'But We Took You to Stately Homes' Part 2...a thread for adult children of abusive families

[therealsmithfield]

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/angry/hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/lifetime experiences of being hurt/angry etc by our parent?s behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotional abused and/or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesnt have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/or current parental contact has left you feeling damaged falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful if you have come this far and are still not sure wether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts;.

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect you feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defenses that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety will undoubtedly us it during confrontation to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behavior. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offenses against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behavior. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get," or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ....

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realize that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller

Personality Disorders definition

follow up to pages first thread

Im sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out grin. I personally dont claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will recieve a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support.

Happy Posting (smithfield posting as therealsmithfield)

Thisishowifeel, thank you so much for acknowleding me, I was so very very low, and felt so invisible the past few days.

Diving, respect to you.

I was looking up some stuff and there was something about giving up on hope, as people who have been in abusive relationships keep on hoping things will get better, I have known this is something that I have done a lot, the article mentions learning to give up on that hope, I need to do that with my family and the ex wanting the kids, I am working out how. I have just realised quite how hard Friday has knocked me, as dd2 was so upset from it, I was holding it together for her all weekend, and once she was back at school she was ok and I have now fallen apart, I looked like crap in the mirror this lunchtime, so I thought I can't keep looking how I feel, I went to hairdressers and did something I don't normally do, (i have highlights done every so often and that is it), I went in and asked if they could fit in a wash and blowdry, I got so many needs met, I was touched, I was acknowledged and not ignored as a person, I was respected, I was cared for with a coffee and my hair was nice, I came out feeling much better, I keep thinking what kind of a person am I that no one likes me or acknowledges me, as I can't be abused anymore and I have pushed people away, I must be horrible, I also thought how sad the only people who want anything to do with me are people I have to pay to do so, I have never been a social reject like this before, I know the people were not healthy, god, this is not how I thought my life would end up, I am slowly doing all the things I should, I am working on giving up hope as I see that from the article I have gone past most of the anger stage with the family thing, I don't even know if I am making sense, I am just so dammed on the verge of nothingness right now, fighting hard to be postive and help myself.

I'm watching "How the other half live" on Channel4. It's amaziing for me - it's one of those rich/poor things, but the maint point afaic is that BOTH families are really nice! I crave examples of happy, loving, caring families - they're strangely hard to find, but here we have a rich one and a poor one, both in one view

They'll put on their "iplayer" channel4.com

therealsmithfield yes, that is what I would like to happen. I also realise that this is unlikely. Which is such a shame & I'm cross that we are both missing out on a 'healthy' relationship.

A friend the other day says I should be thinking that I need to find a way out, which doesn't depend on my mother either saying sorry &/or changing her behaviour.

Mummiehunnie not sure of your whole story but just wanted to say good for you for getting your hair done & glad you felt better for it. Please don't feel that they were only nice because you paid - they didn't have to be nice you, they could have just done your hair ! is there some little treat you could plan each week to help give you a lift ?

Weeping slightly, after watching the lovely families, and thinking hard. The small spate of posts, in this forum, from "didn't know I was being abused" people, is adding into my thoughts.

My sibs and I didn't 'seem' abused to any but the most perceptive - and thank god for them! - but we were incapable of the instant ease that those two 11-year-olds had with one another. We were constantly self-evaluating, second-guessing, trying to get it right. What I'm learning, more by watching than by doing, is nothing to do with 'adding' and infinitely more about what 'isn't there'. Far less self-questioning; far less resentment; far less fear.

I have to trust that the 'new me' - still in progress - has the strength to accept a safer, healthier world. That I will know if someone's motives are shady and retreat, rather than assuming everyone's motives are shady iyswim? I'm beginning to see this as an insoluble difference between me and the rest of my family.

The other day I stated, affectionately, to my mother that: while she sees potential burglars & aggressors everywhere, I see potential friends (she was fretting about leaving the tools in the garden for half an hour). She literally shrank away from me.

My sister spammed a blog entry of mine, about (rural) community paranoia, with passionate defences of the "everyone's a threat" attitude. To be fair, she did live in a hideously drug-infested inner city district when her chiildren were small - and it was challenging. I don't think I would have seen it the same way, though. I've lived almost all my life in inner London. There are things I wish people would put away, but on the whole my experience with neighbours was nothing but good. Is it all about attitude, or am I naive??
I want to walk on the bright side - and have done, in the face of everything I was taught and believe. I still don't know if I'm the fool, though.

What I loved about tonight's C4 prog was the way everybody in it was untramelled by class, expectations, self-doubt or fear. The poor parents had a pride issue with accepting money from the rich parents - I hope they did accept it! I was shouting at the telly; "It's not patronage, it's sponsorship! Say yes and make it work!"

Then I thought about my generous friends, whom I'm too embarrassed to contact ...

Hopefully a thread catch-up.

I still have unresolved feelings about appearances. I now know I was never the fat, lumpy, clumsy kid of family mythology (and I know that thanks to my brothers, so we'll be talking parent mythology!). So my beautiful, sparky, fascinating teens & twenties were wasted because I saw myself as some kind of unpopular freak. No wonder I couldn't make sense of the world

My biggest career successes occurred during my thirties, roughly speaking. I was with arsehole X#1, who was only too keen to turn me into the peculiar combination of arm-candy-fashion-icon, combined with fat-ugly-clumsy-boring-partner, plus biddable-sex-object, which is all to familiar from the "I've annoyed my partner" type threads we see here

Everybody close to me, during those years, criticised my weight. I ate in old-fashioned style at lunch and dinner (which I cooked, cordon bleu) and was a size 14. A real 14, mind you, not a chainstore one! It was a healthy size for my height; I bought my cothes at real designers, so can't have been the lardball of my self-perception, and (mysteriously) the few photos I still have from those days. I saw myself on telly the other day, in a retrospective. I looked really pretty! If I'd seen it at the time, I probably wouldn't have recognised me

After X#1 and I split, I jettisoned everything and went travelling. The wonderful people of Brazil taught me what English folk are scared of - to be proud of my body instead of judging it. I came home tanned, fitter, and a tiny bit thinner. The real difference was this: I came back loving my body, and confident with it.

The vituperation! More than half of my old friends "didn't recognise me" Really, they walked straight on by. Oddly enough, they are the friends I have no desire to re-contact. Neither will I re-contact the friends who, while recognising me, then went on and on, with audible hatred, about how I'd "reinvented myself". I hadn't; I'd been travelling, learned something, and came back. Simple as. I didn't do it as an attack on them, but they reacted that way.

Here in the present day: I'm much older and seeing the effects of menopause. I'm much poorer and, while I'm a genius with olive oil and a huge fan of Aldi's astonishingly good skincare range, can't buy Clarins anymore. I've suffered a huge setback thanks to darling mummy and am out of shape, with no access to free fitness (have you tried running round a tiny rural town, where every pathway is 'No entry'?). I cut my own hair and look a middle-aged mess, basically. But I still have the self-confidence I learned on my travels. During two hellish years living on the edges of my mother's life, when she managed to tell me EVERY DAY that I'm fat, I managed to laugh at it. although I did get fat

I don't really know where to stand on this! Sure, I could manage to look city-acceptable, if I dedicated two whole days to the preparation. The truth is, though, I'm so conflicted about this whole malarkey, I haven't a clue. I am destitute; I am middle-aged. Is there any psychological benefit to making myself look how other people might prefer? Or is it healthier, for me, to look like the slumball that I do?

I don't know.

Just going to read all your interesting posts properly ...

Diving and Exotic Vanilla, I did recognise that each of you was going through some major crap - I don't believe I'm alone in that. Ferretting around in your unconscious mind is taxing work, and sometimes painful. When real life trowels more crap on top of that, the only thing to do is close down a few channels. I hope both of you are fine, and will be gallopping back at some point with a bucketload of fresh insights!
Whether or not, though - go well, and all good wishes

pinemartina: your real-life challenges are so huge at the minute, moments of self-doubt (or hours at a time) are understandable. I'm becoming alarmed by your self put-downs though. You are the antithesis of any kind of 'victim mentality', 'glutton for punishment' or 'walking problem'! Yet you seem to be labelling your self that way. Please fix this, now. I don't care if you have to ask your kids for inspiration - in fact, I'd recommend it! - but, please, print out posters for yoursel, write on your mirrors with lipstick and make fridge magnets ... YOU are the power of love, strength, love & sanity for your self and your fmaily!

Was it you who wrote about your mother's childhood abuse? Might have been bagofrefreshers. It reduced me to a wreck. I feel so much for the girl she was ... but the woman she has chosen to remain merits little sympathy. Instead of facing her own horror, she's transferred it to you.

When you hear your screwed-up, hurt, angry, denying mum or dad in your head (pretending to nag you in your own voice, hah!) - just calmly tell them the truth. And make sure you know it, every hour of every day

My bathroom mirror has a notice on it; it says "You look nice." Whenever I go up or down stairs, I'm greeted by a poster reminding me; "I'm very okay, thanks, what's your problem?"

This is not a question of "you can do it." You ARE doing it

oops, too much drunk/tired typing
will save replies to mh, loving, rose and others for tomorrow. It's my keyboard, honest! [hic][snore]

Hello, I posted on here a little while back and then got a bit shocked and scared by everything that kicked off between diving and vanilla. I'm glad that things seem to be getting resolved and I don't want to mention it to dredge it up and keep something going. I was just feeling a bit vulnerable having posted for the first time and decided to step back but I have been reading and getting lots from people's posts. I have been going through a hard time recently, the miscarriage I had has really triggered a lot of stuff for me and I have been struggling to cope. Anyway, I just wanted to say that I am still here, I didn't just post and disappear. I really admire everyone's courage and willingness to deal with their issues on here.

Hi all, sorry I haven't posted for ages. I've just been too tired physically and mentally. I'm booked in for an ELCS on Tuesday so not long to go now!

Grace I too spent my teen years hating my body and convinced myself I was fat. I wasn't I was a size 8/10 in my early teens and a size 12/14 in my late teens. As a younger kid I think negative thoughts about my body were instilled into me. I was called a 'skinny bitch' and I can remember wanting to join a ballet class but was told 'no' as it would be like a 'fairy elephant jumping around'.
At about the age of 15 I developed a stretch mark on the back of my leg and my mother laughed and laughed about it like she was so pleased.

Since having children I am overweight and am not allowed to forget this. For example my mother told me recently that she was going to buy me a nighty in Mothercare but couldn't as they 'don't do big sizes' (I'm not that big, I'm nearly 39 wks pg and wearing a size 20, normal not maternity).
I feel also that in the past my mother has tried to sabotage any diet I may have been on. For example, I was doing the weight watchers diet and my mother invited DH and I over for dinner. My mother knows what the diet entails as she has followed it herself. She served up a creamy chicken pie and a dessert with lashings of cream knowing full well I'd have to refuse the dessert.

I'm not sure if you remember a couple of weeks ago I posted about the saga of the phone calls? Well it was my DS's birthday and she made a point of posting his card to him (she lives a 10 minute drive away) then came around with his presents a few days later with my step dad in tow. The presents were completely over the top. They were some lego from the set that my ds is collecting but she'd bought an expensive set, he had clothes from M&S and a £20 note. I think all in all her presents would have amounted to more than we had spent on DS.

Also whilst she was at our house her focus was solely on DS, she helped him with his lego (she never normally plays with him), she followed him about the house, she even stood over him staring at him whilst he ate his dinner (I offered them dinner but she refused) it was all very bizaar and actually a bit freaky. DH was totally freaked out by her behaviour. Obsessive is the word that springs to my mind. Anyone have any opinions on this??

In all the time she was at our house, not once did she ask how I was or even mention the baby. In fact she hardly spoke except to DS. My step dad seemed to be on form though, he collared me on my own and asked why I never answer my phone, I said maybe I was busy or even out. The look of shock on his face, like he (they) hadn't even considered that I might have been out when they've called????????
It was like my SD had taken over my mother's role that day. Our paddling pool was too big for our garden, why wasn't it put at the bottom of the garden? We were sat outside on the patio when they arrived but it was too cold. DH showed him the greenhouse but we didn't have much in there(despite there being tomatoes, cucumber, aubergines,sweet peas, basil, rocket, parsley to name but a few things growing in there). Why don't we have sky tv? Why don't we change our car? The sausages grilling on the BBQ were spitting out too much fat.........and it just went on and on.

At the weekend my mother text me to ask if we wanted anything for the baby when she went shopping (first time I've been asked what I want, normally she tells me what she's buying and then gets in a strop when I say that we don't need it or already have it) and did we want a baby bath? (even though she knows I've already got one!!).
This week I've had a text asking if I want her to look after the kids next week when I go for my CS, I replied no thanks as DH has now got the whole week off work and the kids are staying an extra night or two at their dads house.
I feel as if I'm banging my head against a brick wall. She spent weeks and weeks moaning to me that her boss is on holiday the week I have the baby and she has to work extra to cover, so I have made alternate arrangements. Did she use this as an excuse to get in a strop, knowing that I would say no to her looking after the kids, especially at this late stage?

I pulled up outside her work yesterday to give them some carrier bags to recycle, her boss came out to chat to me but my mother totally ignored me.

In some ways I'm actually glad that she's ignoring me, that we've obviously fallen out but on the other hand I know how poisonous she is and what an expert and convincing liar she is and I hate to think what she's telling other people about me.

Can anyone make any sense of this?? Is it me?? Am I the one going insane?? Am I making too much of this??? I'm doubting myself as it all seems so bloody crazy, has she got an alterior motive or is it all in my head?????

I have had nothing but negativity about my body from as early a I can rememebr.

I have alien ears....like a vulcan. Spock from Star Trek....the source of much enertainment and laughter.

And my knees were "hysterically funy" too. Because they turn in slightly.

And I was too thin, getting too fat.

The first time got together ih them after they re estalishd contact..the minute I walked through the door I was sujected to a tirade of comments, mainly negative about my appearance. Ironic that the last time I saw them, my sister sat in my garden, drinkng my wine and eating my food, and telling me that I was fat and spotty. Actually, a size ten. With not one spot.

This morning I had comliments in the playground. Only jeans and a T shirt, but with a slight heel, and a pretty scarf. And I felt all kinds of big things. Stupid, uncomfortable, exposed, ridiculous, as though I shouldn't be there shouldn't be noticed....as though I had NO RIGHT.

All for the sake of a scarf! I will persevere, until being allowed to be visible...to exixst...feels normal, or the first time in my life.

It's odd though, that I wore al that shiny stuff when I was gigging. It wasn't real though, that was showbiz. So that was ok.

Message withdrawn

Wow all these body issues, Mampam, I too had the sabotage mother, I have read some stuff on ta, think someone else on here has mentioned it, and I am convinced that she was playing dry alcholic with me regarding food, I think I did a bit of that with my kids, although not the berating for food, I told them off for steeling food, had I not have told them off, had I not have bought it etc, then that game would not have happened, I approach things differently now regarding food, there is still a way to go as the comfort from food during the last few years, has been wrong, I have joined the mend programme with the kids, which was great with one leader who treated us in the adult ego state, and is a challenge now we have a leader in the parental ego state, trying to put us into child, I have a meeting tognight, and have been trying to think of i'm ok your ok ways to cut through it and stop it as it will mean defeat if she continues in that critical parent role, which is not what the course was designed for...

Grace, you saw your pictures on the tv? I take it that you are publically known from that, if so you are very brave to post on here, well done to you and to others, for keeping things quiet.

Tril, I remember you, it is nice to hear from you again.

Loving, thank you for your kind words.

I think all great minds work alike lol, the hairdressers worked a treat in lifting my mood and self worth, I thought to myself this is something I may repeat, and obviously it was suggested on here and the kids said how much better my hair looked and suggested I do it more regularly!

I went to see a friend for coffee and a shop this morning after the school drop off, it was lovely to see her, she is not a good friend, she is more of an aquantance, she has been through a hard time, and she knows that I have had big changes in my life, she is treating me well, and kind, I have spoken to her quite a bit on the phone and was delighted to see she is expecting a baby, we are meeting up again in the half term with the children, I know I can't rely on her, and I don't feel the need to either which is good now...

I like a lady at the mend programme, The first few sessions there were just three families and I noticed that she was drawn towards me rather than the other lady, we get along well and I like the person she is, I am quite impressed with certain aspects of her, and I feel motivated by being around her like she is a kind of role model, her daughters clothes are ironed so well, I looked at my kids and thought I didn't iron them as they were not creased, and looked at her daughter who had that crisp line in her t shirt and thought I want that for my kids, even though the tshirts were crease free if that makes sense, I want better for them than just ok, odd the way others inspire!

I am feeling like the low mood has lifted somewhat, the pain is not going anywhere and it is underneath the antidepressants I have been on the past two and a half months.

thisishowifeel - they sound like a horrible lot of bullies.

So glad you recieved the compliments are school - bask in them & remember them if/when you see your family.
Perhaps you could also have some 'lines' ready for them, to throw back at them - to shout them up. I am sure they may think twice in the future.

mampam - I have to say she sounds vile - my (d)m is nothing like this, more the overpower with love (but also very weak). Do try to swith off from her. I always feel so much better from making a plan. So you could think about your new baby, what a fabulous new start & how your weight is going to fall off ! Sounds to me like there is a power struggle going on there - just ignore her & you'll win.

sunshine here this am, so walked dd3 to school, pushed pram.
I have decided I am going to try not to engage with my inner voice(mother's) going on about my body..the extra 3 stone,haggard face from no sleep(doh..had a baby 6 weeks ago).
So I put on some bright colours,threw it together - amazed that skirt did up,which shows that when 3 stone lighter,I am wearing baggy clothes.
Was complimented on being "well coordinated" - how amazing!
I will carry on with dressing like this - whatever I fancy - instead of worrying,trying on ,changing,fiddling and being brow beaten by the voice in my head telling me what a state I look.
I have wasted years listening to and acting/feeling according to that criticism.
I am now going to enjoy being healthy and wearing colours and prints whether I lose weight or not.And I will leave my hair long.

Grace you are wonderful and lovely to spend time and energy on your posts,responding individually as you did last night.

I think you may mean mh when you refer to self criticism.I would like to say those words to her ,too.
It was me who posted about m's abusive childhood.
The nasty woman she chose to become is having a field day getting stuck into me currently.
She hasn't bothered with me for a few years ,since I stopped engaging,but having the baby and my pregnancy,have reignited it all.
It is the entitlement I find so hard to deal with.
She,and all my family,see it as her right to be involved ,in any way she sees fit ,with my dc's,and thereby,to be outraged and abusive if I don't facilitate this in accordance with her gaslighting,intrusive approach.
She has not shown much interest in the actual real baby,but is pleased for the opportunity to ring constantly and inform us that they are visiting.And to criticize my b'feeding technique,remark that baby not gaining much weight,other dc's appear jealous etc whilst offering no help at all.

I have avoided speaking to her,am not answering the phone,am busy if dc's answer.She is phoning hourly all day and tells dc's to tell me to phone her.

mampam I really feel for you,you are doing really well.Hang in there,be strong and focus on getting ready for baby.Your M sounds so similar to mine in many ways.

mh so sorry you are going through such a low phase.You are doing all the right things by fighting this to stay positive.Well done for getting your hair done and for all that you do for your dc's.Grace is right,you are putting yourself down with negative statements that I am sure you wouldn't dream of making towards another woman.
You deserve to be kinder to yourself.D you have support in RL ?,you sound so low,I am concerned for you.

Grace I am sure you know that there can't be much benefit in looking like how other people might prefer.
But equally,it can't be ok for you if you feel like a slumball - unless that is a positive statement?!
Your positive outlook is a blessing for you.I am working towards being more of a glass half full person,but fear I am more naturally inclined to the half empty view.
I am inspired by thisis descriptions of playing with your dd.I have forgotten how to laugh lately,and aim to be silly with the dc's as much as possible this weekend!

Diving, it sounds like you have gone through a grieving period, and that you may if it continues be beginning a depression in reaction to events. It sounds like you have gone back to the child or dare I say it baby mode of your ego, maybe you need to go back to that stage in order to emotionally grow up so to speak, that did happen to me when bad things were happening, I crawled up to the fetal position and cried like a baby, got convenience food, wanted others to do my thinking for me and care for me etc... you sound very vounerable at the moment, the thing is you can invoke the adult in your child ego, the little professor to help you if you want x

PM, I don't have much support in rl, I pushed most people away as they were unhealthy and I did not trust me or them, I am trying to rebuild my life, no family, no friends, except one who lives a long way away and has always had a busy life, I have aquantances who i can have coffee with and I do, no longer have close friends, the relationships were so very wrong for us both. So I am growing up again and started back as a baby and emotionally I am getting there bit by bit...

I went to gp and had an assessment at local mental health area, a month ago, the multi disipilinary team finally met this week I phoned yesterday and left a message to have them ring me to keep me in the loop, they are referring me to psychology, I should get a letter soon and they will see me in four weeks, I hope that I can get post the underlying stuff with a psychologist and end all this crap, and have the life I deserve. I will read back and see what you mean about me putting myself down, I need a break right now, so will get back to you about it!

Sorry havent read back through all the posts yet but just wanted to write a quick reply to you mampam. Your mother is soooo reminiscent of my own. Makes me go Arghgggg! Just reading your post.
NO it not you. She is game playing big time. Messing with your head and what is worse and makes me she is dragging your ds into it too. Using him to get to you
She is sending you the subliminal message that you dont matter. Which of course is not true but she is hoping to project this onto you.
When I had not spoken to my mother for nearly a year I had to come face to face with her for my nephews christening. I sat hunched while the woman flounced around like a wounded warthog, being overly helpful, sociable...I didnt react, which she didnt expect and left her deflated and evne more wound up Im sure. In the past Id probably confronted and had a verbal showdown.
Your mother has probably been pecking SDs head the whole time and niggled and poked him mentally and so he is offloading it back to you. Ignore ignore ignore. Let them keep there crap for themselves you dont need to be their dustbin anymore. You are doing great.x

therealsmithfield, you picked that down so well for mampam...

I have some good news, dammed annoyed at myself that my happiness is reliant upon acceptance from others, can't help it, brother lives abroad, he had a baby with a girl from that country, he and I don't talk anymore, he has been very abusive to me, never met this woman as he divorced and got with her and got her pregnant very quickly! I put in a friend request a few weeks ago, she does not go on fb often, she accepted me, I got to see more pictures of my niece than the two posted through our door by mother, I replied to a picture of her older kids and my niece saying they were lovely, ignoring the one's of my bro, and asked if I could have her address to send something we had for months, that I hoped she and baby would like, am awaiting a response now to see if I can form some sort of relationship with her, I want if possible to at least when we go aboard or she comes here to know my niece and for my kids to know their cousin, fingers crossed, at least if we could have that one family member, that would be great!

diving You have been through so much in such a short space of time. Yes I said short space of time, you have the majority of it left to live. But that is by the by as I feel you will come to that conclusion eventually yourself. When you are ready to and not before.
My real point is that you must go easy on yourself. You have got a lot of grieving to do and there is no way around it. You have to go through the pain to the other side. you must give yourself permission to do that.
You are not wallowing, you cant 'just get over it' and perhaps you are hindering your processing by telling yourself just that?
It sounds like you are greiving on the one hand but punishing yourself on the other because you are frustrated at wasting more time on the grief. Except it is not time wasted because it is a wound that must be healed.
What has happened is very sad and you need to allow yourself the right to feel that sadness.
I do have a lot of regret for things I missed. Career is a big one, but I havent hit it head on yet if that makes sense.
It is still lurking menacingly below surface level. xxxx Virtual hugs and fluffy towels.

MH You have been through so much and I think you are very brave starting from scratch as you have.
You have feelings of loneliness which is only natural. Your trust has been so badly damaged by your family exh, and no wonder. I get the impression you have been left feeling as though the world is so unsafe you are scared to hold your hand out in case it gets bitten off, yet again.
I had a period of time in my late twenties where I cut out some damaging people, an ex P, some friends. I felt so alone, curled up most days and nights in foetal postion. I had some therapy and I would go weeks and weeks seeing no-one except the therapist. Id drive home from every session howling. I see now she did me a favour.
After a year of this I packed up and moved abroad.
You will learn to trust others again MH. You will learn to trust yourself again too.
I hope you are finding some comfort here on this thread and are finding value in opening up a little. x

Sorry wanted to write more but dd is anxious to get out for a walk.

Will come back laterxx

You are all fabulously brave exceptional women

BOF Thankyou so much for the virtual chocs and champagne

rose In answer to your question 'yes' . Would like to add more later, but follow your heart.

Here's the episode of "How the other live" that I enjoyed so much last night
www.channel4.com/programmes/how-the-other-half-live/4od#3070428

the realsmithfield, I hope that you had a good walk, again you have picked things down to the bone to what they are! Wow you went a year like this, you are braver than me, you had no kids or anyone at all, for a year! October will be a year for me. I am working on reaching out bit by bit, you are right I am scared someone will bit my hand off, I will be moving at some point, probably by the year, house on the market, at a proper price this time, waiting for notice period from agents, and we are back in court in sept, so a new home, a new start is going to happen, I would love to move away all together, kids not keen school and friends, have to admit school is great and we were lucky to have such a good one. Maybe I just have to stick here and prove something to myself, I have moved so much in my life, this is the longest I have lived in a house or area my whole life, seven years next month!

Quick post before I get DD from school, still lurking, still reading.

diving I have had a similar experience to you in the last year, maybe not so protracted and intense. For me it was largely leaving my abusive ex and turning 40. I suddenly realised I had lost my 30s to all this psychodrama bullshit. I felt that intense grief, regret and rage. I had several weekends where I felt unable to function, stayed in bed, ate junk.

And now its largely passed. I'm glad I'm a single parent in her 40s who doesn't talk to her family. My life is hard, but at the same time, its easier than it has ever been. I'm lookign forward to going to the cinema with DD tomorrow and then swimming with friends on Sunday. Simple things, but I was never allowed to do them before and I know no-one will ciriticise or undermine me.

I sleep well at night now, you will to.

Diving I had a bit of a head meltdown when I turned 30 in the new year. Kind of a what have I done with my life? Why have I wasted it? etc etc. I soon realised that I was never ever encouraged to make anything of myself in fact quite the opposite. Even now if I say to my mother that I'm thinking of getting a different job she'll point out all the ones that are minimum wage with no prospects, nothing wrong with that at all but she knows that's not the kind of thing I'm looking for. Many a time and I'm so at myself for letting her do it to me, I've been for job interviews, even had trial days at jobs and she has poo-pooed them and totally put me off. I have let her and many a good job opportunity has passed me by.

MH I wish we had good support groups in this area, unfortunately there is nothing. I think that as soon as I'm recovered from CS I am going to seek out counselling. We don't have much money but I'm going to try and scrape together enough for at least once a month, it's better than nothing.

smithfield thank you. I'm glad you don't think I'm going mad. I've just had enough. Instead of being a support to me during this horrendous pregnancy she's been nasty and controlling. Pretty much how she is normally but I'm the stupid one for thinking it could ever be different. I'm feeling quite a bit of guilt at the moment....have I blown this out of proportion? Guilt that I'm inflicting all of this on DH with the MIL from hell, my DC's won't see her as much etc etc. I just don't want to deal with this at the moment.
DH and I are also petrified that she will try to come to the hospital the minute I've had the CS. I've told DH not to tell anyone until late on in the day so it will be too late for her to come but as usual she controlling what goes on as I'm sure DH will want to shout it from the rooftops and tell everyone once the baby is born.
The sad thing is that I don't think this would be getting to me as much if my mother wasn't such a bloody good liar. She's so convincing and why would anyone have any reason not to believe her? To others she is a lovely, caring person.

I had already come to the same conclusion about my SD. They have been married for over 20 years so just like me who has inherited a few narcissistic ways from her he has bound to have picked them up too. He's also very good at playing the passive role too. Making excuses for my mothers drinking and immediately taking her side, lying for her. He also buys her expensive gifts, that she's never grateful for, like he's trying to impress her so she'll give him attention. She never has a nice word to say about him.