Dinner was Meera Sodha's mango and paneer salad with home marinated chicken drumsticks, and disappointingly not microwaved tinned soup.) I cleaned while I cooked as usual, so blender, chopping boards, knives and bowls used were either washed or in the dishwasher.
4 minutes it took him, and he didn't know I was timing, so he worked at his normal pace. Plates and cutlery (yes, 'real' ones) in the dishwasher, everything wiped, all clean.
Fair enough, he didn't also sanitize the kitchen cabinet hinges or dust the lightbulbs or whatever else is on the daily 'proper cleaning' list, but it indeed took less than 5 minutes to do the dishes after dinner.

I think that what people aren’t getting is that my life would be structured differently if I was WOH.

We would either need to live in a smaller house with much less land to care for, or we would need to hire an expensive cleaner and landscapers to help with our current property, because DH wouldn’t be willing to clean himself and he has too severe season allergies to work outdoors, and I simply wouldn’t have sufficient time to get to every part of the house and garden as often as it needs otherwise.

I would ask him to help with the laundry and dishes. I wouldn’t have time to cook as elaborate/diverse/tasty meals as I presently do; they’d need to be quick or batch prepped. DH would have to cook sometimes, too. We wouldn’t have fish tanks, houseplants, or so many dogs to care for. I would probably order groceries instead of shopping for them myself (which tends to result in lower quality produce— god forbid those shoppers learn how to pick out an avocado!— and it’s a lot more expensive, where I live.)

DD would be in child care while I’m working, and her school would be in charge of her early childhood education, and feeding her lunch and snacks, and cleaning up after her for most of the day, every week day, instead of me. Our QOL would be lower, because I wouldn’t be able to do all the specific work that makes it as enjoyable for my family. But those things— saving us money on cleaners and landscapers, doing 1-1 lessons with DD, shopping for high quality produce, cooking different meals daily exactly the way my family likes, being able to have pets and plants, etc.— all of those things require a lot of time.

WOHP are not doing A FULL DAY of housework and in addition to daily full-time shifts WOH. I’m sure their households and families are well-looked after, but it’s just logically impossible for them to be fitting everything that I do “around working.”

I think OPs point is that we just do it all to a much inferior standard than her.

I am under no illusions about how she looks down her nose at us working parents and our apparently slovenly tiny houses. And how all we feed our children is beige freezer food which we scatter in our wakes without even using real cutlery.

As I spent 4 hours yesterday cleaning one room at my mother's house, I was reminded of her and how it takes her 20 minutes. I now conclude she isn't really putting enough effort into cleaning her house if she only spends 20 minutes per room.

I think you're right that you spend more time on domestic chores than most people, and that probably includes a lot of SAHPs.

I guess a lot of us might question whether that extra time actually adds much value or whether it's just a waste of time or an inefficient approach. And a lot of us might think that life has much more to offer than this, so we would choose to live our lives differently.

But ultimately, value is subjective so it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks. It sounds like you get pleasure and a sense of achievement from investing the time that you do in your home, so it clearly works for you. And if it works for the rest of your family as well, that's great.

I still don't get your point. You're talking very specifically about your very particular life set up. Most SAHMs don't have loads of land or loads of dogs, or husband's that can afford to upkeep this lifestyle on a single salary. Good for you op. You sound like you have a very charmed life but are perhaps verging on OCD when it comes to housework.

Oh I really don’t know what you want at this point. You’ve already been faced with numerous posters here who have lots of different pets (horses and land included), with above average-sized houses in addition to children and working responsibilities, but because you’ve been told that they also manage to keep their house clean and “work with meat”, your description of your lifestyle just gets more and more grandiose each time you post. Next you’ll be telling us you live in Highclere Castle. You clearly have made up your mind that 1) all working parents detest SAHPs and 2) we all live in stinky hovels and spend any spare time putting chicken nuggets in the oven for our malnourished children.