Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Husband says it's over, wants custody of DD

943 replies

MollFlounders · 17/07/2009 11:12

I would really appreciate some thoughts on my situation. I've posted a few times recently about DH. There have been issues in the past but things have been particularly rocky since I went back to FT work 3 months ago (DD is now 9 months old). DH has always been quite selfish and inflexible (previous threads on this are here and here) and this has, for me, become more and more difficult to cope with since having to juggle a demanding job and of course DD. Things are at the point where counselling is required. I found a counselling group who will see us each separately and then together in a facilitated session.

So DH and I had yet another row yesterday morning. It was very trivial. I was hosting an event for some clients. DH managed to get his own last minute invitation to the same event (going as a client himself, of another host). I offered to give DH a lift in my work taxi, but on condition we operated on my timing seeing though I had to get there to meet my clients (DH is usually late to everything). DH was very pleased about the lift otherwise he was stuck with a long tube trip. We agreed, I thought, that we would leave the house asap but would absolutely be in the cab by 9am. I was up and ready, having also gotten DD up and ready for her day, by 8.30am. As it happened, my taxi arrived to collect me at 8.40am. DH had gotten up at 8am and proceeded to faff around the house getting himself ready in slow motion. I asked him a few times if it was possible to hurry things along a little as the cab was waiting downstairs with the meter ticking along. He just kept repeating in icy tones "we agreed we would leave at 9. We will leave at 9". So we left at 9.00am on the dot, with me standing around waiting for him in the meantime. In the cab, I expressed my frustration at his inflexibility and I said that I didn't feel it was normal to be so incredibly rigid. He basically said "if you want normal, you're with the wrong person. I'm not normal."

I didn't see DH again last night as he went out with a friend after the event and came home late. This morning, he was monosyllabic. I reminded him that he needed to call the counsellor for his separate session. DH said "there's no point going to a counsellor unless you tell me that your behaviour yesterday morning was totally unacceptable and will never be repeated again". Apparently I was relentless in my nagging and this is totally unacceptable and tantamount to treating him with contempt. After all, I know he hates being rushed in the mornings.

DH then asked me if I want custody (I know it's residence) of DD and I said absolutely. Asked him what he wants, he says he wants custody. She is 9 months old. We have a daily nanny but I do everything for DD outside of that. A family lawyer has told me that it seems clear that I'm the primary caregiver and that I could move out with her if the marriage ends. My main priority in all of this is DD's happiness and stability.

I guess I've got two questions. Does the situation with DH sound hopeless? I feel we're at the make or break point but I'd go through counselling if there was a chance of it working. But if he's saying counselling is pointless then can you make it work?? Other question: what do people do with residence and contact when it comes to small babies? How often would be reasonable for DH to see DD and how do you do this (e.g. him coming to my place)??

OP posts:
tryingherbest · 19/07/2009 18:38

I've skimmed through the text.

Sounds like you're going the best you can to keep family and soul together.

I've read some criticisms and read quite a bit about you trying to understand his point of view.
Not an expert but what I would say is that although I'm in a very different situatoin, I very much feel my 'd' h is punishing me for something (not something bad I've done but just pointing out his family is exploiting me and being horrible to me and my family).

What I would say is that I'm being punished rather than my husband engaging with me to see what's wrong and how we can make our relationship better. He can't face his family they are much bigger than me so he punishes me with pretty much all you are posting about.

How far will you go to appease this man without sorting out the main issues?

MollFlounders · 19/07/2009 20:03

Thanks expat, SGB and HighonDiesel. Tryingherbest - I'm really sorry to hear about your situation. I hope you're dealing with it and that you're ok.

I found today a note I wrote in 2005, yes 2005, after a particularly weird incident that occurred (the nose thing, for any that saw the other thread). It says: "I love DH and want to offer him support, compassion, understanding, forgiveness. But do I trust him to love me and take care of me? Do I trust that he will offer me support, compassion, understanding, forgiveness? Do I fear that his love in conditional - that I have to gravitate around him, take care of him, be good, always put myself second - well not always, but when I don't I'm gripped by guilt. I want to feel happy and relaxed in our relationship. But we can't speak about it until DH wants to. He is controlling and I have to react." This was followed by a list of self-improvement activities I felt I had to undertake in order to be a better person and therefore ensure that DH would be his true wonderful self. This note was written four years ago. I've been with DH for seven. I can't do this anymore. I hope I'm able to express all this to the counsellor tomorrow and that we can start dealing with it. I'm no longer thinking about relationship counselling, I'm just focusing on counselling for me.

OP posts:
cheerfulvicky · 19/07/2009 20:27

Good for you, Moll. I hope individual counselling really helps you to come to terms with all of this. I have a feeling it will Keep us posted!
x

HighOnDieselAndGasoline · 19/07/2009 20:48

Hi Vicky! Hope things are good with you. Our paths crossed on a different thread a while ago (I was dust buster but have namechanged).

(Sorry for hijack, Moll.)

expatinscotland · 19/07/2009 20:56

I'm glad to hear you are getting counselling for yourself!

You shouldn't have to 'be good', it should be okay just to be you, because from what I've read of your threads, Moll, you sound like a pretty nice person.

Think of how you love your DD. Don't you want for her to be with someone who loves her in a way that is similar? Who accepts her for who she is and finds that something really wonderful? Who cherishes her? Who tries to see both sides in dilemmas and make a compromise?

Well, guess what, Moll, you're someone's DD, too, why do you think you deserve anything less?

Because you don't.

expatinscotland · 19/07/2009 20:56

I'm glad to hear you are getting counselling for yourself!

You shouldn't have to 'be good', it should be okay just to be you, because from what I've read of your threads, Moll, you sound like a pretty nice person.

Think of how you love your DD. Don't you want for her to be with someone who loves her in a way that is similar? Who accepts her for who she is and finds that something really wonderful? Who cherishes her? Who tries to see both sides in dilemmas and make a compromise?

Well, guess what, Moll, you're someone's DD, too, why do you think you deserve anything less?

Because you don't.

TotalChaos · 19/07/2009 21:03

if the nose incident is the one I think it is from previous threads then , the guy really sounds even grimmer than I thought. Obviously noone can diagnose by internet, but I'm not getting any vibes of likely spectrummyness from what you have posted. hope you find the counselling helpful.

ZZZenAgain · 19/07/2009 21:06

you can jot down some thoughts in a notebook and even take that note with you if you like. The counsellor will be experienced (well presumably) at asking the right questions and extracting the information which reveals the relationship you have. I am sure this first meeting will be fine. Let us know how you get on tomorrow.

Well done tackling it

dittany · 19/07/2009 23:07

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MollFlounders · 20/07/2009 09:19

Thanks for your support Vicky. Expat - thank you for the lovely post. Speaking of being someone's DD, my parents have come to London and it's amazing having them here as they are totally supportive. I had another long talk with them yesterday about what has been going on. They are upset but not surprised. My mum said that she never thought she would say this to her own daughter but "you have to leave that man". But if it turns out to be true that a lot of DH's behaviour over the years has more to do with his issues than whether or not I've been "good" then it will take me a long time to believe that.

Totalchaos and dittany - yes, you are thinking of the right thread. Dittany I know what your thoughts were on the counsellor vs Womens Aid last time. The person I'm seeing today is a psychoanalyst with more than 30 years experience. I'm hoping that she is able to help me. But the biggest thing for me is that at the moment I've got my parents staying in a flat just a short drive away, rather than being on the other side of the world. They're here for another month and mum will stay longer depending on what is happening. I can take DD and go to them any time I want. I've also got access to my own savings to get somewhere else to live. Thanks for your support.

Zen - I've made some notes to take with me today as it's the only way I can keep my thinking straight at the moment.

OP posts:
TotalChaos · 20/07/2009 09:25

good to hear your parents are being very supportive. I think you should speak to WA anyway, as well as your analyst.

HeadFairy · 20/07/2009 10:09

HI Moll, sorry, been super busy this weekend. I'm so sorry things seem to be taking a turn for the worse... but it's fantastic you have your family close to you now. They're the ones that love you the most and have your best interests at heart.

I hope the counselling session goes well, but please don't go there thinking you have something to fix in yourself. From your posts you sound like a perfectly nice and reasonable person, and to me it sounds like the problem lies with your h. I hope the counselling will help you see that you're a great mother and you don't have to please anyone.

Take care x

saintlydamemrsturnip · 20/07/2009 10:19

He cried because he wanted you to have a nose job???

OH MY GOD.

Your mum is right, take the opportunity while you have her support on your doorstep to get out.

spicemonster · 20/07/2009 10:23

That was you who posted about the nose job? Oh my goodness

I am so glad you have your parents here to support you. Hold onto expat's words - she is very wise.

Take care, keep posting. Hope your session with the counsellor helps you start to find a way through this all

ZZZenAgain · 20/07/2009 10:26

why on earth would he cry about wanting you to have a nose job?

Ah well, he is not quite Prince Charming, you know that by now. Frankly his behaviour about your dp and the wedding would have run the alarm bells for me a long time ago.

I hope the counselling session showed you a way forward and you see some light atthe end of the tunnel.

MollFlounders · 20/07/2009 10:45

Re the nose thing, he hated my father because of the whole fracas about our wedding (my parents got upset because they weren't invited; DH characterised their reaction as them trying to control our relationship). I have my father's (extremely distinctive.... ok, very prominent) nose. DH said that he thought that our relationship would improve if I had surgery to change my nose. He diagnosed himself with transference i.e. he transferred his negative feelings about my rather onto me because of my nose. He cried because he said he hated himself for feeling like this. Last year he tried to persuade me that I had broken my nose without realising it and that any surgery would just be corrective. I have not broken my nose. The last time we spoke about this he said he no longer feels the rage against my parents because they apologised to him. I don't know what he thinks about my nose these days.

I'm seeing the counsellor at lunchtime.

OP posts:
MollFlounders · 20/07/2009 10:46

"my father" not "my rather"

OP posts:
ZZZenAgain · 20/07/2009 10:55

it does sound as if there is something more deep-seated here but I am not an anaylist so I wouldn't like to guess what it might be. The reactions he shows are in no way proportionate to the things in your behaviour/in the relationship which appear to trigger his anger or negativity on a particular day.

Good luck with the counselling.

HeadFairy · 20/07/2009 11:00

He sounds like he has a real problem dealing with his emotions. Perhaps has hasn't realised that it's perfectly normal to feel anger or rage. I wonder if his obssession with making others apologise for whatever transgression he feels they've made is his way of avoiding accepting responsibility for his anger/rage/feelings of disappointment etc, rather than just accepting these are part of the normal range of human emotions and moving on.

staggerlee · 20/07/2009 11:24

Moll, I'm so sorry for your situation. The problem is that no matter what you do this man will seek to undermine you. I think probably through years of this behaviour you have lost perspective and so blame yourself for not being good enough.

His abuse-and thats what it is-is even more insidious because he seems to be engaging in a form of psychological warfare with you. This is much more difficult to quantify than physical abuse.

Please get out of the trap of feeling that if only you would change in the way he wants then he would be happy. He won't because hes projecting all his inadequacies on to you.

I was involved in a relationship which was similar to this and eventually realised that nothing I could do would be good enough. I left this man and, despite being a single mum struggling to make ends meet, it was the best thing I ever did.

I'm glad you are going to counselling for yourself and wish you well

mumblechum · 20/07/2009 11:27

Hope the counselling is helpful. BTW I doubt very much that couples counselling would be helpful in circs where your h is extremely controlling.

I'm also a family lawyer and agree with Bunny that the court may well encourage you to go to mediation about the arrangements for contact if it comes to a divorce, but ime this sort of man uses couples counselling as a way to try to get the counsellor to agree with them that the woman' being unreasonable. If/when the counsellor doesn't agree with him, he'll probably stop the sessions on the grounds that the counsellor's biased against him.

SolidGoldBrass · 20/07/2009 13:05

YOu're that couple? Fucking hell, get out before he kills you. THat nose thread was one of the more frightening ones I recall reading on here: the man is an unmitigated self-obsessed shit who is on a deliberate, consciously chosen mission to destroy you. Counselling will not help, it doesn;t help when the problem is that your partner is systematically abusing you to make himself feel better about his own inadequacies. He is a bully and a loser and you canot fix him. What;s more, he doesn;t deserve to be fixed.

NicknameTaken · 20/07/2009 13:15

Your h reminds me of my x, and not in a good way. X tried to persuade me that I was dirty (despite a daily shower) and insisted that I didn't wash my hands after going to the loo. Like you and the broken nose, I knew it wasn't true, but you spend so much energy defending yourself against something apparently ridiculous that it just wears you down.

About the counselling, the Relate counsellor refused to keep seeing us last year. I didn't realize at the time that this was because she saw the abuse long before I ever did. The mediation service also felt we weren't suitable candidates, so my solicitor passed this information to the court. Individual counselling (for me) was a huge help, though. I felt that for the first time I could see clearly and knew what needed to be done.

motherinferior · 20/07/2009 13:18

Nose conversation was bonkers, Moll. Do you actually want to live with a man with a bonkers nose-obsession?

MollFlounders · 20/07/2009 15:09

I've just come back from the counsellor (I've had to come home, I couldn't face work). Oh God. She was fantastic. She just sat there and listened to me ramble and cry my eyes out. My ramblings took up most of the session. I told her everything. She said I've let this man take power over me to the point where I've totally lost my compass and my sense of self. She said that it was very, very serious. I told her that I felt like I was standing on a cliff top looking into an abyss i.e. leaving my marriage. She said that the abyss was not leaving, it was staying. I'm seeing her again on Wednesday. I just feel devastated and so very, very stupid for having allowed this to happen to me and to have brought a new life into the equation with my beautiful DD. I reeled out of the counsellor's rooms in a daze and sat down on some steps in the street and just sobbed my heart out for about 10 minutes. I don't know what I've been doing for the last 7 years. I have fallen asleep at the wheel, big time. My poor mum is devastated as well because she had concerns and suspicions but didn't act. But I kept the secret perfectly.

I've just made an offer to rent a little house in an area I want to live in. I just have to keep my momentum going while my parents are here and while I'm seeing the counsellor. As soon as I see DH it's like quicksand again.

OP posts: