How seriously should I be taking this - holiday tensions affecting future plans

[lifesabeatch]

Looking for any advice please, wise Mumsnetters.

Me and DP been together for 4 years. Late 50s.We’ve just got back from holiday, taking my DS15 and a friend of his, so the four of us staying in a villa. It was hard work tbh. Pressure points were the fact that teens didn’t get up until lunchtime, we found vodka that they’d stashed after staying up very late to watch sunrise, friend was sick in a taxi one evening, both quite moody, they didn’t want to eat with us every night so they’d go off (which in some ways was a relief). DS has ADHD (as does DP’s daughter, they are quite similar in some ways), but can be quite full on, impulsive and headstrong etc.Most of it was all fairly normal teen behaviour I’d say but on holiday it’s magnified when you’re all living in close quarters. Plus I felt so responsible for everyone having a good time. I found it exhausting. DP was understanding but it did spoil the time.

Anyway, separately to that, DP and I have planned to move in together next Xmas. We both have houses, plan is that I’ll keep mine and rent it out, he will buy bigger (in his name) and we move in. His daughters are adults, one may live with us.

My issue is, during the holiday, we talked about the future etc, we’ve got a difficult 12 months ahead for various reasons, and I said to him ‘but you will be here won’t you’, and rather than an absolute ‘yes’, he started talking about the relationship with his daughters and how that came first. He was relating that to us living together. He’s never wavered before, and has been very supportive of my DS who’s had problems with school. It now feels like he’s reluctant to live together because of my son.

We’re going away again, him and I, on our own for a few days, so I’m planning to try and talk to him properly about it, but I feel massively hurt by it. The holiday was quite tricky in places, but we still had a nice time together. I’ve always felt very loved by him, he’s been super supportive of me and my son over the past 4 years, and I’m guessing he just felt a bit worn down on the holiday – but for me, it feels like we’re not good enough or something. I feel like he already holds the cards, he is much better off than me financially, and now he will use the next 12 months to ‘assess’ whether he can bear to live with us or not. I need to change this in my head otherwise it will affect how I feel about him ☹ Problem is, I had a horrible marriage with someone who was very unreliable and now I feel like he’s wavering, which means I just want to pull away for self protection.

We communicate well, so maybe we can sort it out but it feels a bit of a mess.

Was is your son’s vape?

Thanks warmheartcoldfeet I think so too. The friend thing is good in some ways, they entertain each other, but just so much posturing and 'front', it was just so irritating 😩

I think this is spot on. I am honestly not sure that living together at this point is a great idea. Why not postpone for a few years?

I don't know if it was his vape. Personally I don't think he'd be stupid enough to take one into school.

15 was an awful age for my DS. He came out the other side about 17.
they want more freedom than they can handle and more than you’re able to give them. It’s a tussle

plus there’s the male vs male thing going on with your DP/DS

i moved in with my now DH when my DS was 11. DS is an angel tbh, but those 2 years were tough.

fwiw, I wouldn’t be happy with the moody bs on holiday, but being up all night and sleeping till noon is part and parcel of being a teen tbh. The vodka… we didn’t have that at 15 on holiday with his friend we used to take with us on holidays but when he was 17, they bought some rum on a Caribbean holiday. We did talk them out of the rocket fuel rum that they were going to buy. and there was also some weed.

so talk to your boy, and the mate and tell them that they’re not entitled to be moody or rude, but this phase won’t last forever

talk to your dp, I dare say he is a bit shell shocked - he has a girl, he has no idea.

my dh has 3 girls, AND he never lived with any of them as teens. He had no clue.

if your lad is ordinarily good, that’s his base personality, he’ll come back.

make sure he’s active!! My DS leaned to box, he’s a phenomenal boxer, the training and discipline were outstanding for his mood and overall wellbeing

Have you asked him if it was his vape? What reason did the school give for suspending him?

The point is, we're not talking about living together now - the plan is very much in 16 to 18 months time and always has been.

But to a certain extent, if we're not going ahead, I need to make some changes to my situation financially e.g. potentially selling my house.

It's a mix of emotional and practical considerations, alongside the feeling that my son is being weighed up to see if he makes the grade. It all feels so complicated, but I guess I just have to carry on as we are, get my son through school, and see how things look next summer. But I think there's now a bit of a cloud overhanging i.e. we won't be talking about house plans, and it's a bit awkward

Let the holiday dust settle.

Things may go back to the way they were in a few months time.

Maybe just let your partner voice all his concerns and be understanding.
It's natural to have reservations especially when there are children involved - especially teenagers! You may feel the same if you were in his shoes.

This with bells on- specifically that full time step parents can find it hard to suck up what is actually quite normal (albeit challenging) behaviour from older teens. I don’t think that makes the step parent a bad person at all- it’s quite understandable…..

OP my concern is that you may end up making DS’s pretty normal teen behaviour an issue that comes between you and DS, or which DS is shamed for, or feels is the cause of issues between you and DP.

Of course unacceptable behaviour isn’t ok. But at the same time it would be really tough for DS to feel that he must behave in a particular way to in order for DP to decide to move in with you both.

I think everyone's expectations of holidays are very different and it's hard to keep everyone happy. You've plenty of time to come to big decisions. I'd enjoy what sounds like a lovely relationship x

Instead of focusing on moving in, why not use your next deep conversation with DP to talk about DPs role as step parent?

Does he have any suggestions on how the two of you could parent together? How would you feel letting DP take some of the lead in parenting?

I wonder if you are focusing on the wrong thing. The primary factor in moving in together with a child is not about the relationship changes that brings you and DP. More significant is that if DP is resident with DS he becomes his step-parent. Have you talked about parenting DS together?

This is a completely understandable concern, and it sounds like you are in a tough position. From my POV though, it is risky and stressful to rely on moving in with DP as part of your medium / long term financial plan. It puts you in the back foot in so many ways.

To be honest, it's good that he's thinking about this now before you move in.
It may have been an eye opener for him on this holiday but again, that's no bad thing. His feelings are as valid as yours too, so yes, you both need to talk.

Why not wait a couple of years? You say he's really great with your son, a good steady partner in every way and if moving in together is on pause that doesn't mean he's not invested in you, just carry on how you've been - that's worked so far hasn't it? No reason it can't carry on working.

Your son too will grow up a lot in the next few years too and I presume not be moody, sneaking drink and being naughty every day of the week!!

On the one hand, a holiday where you are all kind of "trapped" with each other is not the same as normal everyday life. Plus it sounds like having the friend there just made everything more challenging. So it's not necessarily going to fully compare to living together.

On the other hand 15 is generally when things get more tricky, if they're going to, before they start to get better. In 16 months he will still only be 17, I assume, and not necessarily past the awkward teenage stage. (My youngest was at their worst at 17, though maybe missing most of year 10 and 11 due to covid exacerbated that.)

Maybe, rather than worrying about your partner's possible change of mind, you could let him know that you understand that he may find being a full time step dad to your son daunting and discuss alternative plans as a couple. For example, delaying moving in together for a few years. This would be preferable to sticking with the plan and having to break up when everything becomes too much for him.

Totally understand the hurt and stomach dropping humiliation of this shift in your partner’s attitude, small though it seems on the face of it.

It might be useful if you could maybe take a step back, like he has done, and reflect a bit on your plans?

It is quite clear from the sheer volume of threads on MN that blended families are fiendishly difficult!

Are you well prepared? Have you done any reading on the psychology and practicalities of it? Have you thought about how to make sure the arrangement works for absolutely everyone involved? And how the different people in your constellation might feel and respond?

There’s a bit of a sense of a knight in shining armour + damsel in distress about your dynamic.

He has arrived to save you from a bad marriage and your son from a deadbeat dad. And he’s wealthier too!

I wonder if it might do your relationship a lot of good if you took a little bit more control? Started asking difficult but important questions yourself about this future plan? Showed him that you’re a sensible, responsible adult, not a passive, hopeful, needy junior partner.

The holiday will, by definition, have been a bit of a test. And it sounds like a nightmare. Why on earth do you let your son get away with no housework?? He’s 15!!

Your son also sounds very, very troubled in a much wider sense. His behaviour is terrible, in school and on holiday. I think you need to gain some control over this before you even think about moving in together.

I can see that this is upsetting but perhaps not too surprising all things considered.

Realistically, he is going to weigh up whether this is a move he wants to make, because nobody’s twenty-five any more and that unconditional kind of love doesn’t really apply once you hit middle age and have a family to consider.

Did you set any ground rules for your son and his friend? Some of that is ‘normal teenage behaviour’ but some of it definitely isn’t. I can live with a few plates around the place and being a bit moody or lackadaisical but probably would have sent the friend home and read the riot act to DS after the alcohol was discovered. The late hours are also a pain if you want to do anything at all on holiday. I know others won’t agree but I would have woken them both up at ten each day, that’s surely a decent enough lie in? 😁

It was probably easy for him to hold a position as a supportive, liberal male role model for your son when it just involved supporting you on school issues but perhaps that cracks when it begins to impact his own life or enjoyment.

Keep your focus on working with school as far as possible to support your son through GCSEs and definitely don’t sell your house.

Op this, try to think about the positives, agree wait until you DS has finished his education before moving in together, that's ok, your partners ' wobble ' is ok too not in a negative way, I applaud you taking DS friend on this holiday but my god its bloody hard work isn't it, trying to please everyone, maybe next time set some boundaries, washing up, days out, evening meals, but definitely enjoy the mornings go for a walk or a coffee somewhere as the grumpy teenagers will sleep in, i found with mine i need some boundaries otherwise its a free for all,

Like you DP mine to get a little overwhelmed holiday that's understandable as I would if I was joining him and family members, that's ok, you both have spoken about it, thats great, its good that you are having a few days away too,

My DP is great around my children and 2 GC but I just think I have more patience because their mine, so totally understand the dynamics aren't the same, again that's ok,

Your relationship is early days with the blending of children so take it slowly if its meant to be it will be, I think what am trying to say is ' you feeling a wobble ' is not its a good thing and you guys and learn from this 'wobble ' roll with it for the next 18 months and see how things look then,

Once again 👏👏 for surviving the holiday with two moody grumpy teenagers 💐

Teenagers change a lot between 15-17. I think for him, the decisions about what he does post 16 education will have a big impact. On both his behaviour and the moving in situation.
Your partner loves you, but this has been a challenge. Perhaps his own daughters were easier at this age.
I understand you are anxious, but I don't think now is the right time to push the living situation convo. I would let dust settle first. And maybe accept that if your plans are pushed back to two years or longer, than that's ok. If your partner needs that. Try not to see it as a rejection, but a sensible plan, to make sure things goes smoothly when you do live together.

This. My son has diagnosed ADHD and his teen years were a nightmare. No way would anyone who didn't love him unconditionallywant to live with him. As a adult he is now fantastic so your ds will improve . Take things very slowly as your ds could cause a lot of issues if he is still all over the place for a little wbile more. Ds won't always be like this so be patient.
And hs friend was very rude causing so much trouble but saying that l would never have allowed ds bring a friend as his choice of friends at that age was very questionable.

Thank you to everyone for your replies. Some incredibly well thought out comments and kindness, it is appreciated. I need to digest it all and think how I want to approach things when we go away as we'll be able to talk properly and it might have all settled a bit by then. I just need to stop thinking I'm somehow on the back foot - echoes of a PP mentioning damsel in distress above - am not interested in being that, but maybe I'm reinforcing that in some way. We are both quite open and communicative which is a massive help. Thankfully he is the complete opposite of ex-h in every way!!!

Honestly that sounds incredibly annoying from your ds and friend and I can see why your dp might be realising that he is not, after all, sure he has the patience needed to be a good parent to your ds full time. I have teens too. They would definitely sleep till noon. They might be inclined to leave their plates out but could readily be pulled up on it. They might be late meeting us once but we'd be pretty peeved and they wouldn't again. The vodka etc they'd have no interest in, thankfully. Add to that also not being keen to do anything and, it sounds like, not appreciating the holiday overall, yeah I'd be very frustrated in your dp's position.
I think it's not you at all but the dynamic, if he's questioning. You may be downplaying the behaviour as normal teen stuff, too. To me, one or two of the things you mentioned, plus the sleep, are normal teen things. All of them out together goes beyond that somewhat.
Things may feel different to your dp once the holiday dust settles, but it's very possible that he loves you deeply but doesn't know that he wants want to take on full time step parenting, or at least is a bit tepid just during or after this difficult holiday.

Framing this whole thing as DS being assessed and rejected by your partner because he doesn’t ‘make the grade’ is a bit unfair on both your partner and your son.

Your partner sounds lovely and supportive, interested in your child, and invested in building a life together. It’s just that - as you’ve acknowledged - this intense and undiluted time together, exacerbated by the presence of another teen, will have opened his eyes to exactly what he’s letting himself in for.

He’s done his parenting; he’s probably settled into a pretty quiet and comfortable routine in his own home, and now he’s faced with the reality of what life with a new partner and neurodiverse teen might look like. Teenagers are hard work at the best of times; boys with ADHD (no matter how lovely underneath it all) are, IME, unbelievably hard work and can take you right to the edge of your sanity - and that’s if they’re your own. Most people nearing the age of 60 would pause for thought before taking this on.

Don’t resent or mistrust your partner for being less than thrilled about the prospect. Having second thoughts about your joint living arrangements doesn’t mean he loves you or your son less. He may yet reconsider. A lot may change over the next 18 months, including your son’s maturity and ability to recognise how his behaviour impacts those around him.

I understand why you’re hurt and having a wobble, but don’t ascribe thoughts and motivations to someone before they themselves have told you how they feel - the things you’re assuming and telling yourself will probably be much worse than anything he’s actually thinking. I guess my basic advice is give yourself some breathing space before reacting, OP. The holiday was a bit of a shocker, but don’t throw the baby out with the bath water!

Living with someone else’s teenager is a big ask even if they are well behaved. Living with someone else’s troubled teen is a huge thing to expect someone else to do. If your teenager caused stress and anxiety on the holiday your DP is sensible to be reconsidering living with him. The last thing you want is for you to all move in together and then there be constant tension between your DS and DP. Being kind and fun to a teen is much easier when you’re not living with them and not dealing with their difficult behaviour every day, how much of DS’s rude behaviour has DP had to deal with before? Obviously he is your son so you are able to tolerate this more but I’m not surprised your DP is having second thoughts. Yes, much of it is typical teen behaviour but that doesn’t mean it is enjoyable to live with, especially if the teen isn’t even yours.

Personally I think you should wait until DS is an adult and has moved out or grown out of his difficult behaviour before considering moving in together, I think you are romanticising the idea of it and not considering the impact it will have on your DP having to live with a difficult DS or the impact it will have on DS when DP inevitably loses his patience with him and isn’t able to remain kind and fun in response to surly and rude behaviour day in day out.

I agree with @EnjoythemoneyJane . Like your DP, I have also said two kids into adulthood, and there is no way I would be willing to live with a teen again. It's exhausting and fun when it's your own, but exhausting and frustrating when it's somebody else's, especially when they don't behave and you don't have a say in anything. You are basically forced to live with someone who you can't voice an opinion on as you would if it was your own child.

Please wait with moving in until your DS is finished with his education. Don't blame your DP for this, he sounds like a decent man, and don't blame your DS for it either, he is just being a teen. Nobody has to take the blame. It's you and your DP who are going to live together, no need to involve your DS.

Living in and contributing to a house that is in his name only nah