April 2023 -"Well we took you to Stately Homes"

I moved out to uni at 18, they sent me money every month (they were required by law in the country I lived in) in addition to a student loan I had taken out

My mother told everybody when I was aged 10 and my primary headmaster told her that I was university material. Then I actually GOT a uni place and she realised she'd have to contribute (not much, she was a widow and £ 10 a month but this was the early 70s). I even said I'd not take it up if it was too expensive but nope, I was going.

And had that £ 10 a month held over my head for 30 years, to me and other people. How much my education had cost her (she didn't cut the drinking down to cover it, as far as I know) Sometimes I felt like transferring the three year's worth over to her just to shut her up (not that it would have). Meanwhile I was spending 000s on airfares to travel to Australia to see her after she emigrated. She never asked if I could afford that.

University is a problem for jealous mothers you are not allowed to do better then then. Mine told me if I wanted to go to university somewhere else I could never come back home and I believed her so stayed local, then they refused to pay their share of my grant (was days before student loans) even though they charged me rent and told me every week that my course was a load of rubbish. Not sure how she knew that as she never once took any interest in it and was pleased when I dropped out

@MadamePickle oh absolutely. Probably had a personality disorder to begin with and perhaps it was always inevitable, but I don't believe her parents were the saints people are making them out to be.

My husband's mother died, and we got our lawyer to contact his sibling (NC) to manage the estate as my DH wants some items he owns back as well, only to be told he is 'disinherited' as of 30 days before she died. She did a will specifically to do that. One last vestige of control, but the written nature of parental rejection is crushing, I have no idea how best to support him. He wasn't in touch with his mother, she was awful and cruel, controlling and never allowed him any boundaries - even sleeping in the same room well into adulthood, forcing his sister to go through his internet history knowing what she'd find when he was a teen. And yet it still hurts, despite only wanting his own possessions, to see that. I am full of anger, she did not deserve the wonderful son she somehow failed to destroy despite all her best efforts and I feel bitterly pleased at her passing and the nature of it.

May sound like I'm a bad person, I know, but my god she was abusive and foul.

@Shortbread49 same! my parents also said I could only go to university locally and would have to live at home. I wish I knew it was all about controlling what I do, who I see and how I behaved back then. I had quite a bad time at university socially and finally managed to move to a new city to do my masters, after working and saving for 3 years. I still live in that city 20 years later. I am glad I made that decision as that one decision helped me turn my life around, with lots of work on my self confidence (it's ongoing work).

Hearing that voice of never being good enough since day one takes a lot of work to undo and manages to appear out of nowhere sometimes.

@Asthebellcurves you are not awful AT ALL for feeling what you feel. She sounds like a witch. With your husband be a good listener (sure you are) and back up his right to feel sad / angry.

Sending hugs.

In Monkey Towers, we are going to Scotland tomorrow to see SIL and dns. Hag has just phoned to sprinkle magic dust 😂

Hag: were you going to ring me before you went away?
Mr Monkey: no, it's a short weekend, I don't ring you constantly and I've got loads to do.
Hag: charming.
Lots of bitterness about us going. She's seen her grandsons - now in 20s - 5 times in their lives as she's bitter and twisted.

She hangs up in a rage.

THEN rings back, stays silent on the phone BREATHING (unfortunately)

MM hangs up. Truly she is a total mentalitist. What used to hurt MM deeply just makes him exasperated and want to see her / hear from her less and less.

Hugs to all dealing with toxic families.

@MonkeyfromManchester Good on your DH for hanging up. Deep breathing on the phone would probably have freaked out your children when they were younger. Sounds like you've been on such a journey, sounds like your children are old enough to see things as they are, but navigating that when they were younger must have been a challenge if they had questions.

I read through the threads regularly, it's comforting to know we're not alone in this. Toxic parents was a great help to my DH, and he sees a therapist twice a week. I offer him space to talk, I listen, I'm interested in his thoughts and ideas, but we've never hit anger - just what seems like endless sadness. It's heartbreaking. I'm so grateful my own parents love him and are interested in him as a person. When he finally got some understanding of his childhood, and started setting boundaries, he also lost some friends who didn't like that he had developed some preferences e.g. not being demeaned in conversations, not having his birthday cancelled at last minute. Some people are attracted to people they can push around, and can somehow sense it in people.

Quite a few colleagues have had children get their GCSE results today. One didn't do so well, and colleague was saying "I told her I still love you, you tried, I still love you"; I overheard them call home and being kind and saying they'd get a take away for tea as a pick me up.

Even after all this time, it still hurts to hear parents being kind and supportive parents. My GCSE results were good, despite moving schools partway through and having to deal with my mother's mental health. My A Levels weren't so good, what with dealing with the same again. My degree result was good. But never acknowledged, always a disappointment.

@Frontroomroomjungle I would feel the same. Good results never acknowledged. Always criticism about the smallest thing. Never celebrating any achievements. Or making your achievements hers. It all comes back to me every single years kids receive their leaving cert results.

@MonkeyfromManchester THEN rings back, stays silent on the phone BREATHING (unfortunately) 😂
You made my day with this.
I love the way you write.

@girlswillbegirls thank you very much. Seriously tempted to write about her BUT NO ONE WOULD BELIEVE ME! She's like a warped Mrs Brown.

I get this too - parents being nice and supportive to their children. It stings because I didn't receive this.

I was a good student, but I did get some C's (not in exams) and was told it was terrible and how I didn't study enough.

Then I worked to avoid getting any C ever again and went straight A* only for it to be brushed under the rug. Was the first to go to uni too. Never got mentioned and I don't think my parents ever congratulated me when I received my Masters. When I started work I used to tell them about my promotions and it was met with silence.

It is the knowing on a visceral level that achievements get ignored but god forbid you ever put a foot wrong and you'd never hear the end of it. It's the imbalance between lack of praise and constant criticism that made this so damaging.

My abiding memory of GCSE results is getting one D, the rest being C or above, and the one comment from my parents was about their disappointment with the D grade. It took until about 3 years ago to realise that no matter what level of study I got to, it would never be enough for them (yes I persisted in trying to make them proud all the way up to a PhD)!

@Twatalert yes what you say about the imbalance between achievements being ignored and any little error being jumped all over resonates. It's exhausting trying to earn attention for positive things, and even more exhausting being on hyper alert for the next vicious swipe.

As ever, thanks and I'm sorry you experienced this too to everyone who's shared their experience. It's depressing how similar these narc parents are.

😂😂

My GCSE results were compared to my golden child older sisters. They weren’t as good as hers and therefore a disappointment. For my A-levels I doubled down and got all As and guess what? Nothing was said. It was as if it hadn’t happened. It’s sad that as children we tried to get attention or love in this way.

My father in particular used to criticise the way I walk and my facial expression as we walked through the supermarket for a big shop. As if I could help it. WTF is wrong with these people? They might as well have criticised the natural colour of my hair. I wonder to this day what this shit was about and whether my mother fed this BS to him and he was just a flying monkey. Will never now. I remember how it crushed me to be told to put on a different facial expression as a vulnerable teenager.

I got criticised for everything even positive things if I styled my hair differently got told it looked stupid, if I chose my own clothes (she didn’t like that) fit told they did suit me, if I came top in a maths test at school I got ignored for the day. My lovely son played his guitar for them
age 7 and when he finished they laughed at him

@MonkeyfromManchester I love your writing too. Sorry, that sounds deeply inappropriate because at the heart of your posts is a frightened and bewildered little boy at the mercy of a cruel sadist. But you are helping him to be a free and worthwhile man who does an important and worthwhile job. Your story and the way you share it gives hope and smiles to many in very sad circumstances.

I actually think that your posts, compiled together in date order, would make a wonderful read.

And what a great parting shot for The Hag. A book all about her antics. "The world will know what you did". Enough to rightly chill any abuser, I would think.

How go the Christmas plans? Have you got your cheapest table hasty-meal booked yet?

Have a wonderful time in Scotland.

@Twatalert OMG I used to get the facial expression thing too. He would go red in the face and into a silent rage because we didn't look happy enough or some such bollocks. (He also criticised my hair, dress sense, height, clothing size, voice and personality. He once smashed my mother's plate at the dinner table because she was breathing too loudly). What a prat.

@REP22 not inappropriate at all. You sum up perfectly the situation. She’s a sick and twisted person.

the subject of Xmas has not yet come up, but Sept is just round the corner when the BS starts. My brother and his family will be over from overseas at Xmas so this could be woven into a wonderful excuse. The alternative is The Hag locked in a cage with Turkey sandwiches pushed through the bars.

we are now in Scotland crashed in our hotel. Since arriving, Mr Monkey had three phone calls from the Hag demanding SIL’s number.

This isn’t because Hag wants to speak to SIL - DILS are not liked - but because Hag wants to soak up adoration for the cash bribes she sent us up to Bonny Scotland with for the DIL she resents and the grandsons she never sees or rings.

Hag does have DIL number but MM had to dictate number and when that didn’t work, phone SIL to say ring Hag. this is about involving us in the drama.

At this point I left to drink 12 bottles of sauv. Before heading out to hang out with fellow weather beaten old soaks in an Aberdeen boozer, Hag had rung twice as SIL hadn’t phoned IMMEDIATELY.

I predict a number of calls this weekend as Hag is livid thst the family are gathered without her. SIL asked over lunch about all Hag’s medical appointments as she’s now in and out of hospital. We put SIL straight on the medical front e.g., none of that is true. It’s becoming more and more apparent what a mythomaniac the Bitch is.

Please how can I improve my confidence. I was always put down till going nc at 41. I had a supervision at work and they said im shy and have no confidence, I actually thought I was confident ive only been there 3 months now. Im still learning. Its made me feel awful. And also why am I even trying. I feel broken and I dont know why.

“You should be more positive”
“why does your face look like that?”
“you always look unhappy”
”you should be grateful”

Hearing all this while experiencing a traumatic childhood made me think there was something wrong with me until I was a young adult.

It took 4 years of therapy to understand what had happened. I genuinely didn’t know where all my anxiety and depression was coming from before therapy. I had normalised so many behaviours and experiences. I also believed that I was the problem. I though I was not good enough and generally a weirdo with an attitude problem as well as being overly sensitive. For so long I carried myself that way, almost like an invitation to be a doormat because I had such little self worth. It feels like a lifetimes worth of work to break this feeling. I am so much better but still have more healing to do.

I was also bullied due to racism by other children and sometimes adults. Not having much support from my family made me a shadow of myself by the time I was 12.

I sometimes do a bit of time travel in my head and give my younger self a big hug.

There are people who helped me - a couple of teachers and friends along the way. Without even knowing what I was going through. Sometimes I reflect on the profound impact they had on me at difficult times, probably unknowingly.

The ignoring or ridiculing of achievements thing is horrible. When I got my first graduate job and the company made me business cards (old school!), I gave one to my mum. She threw it on the floor and said ‘what’s the point! You are such a disappointment to us. All you care about is flirting with boys” I had met someone (my now husband) and they didn’t approve because they wanted to arrange a marriage for me. They also didn’t approve because he was a different race.

When I applied to do a masters in a different city after being in this job and told my parents about the application. They said ‘oh so now you want to go to another city away from us so you can go around with lots of men” I was so embarrassed and humiliated. I was hurt that they couldn’t see my ambition and just Ignored my interests and passion. I saved for 3 years, applied, got offered a scholarship and moved.

These two events though also sent me into a fairly bad depression while I was saving for those three years.

I now have kids and support them fully in their passions. I introduce them to lots of things and get excited when they find something they love. I help them pursue it and celebrate both their successes but also their efforts. I always tell them I love them and all of this is not about impressing me but finding their own way. Trying, failing, succeeding and loving things as one big journey. I hope my way of parenting raises content and kind people.

@MonkeyfromManchester oh lord, there's never a moment's respite, is there? Might there be a Caledonia-wide power/network outage with complete signal-downfall? I daresay the last thing SIL wants is a verbal Hagfest on her own airtime and expense.

Somehow I envisage The Hag as looking not unlike Zelda off of Terrahawks. But perhaps that does fair Zelda a disservice.

Enjoy your sauv and your time with SIL and nephews. Very best wishes to you and MM. x