Partner has issues with how attractive he finds me (i.e. not enough). Is there any way the relationship can work?

[honeydews]

We have been separated for a while now, but have been trying to work through some of our problems, to see if we can keep our family together. (We'd been together since our late teens, and are now in our early thirties with a young son.) This post concerns a particular stumbling block.

When we got together, I was quite a laugh and interesting to be with, but I didn't look great. I covered myself from head to toe in baggy, figure-hiding clothes - I was a bit of an ugly duckling as a teen.

However, I've come out of myself, appearance-wise, over the years - have worked out which colours and clothes shapes suits me, and what a tiny bit of make-up can do - and have been surprised to turn a few heads. I have 'unusual' features, I realise that - some people would think me a bit weird-looking, others striking. I'm not a grooming, girly girl nor especially frumpy, but I now believe (hope) I'm at least averagely attractive.

The problem is, it's not enough for DS's dad. He remembers me in our teens and can't seem to perceive me any differently. He has said that, of all our female friends, he'd rather be with me looks-wise, but that he isn't attracted enough, enough of the time. He likes fancy underwear, dressing up, uncomfortably tight jeans, more make-up, overly trimmed bits - all of which I do every now and then, but really, I'm a bit more 'everyday' than that; about halfway between his very glamorous mum and my couldn't-give-hoot-what-she-looks-like mum. I'm not a frump, but I don't glam up more than feels comfortable, and I don't want to be a sex object/accessory either.

I tend to swing between feeling hurt and as though I must be a bit of a minger, and thinking he has unrealistically high standards and that it's his problem.

Argh - I'm rambling. This has come up several times before, and I think I have become a bit obsessed about it as a result - sorry. Anyway, do you think this is something that can be worked through? I think it's important that, whoever I'm with, providing I'm making a reasonable, realistic effort, is happy with how I look most of the time - and I'm wondering if this is simply something a partner can't train themselves to feel.

I felt all those things Honey, when me and ex split, as if my family had suddendly disappeared. But tonight, I went to pick up DD from her dad's house, he was there with his pregnant GF and her DD and it all seemed well, sort of normal...A year ago I couldn't have imageined feeling like that but it's all worked out.

It's a huge wrench at the beginning but I'm so glad to hear that your DS is adored by his dad - that means everything is going to be OK. I have a friend who's a bit further down the line than you, going through a divorce (instigated by her) and at the beginning she was simply terrified at the thought of her ex-H having her girls (3 under 10). But now she sees it can work; the DC are happy, her ex has time with his kids and she knows they love to see him and it gives her some free time.

As long as you never put your son's dad down in front of him and work together as a team it can work, and all involved can actually build happier lives. If you want to talk some more away from here, do let me know.

PS my DD still thinks of us as a family - it's amazing how kids can accept things. Don't feel guilty about causing him pain, you are a great mother and he has a good father and even if you're not together, he can have a really solid childhood. Far better that way than to stay together and be unhappy as a couple. They know.

GOD HELP ME I AGREE WIHT ANNA

Honeydews: You are and still will be a family even though you and DS dad don't live together. You and XP will be co-parents, which is a not-bad relationship to have with someone who isn't a complete arse (co-parenting set ups are hard to manage when one partner is seriously abusive, or dishonest, or fundamentally unreliable) - if the XP is a bit of an arse there comes a time when you can just cope with the arsiness in the same way that you can cope with the farty-old-rightwinger mindset of a granny or uncle who is great at amusing the kids with old-fashioned games and treats or whatever.
Quite a lot of people turn out to be much better as friends/co-parents than they were as partners (I am not a nice person to date but I am a great ex-girlfriend).
Best of luck.

solid you are solid

honeydews - you sound just fine to me. You cannot be glammed up all the time. I just feel there must be an awful lot more reasons to why you separated than just how you look.

bonsoiranna - I often find myself agreeing with you and I do in this thread. I think others have been too harsh on you.

What I think you are saying is 'make an effort' out of respect for your man. I make an effort for my wife and she makes an effort for me, I tell her what I like her to wear but do not dictate. When she does wear something I really like, I make sure I pay her lots of compliments and she does the same to me. We keep trying for each other.

I only partly agree with posters who say 'your man should love you anyway' even if you are having an off day, ill or whatever. Of course he should - but not if you never make an effort. I do not think honeydews is in the 'never making an effort' category though. As I say, there is a lot more to this than how she looks.

I think it's fine for partners to make an effort for eachother. I mean marriage is a visual thing too right, you have to look at the other person for many years. I always tell dh if I like something he wears and he does me. Great, I appreciate his taste.

I would never be with someone who would dictate bad taste though, which is what I maintain the man in the op has - overly tight jeans, too much make up, long nails yeuch

If you are going to influence eachother's style then you need to be in the same place aesthetically.

If you like wearing Marc Jacobs, then you should be with someone who likes you wearing Marc Jacobs or having loose flowing hair etc. Not someone who likes a thong or over straightened hair or whatever, I mean, sod that.

I also disagree that people can't look just as brilliant as they age.

My tall slim French grandmother certainly looked just as elegant in her 80's, father looks great in bright colours, cream hats, as does my mother in her 60's.

Anyway suspect I talking to fresh air here..

Honeydews, well done for being so open to look at yourself critically, make adjustments but also to recognise where your partner's problems really lie...with himself. All you can do is work on having a cordial and interested partnership in raising your son.

When it comes to posters like BonsoirAnna, I always think to myself that they probably posts from a place of personal pain. It isn't healthy or humane to consistanly post in the vein that posters like her do. So I try to always keep in mind that there is probably a very sad real-life reason for people to post that way.

Good luck OP!

Poor spelling, must master posting from phone.

It's a little thing, but I just wanted to add my two cents' worth. It does seem that some people do link true beauty with physical attractiveness and think that lack of spark in a relationship can be blamed entirely on what the other person looks like. I've known some downright ugly people in the past and do you know what? whether I fancied them or not had NOTHING whatsoever to with the shape of their teeth / condition of their hair / belt overhang etc. And it certainly didn't depend on their clothes or make-up (or lack thereof)! I've also met plenty of "visual stunners" who were about as interesting as a small piece of cheese and my attraction to them lasted about 5 minutes (or as long as it took them to start talking).

honey, I hope you realise that no matter how much your xp chooses to blame his lack of interest in the relationship on YOUR efforts at glamming up for him, that is not, and cannot be, the real deep-down reason for him not wanting to continue. Now if he'd said that it's down to you not being bothered to make an effort, fair enough, but you don't sound like the Waynetta Slob type to me...

I have also known several very happy elderly couples who were not interested in clothes or appearance

my parents are neat and tidy but totally non-glam

see no sign of them heading for the divorce courts after 50+ years of marriage

most of the really happy longterm couples I know seem to fall in this category

they look after themselves enough not to be offensive, but most of their lives is taken up with other thoughts

A person can look good without being obsessed with it.

It isn't mutually exclusive. People can have interesting and full lives as well as looking good.

Perhaps it's the French influence in our families case, it's just a cultural thing.

Anyway I still maintain that despite this the op and her dp aren't suited, and it's all a bit controlling.

I am with Marsha and Anna on this on, perhaps it is a European thing but I think both parties in a marriage should try as best as possible not to let themselves go.

There are obviously times when you don't look your best but a constant lack of pride in appearance, clothes, not keeping in shape does put me off and I think my DH would be disappointed too. I am not talking about putting on a few pounds at xmas by the way but a real neglect on appearance.

Hi - I dont think anyone is talking about letting oneself go, but merely that one shouldn't be expected to have to be in full regalia at all times to be loved.

I don't think anyone would condone that. I do of course see that everyone likes to be appreciated, and for their other half to make the effort. My hubby always asks me if what he's wearing is ok if we are going out(his way of checking he looks good) and I do the same.

We both love it when the other dresses up, but equally love snuggling on the sofa in our pyjamas, watching tv and waiting for our curry to be delivered (occasionally - not all the time - we arent blimps!)

xxx

Makes complete sense, seenitdoneit. This issue seems to be being perceived as a bit black-and-white by some on here - as though you make the effort or you don't. I think it's a greyer area - reasonable effort most of the time, with some especially glam moments occasionally, and some dire ones too. Isn't that real life?

And my issue is that - referring to your post, seenitdone it - DS's dad would love it when I'm done up for a wedding or suchlike, understandably, but I sense he's looking at me disappointedly when I'm in my pyjamas first thing in the morning, or am snuggled up on the sofa in a cardie waiting for a takeaway, as you say. I want the freedom to be in these 'modes', in comfy clothes (still with a bit of make-up on!), without feeling unacceptable. And I think that's reasonable.

And as other posters have said, this definitely isn't the only issue for us. I think I said in my OP that this thread would concern one issue which has come to the fore again recently. It isn't all about this at all - you're right. And probably, other 'stuff' feeds into this issue too.

Thanks for all the posts.

Hi honeydews - and that is why you need to poke him in the eye with a VERY sharp stick and tell him there is more to you (much more - you sound funny and lovely and I bet you are much more beautiful than you see yourself and knock him sideways in that department) than having to dress like a stepford wife, and he can go and find himself some vacuous bimbo who has nothing else to think about than whether her nails need painting or her hair is "falling just so".

You're worth much, much more.
xx

Well there are times when one partner is really not making an effort, ie wearing the same food-stained vest every day and not washing... this is either a symptom of depression or an exhibition of a rather unpleasant complacency (I don;t have to bother any more, you've married me, so now I can pick my nose and eat it if I want to). But the thing is with high-maintenance glamourousness is that it involves a certain amount of unglamorousness to get there. It;s easy to look perfect all the time when you're not living with someone and therefore have space and privacy to wax your moustache and squeeze your blackheads and push your piles back up or whatever.

your partner sounds like he's having an early mid life crisis with classic 'grass is greener' issues.
Its no way to bring your wife out of herself and encourage her with naff comments like that.
Sounds emotionally retarded, and being that your a mother now possibly you've grown out of such superficial immaturity.
This doesn't sound like it has much at all to do with your looks....just such a shame its got such dire consequences for your family life.
Loose the looser.....these are his problems