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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Still suspicious of possible affair, months on....

102 replies

loves2walk · 13/05/2010 18:18

I have posted my situation here before a few months ago under 'How do I tell if my DH is having, or about to have an affair' and I'm just back now for more advice.

Nothing has changed - briefly my DH admitted an attraction to someone he works with and socialises with, a single woman with 'boundary problems'. He then spent a couple of months being odd, secretive about his phone, cranky with me and DSs, emotionally detached from me and not intimate, aggressive a couple of times and very very stressed. Said it was all work and there was some truth in this, and we were also moving house. However he would be really cross if I questionned him going along to an out-of-work event that she was involved in - like drinks after work or football, he just would not allow me to express upset about those things and dismissed me as being 'ridiculous'. So I stopped mentioning it and quietly gritted my teeth, as I wanted the bad atmosphere to go away, not to make it worse.

So after loads of fabulous advice on here I tried snooping and did not get far at all. No idea of email password, blackberry blocked, no evidence on visa cards. Nothing. A RL friend suggested looking him in the eye and asking him to be honest and tell everything - she does not get him at all. He would not admit an affair as he has too much to lose. He loves me, loves DC, has been through 1 marriage breakup already and does not want to go through another. So I believe he stopped the affair to protect his marriage and family. BTW we were great before this started - happy, regular sex, every friday night out as couple, even a few nights away on own, so not a marriage in trouble at all, I didn't think.

BUT I am now struggling to get over this and let him back in. I can't be the same with him. I don't laugh genuinely at jokes, I can't connect emotionally with him and I don't want him to touch me. If I tell him why, he will deny everything so I feel there is no point opening up to him.

So I have carried on snooping and was really hopeful that I could get into his blackberry to read txts and emails. Then I did. I found his password in an old filofax of mine and I had an opportunity with him out and his phone left behind to go through it. My heart was pounding. I saw loads of boring work emails, quite a few friendly warm txts but nothing incriminating. The friendly txts were very cosy and intimate even but nothing that would show any inappropriate behaviour and if I mentioned them to him, would make me look paranoid and blow my cover and make him hide even more from me. Atleast he is relaxed enough to leave his phone lying around. But both txts and emails stopped showing beyond a few weeks - there was no way to scroll down further. I know he clears out his in-trays so I am now realising this is not the answer I hoped it would be. I can't think of other ways to find out for sure and am wondering how other people have found out about affairs. Short of getting him (or her!) blind drunk, then asking for confession I just feel stuck

OP posts:
dittany · 13/05/2010 23:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

dignified · 13/05/2010 23:41

Your advice about the blackberry, dittany, would cause so much hassle. He would be so offended if I asked him there and then to give me access to email and texts. He would be furious. But then I think he would have been even years ago when there was no OW on scene. I realise that's unreasonable,

Yes it is, and it was unreasonable of him to tell you he fancied her and spend time with her while you still provided domestic service. It was unreasonable for him to not take your feelings seriously and to not stop spending time with her, its unreasonable for him to not PROVE to you that hes not having an affair, and its unreasonable you cant discuss it, and unreasonablethere still in contact.

As i said op, ive been where you are, and youd be horrified at how long i snooped for and how long i put up with being treated with such lack of respect i was not able to discuss something that had me in tears on a regular basis.

The damage has been done here , and the damage to you also . You say you dont want to risk ruining a perfectly good relationship on the basis of your instincts that could be wrong.

What is good about a relationship where your husband tells you he fancys someone, spends time with her, doesnt think about your feelings and refuses to discuss it? You sound wary of raising this with him, again that doesnt sound like a good relationship to me, your not being heard or respected.

Youve recently seen cosy intimate texts between the two of them, why is this not up for discussion? You know what you know op, maybe your just not ready to really know it just yet, i sympathise, i really do.

dignified · 13/05/2010 23:47

Really Estuardo?

" Estuardo, ive got feelings for someone at work, i really fancy her, im going to go off and spend time with her regardles of what you think and were going to send each other cosy secret texts. ".

( sea lion type of clapping coming from estuardo)

Admitting it isnt a problem, it happens all the time. But then they usually stay away if they value their marriage.

estuardo · 13/05/2010 23:53

That is NOT what happened.

WHy do you feel the need to insult me?

dignified · 13/05/2010 23:54

www.getrevengeonyourex.com/v2/main/how-to-get-revenge/fakesms.php

No more snooping op, for just a few quid you can send them both a text apearing to be from the other, and the reply comes to you.

dignified · 13/05/2010 23:56

Estuardo, if you read the ops original thread, that pretty much is exactly what happened. And no, i didnt mean to insult you.

estuardo · 14/05/2010 00:04

I have now read the original thread twice!

he confessed to an attraction but did not follow up with "i'm going to spend time with her no matter what you think". he tried to reassure her nothing had or would happen. But she is not convinced

And there were NO incriminating texts

I just dont draw the same conclusions as most here and I think it is very dangerous for OP to have such a one sided response. Most are damning him and encouraging her to dig deeper to prove his infidelity, that it is all "classic" behaviour.

believe me, I have been on the sharp end of false accusations and it really poisons a relationship. I would be well pissed off if my then partner had dozens of men on a website saying 'yes she is following a classic script you need to up the snooping "

The OP does not know, so why is everyone her fuelling her worst fears? We know even less about them than she does

dignified · 14/05/2010 00:18

Ok, so he didnt say that exactly, but he continued to socialise with her didnt he , despite the fact that the op was upset by this. And i suppose it depends on what you call incriminating texts , should they really be in contact when his wife is so upset ? I know i wouldnt continue to knowingly distress my spouse or ridicule his fears. Would you ?

And sadly, it is all classic behaviour. Its not normal to continue to do something that hurts your spouse, whether thats seeing a woman you fancy, or running up debts, or whatever.

Youve clearly has issues with a suspicious partner and feel strongly about it, and i dont blame you, but was there anything substantial causing his suspicions , and if so, did you listen to how he felt, try to ease his fears , explain when he asked you questions ?

PotPourri · 14/05/2010 00:21

Personally I think there is something wrong with the relationship around trust and respect. He maybe is having an affair, and maybe he isn't. but either way he is not communicating with you or earning your trust back. I would think this indicates a need to either sort the trust/respect thing out, or end it. There is no easy answer, but I really think instinct is very important.

I remember you too, so sorry you are still struggling with this. I hope you can find a solution that works for a better future.

dittany · 14/05/2010 00:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

estuardo · 14/05/2010 00:29

I have just read original thread for the THIRD time Really must get a life

After he told op about the attraction and it was aired in front of the other woman , OW backed right off.

They did NOT continue socialising as before. Husband always told OP exactly who was going to footie and sent her frequent texts and tried to get her to go along too.

He did NOT spend time alone with OW

He apologised (with tears) when his arsiness was pointed out to him and CHANGED his ways to be the perfect loving husband again

She snooped on his texts and found nothing.
She went through his email and found nothing

Give the guy a break ! He is totally stressed at work apart from anything else

My ex was suspicious because I am an open friendly person and he was a very insecure person. That's it.
His constant suspicion absolutley wore me down .

AnyFuleKno · 14/05/2010 00:29

oh dignified, that site you linked to is horrid

estuardo · 14/05/2010 00:35

potpouri the op has admitted it is she who is now holding back, and her husband IS making an effort

dittany · 14/05/2010 00:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

dignified · 14/05/2010 01:10

Just because some women whose husbands WERE unfaithful felt like you do does NOT mean that yours is the same.

Absoluteley. And just because you were accused of being unfaithfull but WERENT doesnt mean the ops H is suffering the same.I am struggling to see how you cant seem to see that this is an unacceptable way for a man to treat his wife. Evidence or not , how incredibly hurtfull to engage in cosy texts, to make your wife afraid to raise issues in case you get angry. I think the overwhelming majority of women would have similar concerns to the op , she is not being suspicious or unfair she has GENUINE reasons to be concerned.If your ex was constantly suspicious without reason then he sounds like an abusive controlling jerk, the op does not, she has valid reasons.

Affair or not, there is clearly an issue with respect . And bollocks to the poor guy being stressed at work, maybe his wife is stressed after his awful behaviour , looking after the dcs ect and washing his skiddy pants while he shares cosy texts with his tart behind his wifes back.

dignified · 14/05/2010 01:10

Just because some women whose husbands WERE unfaithful felt like you do does NOT mean that yours is the same.

Absoluteley. And just because you were accused of being unfaithfull but WERENT doesnt mean the ops H is suffering the same.I am struggling to see how you cant seem to see that this is an unacceptable way for a man to treat his wife. Evidence or not , how incredibly hurtfull to engage in cosy texts, to make your wife afraid to raise issues in case you get angry. I think the overwhelming majority of women would have similar concerns to the op , she is not being suspicious or unfair she has GENUINE reasons to be concerned.If your ex was constantly suspicious without reason then he sounds like an abusive controlling jerk, the op does not, she has valid reasons.

Affair or not, there is clearly an issue with respect . And bollocks to the poor guy being stressed at work, maybe his wife is stressed after his awful behaviour , looking after the dcs ect and washing his skiddy pants while he shares cosy texts with his tart behind his wifes back.

dignified · 14/05/2010 01:11

Whoops.

donna1966 · 14/05/2010 10:21

Basically, you need to do whatever it takes to regain your peace of mind. Go to any lengths possible and dig. I mean, it's obvious he is not going to admit to any affair...what man would?
Yes, snooping is horrible, I myself have installed a keylogger on his pc. I need answers, he won't give them, so I have to resort to this action.
You will only feel good again when your fears have been answered.

loves2walk · 14/05/2010 10:44

Just back at my desk now.

I just don't know what to think really, is how I feel today and I've read all these posts, thanks for the supportive and the challenging thoughts.

Been getting lovely texts from DH. He would probably be horrified if he thought all this was going on in my head. I should have dealt with his admission of attraction better and been really firm in setting out what was acceptable and what was not. That was a major mistake on my part. I was shaken though, as we have never had this sort of an issue, so I suppose I tried being really mature about it all - but I wasn't being true to my feeling and that's when I should have listened to my instinct and laid down exactly how hurt I was and suspicious and how I needed him to withdraw all contact. I didn't I said 'hey these things happen, I don't feel threatened, I am above that, we are strong as a couple, so what's the problem?' I should have come on MN all those months ago at point of confession, that would have shifted me off my laurels.

That first mistake has led to all this. OK DH is not willing to discuss it now openly but that's because he thinks it's all done and dusted. But it clearly isn't, if my instinct is right. I have said about the double standards many times- that if I developed an attraction how would he feel about it and then about ongoing contact. He has no answer, ever to that. He accepts that we operate with double standards and I suppose I allow that to go on. I am not a dorrmat though - I will not allow this to continue, and I am taking steps to deal with it just slow, gradual steps.

Given we have just moved house after moving cities 2 years ago - a major move and upset for DC - I am quite prepared to bide my time and give it 6-12 months. If it all comes out before then I will deal with it, but I do need to take a slow approach. If he was unfaithful and I left him, I would move cities to be with my family, so that is another major move and I would not do that for another school year, so in a way I have till then.

What is a keylogger donna? I tried accessing DH emails from home computer when I knew he'd be on a flight, but I have no idea of user name or password.

OP posts:
SeasideLil · 14/05/2010 10:46

I really don't think there's evidence either way. I can see Estuardo's point, firstly he did mention the attraction (why do that if on brink of torrid affair?). I don't think there's anything sinister about not wanting someone to have complete and open access to Blackberries and email, if my husband requested that to see if I was having an affair I would be incredibly insulted and show him the door. I disagree that all mail, email, texts etc are not private in a marriage; mine are.

Having said that, his behaviour was odd and the OP may well have picked up on something. I would go back and have that 'honest chat', the really unpleasant one where you ask him again if he is having an affair. I'd also ask him again why he mentioned fancying this woman in the first place, and how he would feel if he was you and you fancied a work colleague and continued to see them at social do's. The option that occurs to me is that he may well have been dallying with her but it's now over, hence the happiness at not having to attend such events.

I think if you have looked for evidence on a locked Blackberry and not found it, that's pretty convincing that not much is going on now, even if it was in the past. I don't think you are wrong for wanting evidence, personally I don't think your husband is abusive or that you 'must' leave at this point, given that either scenario (him having an affair/him not having an affair) is quite plausible. Not wanting to talk about delicate issues is quite normal; I would still force my way past and try and get at the truth. Having done this again, though, you can't continue to do it, otherwise you will bring down the marriage anyway, whatever the OW situation. And I would keep snooping for a bit.

SeasideLil · 14/05/2010 10:51

I also completely agree that pretending to be cool when you are not cool about him fancying someone else is a mistake, and one you obviously now regret. It sounds to me like your jealousy is now very intense (having pretended it wasn't) and it's difficult to sort out whether this is right (as in based on an affair) or whether you are seeing what you want to see through a green haze. Good luck in finding out.

loves2walk · 14/05/2010 11:08

Thank you seasidelil.

He mentioned the attraction in the first place because he came home very drunk having spent several hours in a pub with OW! He fell into bed and sort of spilled it out - I am sure he has regretted telling me ever since.

Your last comment was right - it is hard for me to get perpective on how justified this jealousy is. We are going to have to have some sort of frank conversation whatever as I find the cosy emails too much so even if I don't admit to that snooping, I do need to be more open about how threatening i find the contact

OP posts:
WhenwillIfeelnormal · 14/05/2010 13:58

loves2walk I've stayed away from your thread thus far, because I felt it was important that you heard from a range of other people who might have had a different "take" on your situation to me - and as you know, I contributed heavily on your last thread and still often wonder how things are.

I think what might help you is to articulate what is indisputable and not open to interpretation. It helped you last time to deal with what was after all, in the open domain.

He confessed an attraction to someone with whom he already had a close working relationship and with whom he had started to see outside of work, at drinks and at football matches. That person also admitted to him that she was similarly attracted. That would be a threatening situation for anyone in a monogamous relationship.

You well know that I think couples should discuss temptation and crushes, but what your H did instead was to drop this bombshell and then call you "pathetic" (original thread) and "ridiculous" for expressing disquiet and asking questions. Given that you both know his history of infidelity, even the most secure partner would have concerns and fears for this situation. Instead he unilaterally decided that the subject was not up for discussion. Even in your most recent discussion about the mutual acquaintance's marital breakdown and infidelity, his rebuke to you had the effect of putting a stop to any further conjecture.

Far beyond the issue of infidelity, the sense I get from what you write is that you are scared of expressing how you truly feel to your H. You've said before that he is better at winning arguments, will react angrily to any suggestion of mistrust and it seems that if you express what would be for most of us, perfectly normal worries and fears about a situation that he has created, you fear he will get angry and make you feel small again.

So what's indisputable? He admitted a mutually felt attraction to someone and offered you no reassurance or empathy. He belittled you for your insecurity. He continued to work alongside this woman and socialise with her at events that you cannot attend because of the physical pain you suffer standing at football. He started withdrawing from you, spending more time at the gym and at social events involving the colleague - and was guarded with his phone. He behaved horribly to you and the children for a long period of time. After yet another argument about a trivial incident in February, that resulted in him threatening to leave you and involved him pinning your DS against the wall, he apologised on the phone during the day, but instead of talking to you that evening as requested by you, he went to an evening meeting, sat staring at his phone with his head in his hands and then completely avoided a conversation with you about his awful behaviour that morning.

Weeks later, you confront him (in the dark while you were in bed) with numerous examples of his terrible behaviour.

He started behaving with more kindness towards you and the DCs. After a work event in March, he admits that the colleague was behaving strangely and wonders aloud to you, whether she is in love with him. When you tell him that you have been worrying terribly that he has had, or is having an affair, he makes you feel small again for even suggesting this. He stops a conversation about another's infidelity. He tells you the colleague has applied for a transfer and that he has tried to persuade her to stay. You ask him no questions about what has happened to the feelings he declared for (and to)this colleague last summer and he doesn't volunteer anything about that either.

He was behaving so strangely to your family at Christmas that they also suspected something was happening and when you tell them what has been happening, they agree that an affair seems highly probable.

Try - as others on this latest thread have with Estuardo - to reverse this. If you had come to this relationship with a history of infidelity, how would you have behaved in these circumstances? What expectations would your H have had of you if you had developed a friendship with someone that had resulted in declared feelings of mutual attraction?

I think it's your H's lack of empathy - and your fear of his reactions, that worries me more than anything in your situation.

WhenwillIfeelnormal · 14/05/2010 14:00

Can you also tell us, what you mean by "cosy and intimate" in the exchanges you have uncovered?

loves2walk · 14/05/2010 14:09

Thanks WWIFN. I really appreciate it though feel terrible reading that. Absolutely terrible.

Just before I disappear into some small hole, or in reality get on with school run, I'll put quick couple of txts down -

talking about travelling to next away football match - 'well you can't afford that so I presume you're not going'
reply - 'hark at you - you can't afford it either!'

when she withdrew her job applic Dh said 'I am delighted - absolutely - and will do all I can to make it right decision for you'

previous email from her in feb 'I won't ask again, I don't need to know everything anymore'

in reply to shall I get you a pint 'what a lovely thought' i know it sounds picky of me, but would he have said that to a guy asking him?

Sounds very unsubstantial when written here but they are just generally familiar and over friendly. But only had 1 chance, my head was leaping around so i can't remember it clearly. Was nothing serious enough to write down.

OP posts: