is incest neccessarily always bad?... sorry this is sensitive.

[namechanging2008]

been told today that some very close family members are involved in a relationship.

i started off thinking my god this is so wrong, but feel they talked me round.

sorry for namechange, im totally at sea now.

they are very closely related, same age, both consensual, both determined their love will be enough, they know it means they cant have children.

i cant believe it. they want my support.

i dont know what to do.

i want to tell them its ok, but is it?

thanks so much, thats made me cry. i feel like somehow i've let them down though, is all this because they havent had enough proper love in their lives up until now?

i think more than anything i just cannot bear the thought of it going wrong for them. We really only do have each other the three of us, if they lose even the basic brother/sister relationship they've always had, how will they cope?

it feels like they are 5 years old again and I can just see all the hurt and bad times waiting around the corner.

maybe im being negative, because my relationships have never lasted... some people stay together and are happy forever arent they?

Lots of people have forever relationships. But if theirs doesn't turn out to be that, then your support may make the difference between them being able to retain a sibling relationship or not. And you know, if it doesn't work out, they will in any case be in a totally different situation to a couple in a 'regular' relationship that's not worked out, so no-one can predict how they may react. Time will tell, take it day by day, week by week.

Don't be daft--how could you possibly have let them down. You are a sister not a parent and you love them to bits, its so obvious.

Noone knows how life is going to turn out-it may or may not have a happy ending but none of us know what is in store tomorrow never mind in 5 years time.

Yes there are many happy ever after stories (been with my DH since 17---so that's 26 years),

Try and have an honest chat today explaining your fears for the future but emphisise that the road ahead for them may be difficult however you will support and be there for them both today and always.

Keep us posted please.

In this circumstance- No I don't think it is bad.

They cannot help their feelings and what had happened to them during their childhood. They are not hurting anyone, apart from family who choose to believe in a taboo rather then loving and supporting them through the difficult choice they have made. It is their life and they shouldn't be vindicated for falling in love. After we die, who cares anymore? It's really not important. It's just society and the pressures they will have to face that is going to make life extremely dificult for them, unless they moved away to where no-one knows them.

They are only related by flesh, not by spirit or soul. Poor people.

Namechanging, how old are they? Apologies if you've said, it's such a long thread so I might have missed it.

If they are in their early 20s, I'd be worried that they are still quite young, and still learning about love and relationships and this relationship is less likely to last anyway, even without the complications of incest. And that never having children may seem OK now but will probably become a bigger and bigger sadness over the years.

Partly what makes this wrong is the impact on them if and when the sexual relationship ends. It will really mess with their sibling relationship, and their chances of future happiness with anyone else.

I know your brother says he's having a vasectomy, but he seems to have started a sexual relationship already, so it's a possibility. And what happens if they split up and he's unable to have children with anyone else?

But they are adults, and whether you support them or not, they have made their decision. So personally I think I'd say OK, I can't stop you, but I am worried about you, and here's some info about the psychological phenomenon of separated siblings being attracted to each other.

Oh, and say if this relationship ever ends, you intend to carry on being a brother and sister to them BOTH - fair warning that if they split up, you won't take sides.

It's such a difficult situation to be faced with namechnaging you clearly love them both & want them to be happy but you're also very concerned for the, understandably so.

Legally they are not allowed to have sex (which clearly they are if they discussing vasectomy) & if they are found out they could both face prison.

It's so very hard as it is so wrong on so many levels but to them they don't see that, they just see each other. namechanging please, please don't think is your fault or that you have failed them. None of this is in your control, you have not failed as a sister or as a person - these things will happen in life & it can be hard to understand why.

As for where you go from here only you can decide that. Clearly you love them & just want them to be ok but can you deal with their relationship? If you feel you are able to push your concerns aside & be there for them then you do what you feel is right for you. If you feel it is to much to take in then perhaps take some time decide what contact, if any, you want to continue to have.

I'm so very sorry that you are going through this it must be so hard to get your head around. I grew up not knowing who my father was but I knew he had other children, it was always my biggest fear I would meet my brother & fall for him not knowing we were related IYKWIM? (Thankfully that never happend to me but I do still have siblings I have never met).

How old are they?I think that if they are truly adults and have found love/comfort/happiness with one another and accept the impossibility of children then they should be encouraged to move to a country where their relationship is acceptable.If they are young[under 25]then it is more difficult as a sexual relationship is possibly the only outlet they have for years of separation and emotional abuse.I would recommend counselling in that case.Ultimately this is a very private matter.They need all the love and support you can offer without being given the impression that you actually approve this new dimension to their relationship.Good Luck-just be there for them and keep their secret close.

pranma, age is relevant in terms of maturity and life experience making a difference to their ability to make rational decisions. But I don't think being over 25 would mean they are any less messed up by having what sounds like an awful childhood.

This relationship is a result of being psychologically damaged. Sadly. If they'd grown up knowing each other, or had a normal childhood, it would have been very different.

thanks so much everyone, i have to go get ready in a mo to meet them.

Gwarcho that was such a lovely post, thank you.

some people have asked their ages, they are late twenties, i dont want to say accurately, im worried about anyone recognising them or me and putting two and two together.

i am concerned about the vascectomy (sorry spelling atrocious), it seems so permanent. ive gone over it in my head last night and today and i wonder if he said that to reassure me and show their commitment.

My sister said if she ever got pregnant she could never face an abortion (she had one when she was quite young and it was very traumatic, so I understand her position totally).

sorry if i havent answered everyones comments, am a bit of a wreck at the moment and need to get ready.

as for taking sides if they split up, they know i would never do that. if they did finish i just hope that the original brother/sister love for each other would still be there... i want to say that to them today, to remember throughout it, whatever happens we are family.

i will post again later when i get back. just wanted to say thank you so much for not flaming me, only a couple of people have expressed disgust/horror and as I am unable to change the situation, the fact that so many of you have been understanding means a huge amount to me. I hope the rest of society, if they ever find out will be so compassionate.

Gosh, even more important for your brother to have a vasectomy then. Grim.

But I do think you are being a. a fab sister and b. handling negative reaction to their situation really well.

I'm with Gwarcho on this. Life is so short, obviously its not an ideal situation and their love is socially unacceptable, but I wish them all the luck in the world. Personally, given that they are being responsible regarding having children, I wouldn't give two hoots if I had friends who were having a sexual relationship and I found out they were brother and sister. Who am I to judge what is wrong and right in this situation?

How did meeting up with them go this today namechanging?....been thinking of you.

I suppose my main worry is the life of total secrecy they will have to live. That must put terrible pressure on any life, even if it is a loving one.

Also, OP, it's natural to feel that you are responsible for your siblings' happiness, if they weren't cared for so well by their parents. But, unfortunately, you don't have the power to make up for that failure, and you can't ever spare them the pain of their upbringing, any more than anyone else could spare you your own pain.

I think that their feelings are much more to do with instinctive bonding and separation than to do with true love tbh. I hope this relationship doesn't end up damaging their sibling relationship, which is just as important. But, either way, unfortunately, none of this is your responsibility or in any way within your power to control . The fact that you love them so dearly is the best thing about this thread.

Wishing you and your family healing and happiness OP.

tbh i don't think this situation would bother me. they've obviously thought very hard about all the angles and aren't going to have children. i'd be happy for them.

i think it's sad they won't ever get to be parents and i'd be a bit worried about how society would accept them, but other than that, those are my only reservations.

they sound like lovely people.

Please report your post as you have a name in it.

For your own sake, please get it deleted as wouldn't want them to be identified....

i know, realised once id read it back, didnt know how to delete it. ive reported it. how stupid of me. i cant believe ive done that.

Incae they do delete it I just wanted to say that I read this thread earlier but wasn't sure how to respond or how I felt about it.

No matter what we will never know the reasons behind their love, no-one truely knows what goes on in others hearts.

I really hope things work ok for them though as they sound like they've been through so much already and I hope that you are ok with them moving so far away from you.

thank you by the way for looking out for me. god, how long will it take for it to go? im so stupid.

To answer your orignal question I think it has to be yes. Surely they are really clinging to each other because of whats happened to them? I don't see how this cannot end badly.

I can't understand the moral argument here.

Incest between siblings raised together is generally the result of abuse or of severe family dysfunction and as such isn't a good thing. But siblings raised apart don't have the same conditioning, and therefore aren't breaching the same sort of emotional barriers. Obviously the OP's siblings will have all sorts of instense emotional issues that will complicate their relationship, but that is nobody's business but their own. They aren't hurting anyone or (as far as I can see) offending against public morals.

I also have a big problem with the idea that this couple should be made they 'can't' or 'shouldn't' have children. The majority of children born as a result of incestuous relationships are normal and healthy, despite the higher risk of abnormality if the couple share a trait for genetic illnesses. Christ - would we tell any other couple with a higher than average risk of having a child with a genetic condition (for example people with sickle cell or thalassamia) that they should be sterilised? Of course not! We'd encourage them to seek genetic counselling.

To the OP - I understand why you are shocked, and I feel sorry for your siblings. They're going to face a lot of hostility and unpleasantness. I hope they know that there are people out there like me who wish them well in their relationship.

Frankly bollocks to the social stigma. The only real reasons for objecting to incest relationships are the possible genetic problems, and when there is coercion or an abuse of power. Neither apply in this case. If this relationship is consensual and makes them both happy then it should be let run its course, particularly as both these individuals seem to have had enough pain and rejection and distress in their lives already.

I completely and utterly agree with SolidGoldBrass. She said it much better than I could have.