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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Really long one about my DM (handhold please) **Content warning - domestic violence**

128 replies

Oversharingnamechanged · 29/07/2023 11:11

Hello, I'll try to keep this as brief as I can and even then it'll be long. I've cried writing this so please no picking at my spelling and grammar errors. I'm dyslexic and not as articulate as I'd like to be.

I also want to say before you do read I'm going to mention DV/SA/Child abuse, so please don't read anymore if this heavy stuff will upset you.

deep breath

My mother is in many ways wonderful, not the most empathic person but I love her.

My upbringing was however awful from years of extreme DV from my father, she was literally his daily punchbag, he verbally/mentally/sexually abused her and I almost saw her die at his hands from being strangled. He was verbally very abusive to me, but also sexually at times. He also had a friend from the pub who would sexually abuse me up until I was about 5. They were all alcoholics and this man would create fights between them to take me to bed. The worst memory I have is him asking me to season a dinner my mother made him, I kept asking, "enough?" And he said he'd tell me when. Once the chips had been drowned in salt and vinegar he called my dad into the living room and explained I'd purposely destroyed his meal, my father started kicking and punching my poor mother in a frenzy, so this monster could look like a hero by taking me to bed.

He'd also start fights when I wasn't there, I believe this sick bastard enjoyed watching my poor mother be beaten. Once he laughed and said, "how embarrassing" to her when she had a broken cheekbone and nose. He died when I was still too young to disclose what he did, but weirdly he went on to have a daughter he named my name, creepy fuck.

After years of abuse I finally decided in my teens after a ferocious attack on me from my father I was leaving. I had seen so much violence, begged her to leave since I was able to talk, I just couldn't do it anymore.

Now this is where it becomes hard between mum and I. I had survivors guilt my beatings weren't as severe as hers etc, but also, she would gaslight me throughout childhood saying she had to stay because I needed a dad.

I'd pray for him to die. I'd fantasise about killing him. If my mother would try and sleep in my bed for safety with me he would drag her out and beat and rape her.

He'd spit at or on us both. But still she was adamant it was me who needed a dad. When I was in my preteens I found our PC was riddled with child abuse images, one in particular I still get flashbacks seeing. I remember snooping how it was on there and He'd specifically searched a phrase that would bring up CSA images.

He'd threaten to kill us. He'd kick the living fuck out of our poor lovely dog.

But my whole life I was told by my mother I was the reason she was not leaving.

Sadly, we even had places to go. She just wouldn't leave. I understand the fear, but she also didn't want to be without him. She still maintains they had good times. I just must have not been privy to those since every good time I can remember then turned to them drinking and mother getting beaten up or worse.

Once I left at 14 after years of unexplained hospital admissions, years of things such as being ND missed, years of being made to lie and gaslit etc, years of living in poverty whilst they drank and smoked excessively. Years of being made to look on the outside like I was simply this weird, stupid, withdrawn idiot, it took me until I had my first DC at 19 to even remotely recover.

I got a job and a home, my mother stayed with her parents who she frankly terrified with her moodiness and unpleasant behaviour and entitlement towards their home and food etc, she never paid a penny towards a bill.

During my early years of motherhood she was cruel to me, basically projecting I was a shit mum, telling me constantly "I was just behaving like a sister". I had a fucking mortgage, full time job, I paid for childcare, we had days out, we baked, cooked, played, we had clean and calm surroundings, my DS is the loveliest kid I've ever known. I worked my arse off to get us living in an area with outstanding schools, for a single mother who left school at 13, with ND and trauma, I did fucking good. Messed up along the way, got into debts etc, but my boy is the loveliest person I know. She Once told her friends, "if I didn't like how she was looking after DGS, I'd take him off her and she'd not see him again", I was there. I've never been hurt so badly, so you're telling me you'd remove my son because you don't like my parenting when you'd let random men from your abusive alcoholic boyfriend put your toddler to bed? OK mum. Thanks.

Recent years the trauma of her life with him has set in and she became so dependent on me, but in a cruel way. She'd piss all over my boundaries and cry hysterically they'd been put in place.

I'd taken on a role of carer for my DGM, her mother, who lived with us 24/7. This included toileting her, helping her dress, every meal/snack/drink for her.

She wasn't an easy woman but I loved her and she wasn't someone who belonged in a nursing home, she was too rude to people, truth be told.

During this time I also had 2 children under 3 and it was the first lockdown, my DH still worked most days as a keyworker.

The only time to myself I had in 7 days over 24 hours was a Saturday morning. DH wasn't at work, so he'd get up and sort breakfast for gran and our DC, allowing me to have some sleep, (I was still night feeding our youngest) or have a bath and just relax. My mother truly begrudged me this, now I see this reads as silly, but please understand we have a very odd relationship. Mother had DH's number obviously and her mother's, but instead would call me 7 plus times, as she felt I was taking the piss out of DH on a Saturday morning. If I didn't pick up she'd pop round and create murder until I was out of the bath and dressed.

This became so unfair that during one of her doctors appointments I attended with her I began to cry, saying I could do 6 and a half days a week, night or day, but i just wanted some time not to be making drinks or breakfast (I obviously would get up and take my gran the toilet and get her washed and dressed prior to going off for a soak and podcast, that wasn't ever an issue!) Anyway, her doctor said to her, "DM, your DD is caring for 3 DC and your DM, why on earth are you sabotaging the one break a week she gets? Why is it so upsetting for you that she has 2 hours of time to paint her nails?" And mother cried, "nobody would have given me this time!" And stormed out. I apologised to doctor and left, she rang me a day later to say, "oversharingnamechanged, you can take a horse to the lake, but you can't force it to drink". My DM also took away consent after this for me to discuss anything with her doctor again.

Up until my gran died, she hounded me on the weekend mornings, once she died I stopped giving a fuck and just didn't even bother. Of course once I stopped caring or wanting that time to myself, she never rang me.

My mother will cry nobody has ever done anything for her. Let me tell you this.

Her dinner service, cutlery, utensils, tea towels, drink canisters, microwave, kettle, toaster, sofa, curtains, TV, TV unit, sideboard, nest of tables, nice bedding, mattress, rugs, multiple cars, plants, picture frames and mirrors, I have bought for her, she's chosen, I've paid. Things such as towels etc too, not as birthday or Christmas gifts, just because I want to make her happy. I know I've been stupid, but please remember, when your formative years are badly ingrained images of your mother's face hanging off, you don't really ever want to see your dm upset or want for anything. She once cried at me in our local supermarket when she was out of work she had no money to eat, so I took her for a food shop, once there she cried like a toddler she didn't need "fucking food" and just wanted gin, tonic and cigarettes. She even threw out the trolley a loaf of bread I'd put in, saying at least get that so you can have toast, but she refused and said she'd rather a cheap bottle of wine instead.
I was so embarrassed I caved.

Don't get me wrong, when she's had money she's been more than generous to me also, truly she has.

After my grandmother died, I lost a baby, it was quite complicated and I required surgery. There was one day my friend took our DC out for us so DH and I could cry and just process the shit that had happened. Plus the surgery had been quite painful so we'd planned to just have a cuddle, have some lunch, be together on the rare few hours we had child free.

I rang her prior, to explain that we were spending a day to just grieve. So just text if there are any issues and I'd get back to her, but please no ringing.

So she showed up, I'd been crying heavily and was in my bed, she walked in, came into my room and I said, "please, not today, its just for us". So she went downstairs in a mood, made herself a cup of tea and started moaning about me to DH, saying how unwelcome I made her feel and how she'd lost a DGC and I was being selfish. Now DH does love her and he treats her so well and he wouldn't ever snap at her because of her past with my father, but even he struggled to keep his cool. She really just can't accept boundaries.

Anyway, fast forward and its last Xmas, she had been desperately wanting a particular breed of dog, we discussed in depth why a pensioner dog would be easier or at least a smaller breed. No, she had a tantrum and I caved, got her the large breed she wanted. I also bought her a massive crate to train this puppy with and tons of other things. She off the bat let this puppy just go wild, unfortunately never used the crate or training techniques etc, so she has an oversized dog that she cannot control. This is relevant later on.

So come Christmas last year, she fell out with me. She refused to come for Xmas and it absolutely destroyed me. I've cooked her Xmas Dinner since I was 18 and for my gran, so I really struggled but I also said after that, after asking her repeatedly to change her mind and be spoken to like shit, that I'd not be ever again putting myself in this position and from now on Xmas was mine and my dh and our DC. She texted me on boxing day, "hi love, can you send DH with some roasties pls?" No acknowledgement of what she'd done, just wanting food.

I was just broken.

A few months ago she said she was going to put her unruly dog in kennels so she could come here for this coming Christmas. I explained after last year, I'm not hosting again. We'd visit Xmas day if she wanted, I'd even make her dinner up and her usual Xmas hamper, but it wasn't going to be the "stay the week and let me spoil you" event. She cried and said she understood why I was saying this, but since then has simply ignored it by asking, "So are we having turkey this year or shall we change it?" So she hasn't fully accepted that I will not be hosting.

This seems so silly and I can only apologise if you've read this so far.

Now, I understandably don't ask for child care or really for much. However I had an appointment last week which required just DH and I, no DC. His family are far away and being summer hols, no friends had the time. Often our oldest DC can step in if it's a ten minute shop or something but it was going to be almost 3 hours and it's his holiday too.

Last time my DC went to my mums her dog playfully bit my DC and really scared him, we've never sent them again without either DH or I there. I asked her if she could mind my youngest DC for 3 hours tops, but specified that the muzzle on the dog wasn't negotiable. She agreed to keep DDog muzzled.

For what was only in the end just over 2 hours, it wasn't a problem, and the dog can still drink etc or alternatively go in her cage.

I do love her DDog, she's just large and untrained and very playfully snappy.

So DH picked up our DC, but the dog wasn't muzzled and had been snapping at DC's fingers. Again, as large as the DDog is, she's still a pup and it's not aggressive, but she does have food aggression and I've seen her properly snap. I'm not comfortable with DDog being unmuzzled around my small DC.

DC came home, they'd had a lovely day but the dog hurt his finger.
I texted DM thanking her for having the DC, told her they had a lovely time but they won't be coming again, as she'd said the muzzle would be kept on. I asked her for space as I knew I'd get text abuse, so she replied with her, "take care" which is code for I'm being exiled.

The next day after I'd had some space I rang her, told her a funny story involving DC, then said I wasn't being horrible with not sending the kids again without DH or I, anyway, she started screaming and swearing at me, and after everything, after ever last opportunity to not be awful to me. I just told her I want NC. She said fine.

And the guilt already, (she only has me, no friends etc) but she couldn't keep my DC safe. Not for less than 3 hours. She kept screaming "nothing fucking happened!", but I honestly don't think it was her choice to take that risk. She's said repeatedly she doesn't know about the dog snapping my DC's fingers, but that's proving surely she can't be paying enough attention to not have a muzzle on her dog?

Anyway I've blocked her from everything, she's been blocked off whatsapp for years, if I was online she'd call me, jokingly "oh you're online!" But I do have other people I talk to there and it was stopping me having friendships with others because I'd be too anxious to open a bloody message in case she called me. I have another novel in me about her behaviour towards me having friends, but if I've painted a picture for you here, you'll probably have guessed she doesn't like me having friendships. One of her favourite lines is, "if you paid the same attention to your DC as you do your friends" which is grossly unfair but has been something she's weaponised to make me feel guilty as a mum.

She has been cruel and grabby with her own no ex- friends and I'm deeply embarrassed by how she's treated them.

But now, I'm in hell with guilt and sadness. She doesn't have anyone but me.
I will mentally torture myself over this.

I also should add I'm due a baby in a month or so and she's been crying at me 24/7 daily over her awful life, I asked her a few months ago, (my pregnancy is very high risk for both baby and I) could she just kindly just let me have a bit of time to get through my scary pregnancy without making unnecessary (and it always is) unnecessary drama for me to sort.

It's always me being spoken to like shit, to then be told I'm abusive to her like my dad was, I bully her with my boundaries and it's unfair of me to ask for space from calls when she has nobody else.

Every therapist I've had has told me it's an unsustainable relationship, her doctors have, she was horrible to my grandmother. But yet to me she's my hero, the woman who dealt with so much but still worked several jobs and kept my clothes clean etc.

The lying, gaslighting, shouting at me, using me for money and anything else, it's just been my whole life.

But I really think the guilt of not checking she's okay is so crippling I might need more bloody counselling over it.

If you even read this, thank you. If you're NC with your own DM and can give me advice, thank you.

Another anxious apology for length on this post. This was as brief as I could make it and I've left out huge massive details.

OP posts:
TheoTheopolis23 · 31/07/2023 18:08

Over, you are very welcome.

Posters threads often rattle around my head and I always think of something and think "I should have written that!", then write another post - to the point where I've been told off for my prolific posting on here lol.

I'm so sorry about what you've had inflicted on you by people (who don't deserve the description of "people") and I'm in awe at what you've achieved in spite of it.
You are a very strong person.

TheoTheopolis23 · 31/07/2023 18:14

scoopoftheday · 31/07/2023 17:53

@TheoTheopolis23 I wish there was a like button.

Your posts are so insightful.

Thank you

I'm really sorry you were subjected to similar experiences to the op.

Oversharingnamechanged · 31/07/2023 21:55

Every person who's shared with me and let me talk, given opinions and helped me make some sense of my struggles, you've done something to not just help me, but my children.

I have usually caved and rang her by now and this time I'm feeling stronger than I ever have before.

Sad, tired, guilty. But stronger!

OP posts:
SquishyGloopyBum · 31/07/2023 22:01

Wow op, the more I read the worse she gets.

But I am in awe of you. You have overcome so much that no one should ever have to go through. Even your father trying to strangle you which seems fairly recent.

Christmas is also a triggering time for me- it's portrayed as a happy family time and when that's not your loved experience, you feel it more keenly then. Especially as a child.

I think therapy will be helpful for you. And perhaps EMDR. I'm having it for trauma with my alcoholic father and it seems to help.

Whenever you have a wobble and think you should call etc, read back this thread. It will help.

NC really is the only way for you. You have nothing to feel guilty about. You owe her nothing.

You got this. Be proud of who you are.

Crunchingleaf · 31/07/2023 22:50

Well done OP for not contacting her. Change is impossible for her because in order to change she would have to acknowledge and accept what she has done. The things she has done are too terrible to admit to.

For a long time I tried to figure out what was reason behind my mother’s terrible behaviour towards me. I had lovely DGP too so was stumped. Accepting the reason doesn’t matter is important step in acceptance that there will never be a happy mother daughter relationship.

I can see why Christmas would be hard in relation to your fathers death. You didn’t get to have a proper father and so it’s perfectly reasonable for you to grieve for the father you should have had and the father you deserved.

Your feelings are valid and honestly you don’t have to justify them to anyone especially her.

Oversharingnamechanged · 03/08/2023 08:46

Hi all, hope you're well.

Still staying strong with the NC.

However she rang my DH and told him she didn't want contact with me anymore as I'm awful to her and lie about how things actually happened in my childhood etc, she also said that "it was the dogs home" not mine of her DC and the shouldn't be muzzled in her own home.
She agreed prior to my DC going over she'd keep the dog muzzled. I didn't kick off or shout or scream, I just said that's fine but they're not going again. Nobody said she couldn't see them etc, just not to be around her unruly, large, dog without a muzzle. I don't take risks with my children's safety or wellness, nor it is anyone else's decision to do so on my children's behalf.

I said something to DH after speaking to you friends on this thread and I explained many things I've wanted to do, I've never managed because of mums disapproval.
If I wear brightly coloured eyeshadow, she sulks. If I wear clothes I enjoy, she scowls. She only likes my hair lightened, I prefer to be my natural reddish colour.
Weight is also an issue, if I lose she goes on about it so excessively I just stop trying as it becomes the topic of every conversation and makes me deeply uncomfortable to continue getting healthy.
If I decorate my home in colours I like, she's rude about them.

I might not have contact with her, it may hurt, but there is apart of me that knows the freedom I'll get from NC also, I might even be able to get into shape and buy myself some clothes I'll enjoy for the first time without that looming fear of dread I'm just going to be stared at like I'm a freakshow for not just wearing jeans.

In the sadness there is relief and also excitement.

I thank you all again. Small steps with end of tunnel light is all I can do for now.

OP posts:
SquishyGloopyBum · 03/08/2023 10:31

I'm pleased you are staying strong and have opened up to your DH.

Watch out for flying monkeys - ie using others to contact you/still try and control. I suggest your DH also blocks contact with her too.

Crunchingleaf · 03/08/2023 10:31

Well done OP. Feel proud of yourself. Have you considered getting your DH to block her too. So she has no way to indirectly abuse you.
Another thing is OP you don’t need to justify yourself to us or to anyone about the dog. You know from bitter experience that your mother has very poor judgment so naturally you don’t trust her fully around the DC. She once again proved she can’t be trusted by not sticking to her word. It sounds very much like she can’t accept responsibility for her own actions and it’s a waste of effort trying to reason with her.

Think of all the free time you will have when you’re not trying to make her happy.

Go get you hair done and buy the clothes you like. Be the real you.

Oversharingnamechanged · 03/08/2023 11:22

@Crunchingleaf I over apologise, I over thank and over justify everything I do or say.
I'm a regular user who NC for this, and often I get people telling me "don't explain yourself, you're an adult" etc, and I'm truly hopeful these behaviours I can work on.
Thank you 😊

OP posts:
Cherrysoup · 03/08/2023 11:47

Stay strong, OP, it’s frankly a bloody miracle you’re sane. Stay nc, get your Dh to block her, don’t let her near your dc! You sound brilliant, keep being an awesome mum!

Oversharingnamechanged · 03/08/2023 11:52

That's so lovely of you, thanks 😊

OP posts:
Crunchingleaf · 03/08/2023 11:59

I know exactly why you do it. I still apologise for things that completely weren’t my fault. It’s ingrained into me from childhood. You have done so well to get where you are in life and become the person you are. As a complete stranger on the internet I think it is important to let you know you’re doing great and are definitely not the problem here. So many of us that grew up in homes with DA internalised what happened and blamed ourselves for it. Our parents whose duty it was to protect us happily rewrite history and let us carry the burden of the past alone.

TheoTheopolis23 · 03/08/2023 12:18

Yet more selfishness, foolishness, idiocy, risk taking, unreasonable behaviour etc. from a definite candidate for the worst mother in the UK.

TheoTheopolis23 · 03/08/2023 12:35

Btw I was perplexed about how she managed to eventually leave your father; but since you've posted about how that happened, I can see now that she didn't actually choose to leave him.

Her friend, her boss etc becoming aware (after no doubt suspecting he was violent towards her) that he was now seriously assaulting you meant that she got backed into a corner re. leaving him (or rather having to appear to leave him). You were spear heaving leaving, they were helping, the boss was offering by the deposit and other expenses etc; she was backed into a corner and knew she'd look like a truly fucking shit mother if she said 'well, Over can move out (at 14) on her own or move in with her grandparents, I'm staying with him, the man who's beaten her up"). She felt she couldn't not move out ..... But she reconciled herself to it only as a temporary/superficial action; that's why she was back asking you to let him move in with you both and give things a fresh start, not that long after.

Thats why she never ceased contact with him, and to the contrary was helping him out & funding his expenses. She never intended that move to be real, it was a front - for her friend, boss etc. If you'd agreed to it, she'd have had your father back in the (new) home, and back battering her and now you too. She was happy to pretend to herself (and she the huge risk) that he wouldn't be physically violent towards either of you again.

So, you probably don't need it pointed out, but in assessing just what your mother is like, I think it's crucial to keep in mind that she never intentionally, by choice - left your severely abusive father (who was now battering you too).

TheoTheopolis23 · 03/08/2023 12:36

*and take the huge risk

TheoTheopolis23 · 03/08/2023 12:40

She was also savvy enough to not push the "let's have him move in here, it'll be a fresh start" too hard; because now that other people were aware and invested, there was always the chance that you'd tell them she'd moved him in (or was pressuring you hard to let him move in).

I'm surprised she didn't move him in/go back to living with him when you left at 17 - had he moved on to someone else by then?

Whatishedoing · 26/11/2023 14:32

Really hope you’re ok @Oversharingnamechanged x

Oversharingnamechanged · 26/11/2023 15:12

@Whatishedoing thank you so much x

It's been a tough time. When I wrote this thread I was still pregnant and I've since had the baby, mum was absolutely vile during my pregnancy and I gave birth 2 months early. Whilst that's not her fault, the stress she was adamant to cause probably didn't help me.
Luckily baby was absolutely fine and we came home after just over a week in hospital.

My mum has since kicked off and told my other half that I've lied about my childhood to get her away from him and my DC to leave her lonely. She called me a fucking princess and said "I've won" repeatedly last time we spoke. The resentment she has for me shines through. It was actually my birthday this week and she sent a card which was extremely passive aggressive. I'm going to continue with grey rock. This thread has been invaluable to me and I wish I could thank everyone in a valuable way, because everyone who commented with advice and support has been invaluable to me.

OP posts:
pickledandpuzzled · 26/11/2023 15:36

Oh dear, @Oversharingnamechanged

I’ve reread all your posts. It really is the most shocking thing I’ve ever read. You should be very proud of everything you’ve achieved, despite her sabotage and your own damaged boundaries after years of abuse.

You could do with reducing contact even more. She’s attempting to abuse you still.

Did you mention in your first post that you are neurodivergent? Reading the description of her seemingly deliberately doing the things you ask her not to, puts me in mind of PDA somehow. I have no specialist knowledge so could be miles off.

Have you accepted that she’s broken, unable to be the mum you need, and indeed Successfully auditioning for ‘worst mum ever’?

I honestly think you are lucky to be alive. You have survived against the odds, no thanks to her. Do whatever you can to keep her away from your DH and DC. No one else should be screwed up by her.

Rec0veringAcademic · 26/11/2023 16:10

You poor thing. How you have managed to keep going, I cannot even begin to understand.

As to your mother: I think you have basically canonized her for the abuse she had. But not all abuse survivors deserve respect, especially if they leave their own children as collateral damage and even blame them for the abuse.

If there is a hero in this story, that hero is YOU.

CubaLibre23 · 26/11/2023 16:21

Oversharingnamechanged · 26/11/2023 15:12

@Whatishedoing thank you so much x

It's been a tough time. When I wrote this thread I was still pregnant and I've since had the baby, mum was absolutely vile during my pregnancy and I gave birth 2 months early. Whilst that's not her fault, the stress she was adamant to cause probably didn't help me.
Luckily baby was absolutely fine and we came home after just over a week in hospital.

My mum has since kicked off and told my other half that I've lied about my childhood to get her away from him and my DC to leave her lonely. She called me a fucking princess and said "I've won" repeatedly last time we spoke. The resentment she has for me shines through. It was actually my birthday this week and she sent a card which was extremely passive aggressive. I'm going to continue with grey rock. This thread has been invaluable to me and I wish I could thank everyone in a valuable way, because everyone who commented with advice and support has been invaluable to me.

I was Theo, op. I've nc'd.

Many congratulations on your new baby. Sorry you had to go to through the stress of a premature arrival.

I think your DH needs to block your "mother".

I think you all do.

She can claim you're lying ... Because then it's her word against yours and you probably have no way of proving anything. She knows this, so she's decided her best approach (now that you're finally telling about some of the stuff she did to you or facilitated being done to you) is to claim you're a liar and try to gas light you and others that it didn't happen.

You cannot win with her.

She doesn't deserve a family. She's very much made her bed, let her lie in it. Let her try to work her narcissistic manipulative BS on whoever she can for company; because she doesn't deserve yours.

She is a truly exceptionally nasty piece of work and I know it's very hard, when its your sole remaining parent, but NC is the only way to go for your mental health.

DungareesAndTrombones · 26/11/2023 16:24

She didn't safeguard you and she won't safeguard your children OP so you have to. You need to go no contact with her before she destroys your life. I'm so sorry for what you have been through but you need to be strong for a bit longer and cut all ties.

CubaLibre23 · 26/11/2023 16:26

I honestly think you are lucky to be alive

That was my conclusion from this thread too.

You are alive and in a decent relationship entirely in spite of her; appreciate it and enjoy it. You'll be able to do that fully when you're not hearing the latest ridiculous shit she's coming out with.

Oh I forgot about the dog - how can she be lonely with a dangerous dog to keep her company, one who's more important than her grandkids because it's "his home" so he shouldn't be put outside or muzzled for their safety while they're there.
The dog is clearly more important than safety of consideration of respect for you and your kids; so let him keep her company.

CubaLibre23 · 26/11/2023 16:36

told my other half that I've lied about my childhood to get her away from him and my DC

Interesting that she mentions him.

For most women, their SIL or DDS partner would be secondary, almost irrelevant; someone who comes with the package. Their DD would be their primary relationship.
And maybe the grandkids.

But she mentions him, someone who should be relatively secondary/irrelevant; seems like she's still all about the attention and contact with men. As she has always been.

She should be devastated that she's not on good terms with and not seeing her DD; instead she's like "that bitch has lied to get me away from you (SIL) and grandkids".
What mother gives her relationship with her sil such significance?? My Mum (whom is by no means mum of the year) nonetheless sees her sil's as supplementary/by the by; her relationship and focus is with her daughter's.
She is polite & friendly to them and thoughtful towards them, but it's a relationship that is leagues below that with her dd's. If she wasn't seeing her sil's regularly any more for whatever reason, it wouldnt even fizz on her, let alone accusations of her DD getting her away from him.

As before, she says a lot without meaning to. She's still focused on the man in the scenario and she's still trying to put you in the role of a rival/obstructor.

CubaLibre23 · 26/11/2023 16:51

Even just the sheer nerve of someone who would go to someone (who's only related by marriage) who clearly loves, is committed to, has a family with a woman etc. And say "she's a liar. Anything bad she's said about me/her childhood is lies" ... And "she's lying to stop me having a relationship with you (again, how weird; mil sil relationships are fairly low tier/incidental to normal people, the important relationship is between the parent and their child) and with your children".

In other words ... You're married to a liar and you're married to someone who has bizarre issues wherein they don't want their mother being on good terms with their husband or kids.
Really, how many ppl don't want their mother to have a civil relationship with their partner and a working relationships with their kids?? No-one normal. So she's calling you abnormal too. She may as well be saying "she's insane, she's lies about stuff and makes it up, she wants to isolate her mother from her family for no reason".

Does she not even think that your h might think "fuck off", or "maybe you're the one with the problem" or 'my life partner is not a liar or needlessly cruel". Or even 'you wouldn't even safeguard my kids from a dangerous dog".

He knows you. The fact that she'd even try this shit on him shows she's as delusional and "naive" and narc-y as ever. This woman will never change.

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