What type of counsellor could help me manage difficult male relatives?

[ExhaustedFrazzledBeaten]

My DH has suggested that I have some counselling and if he is saying this, believe me I must need it.

I am exhausted, frazzled and beaten by the men in my blood family. I am the last blood female (mum, all aunts, cousins, grandparents are all gone) and I am just worn down by them. I am talking about the ones who are divorced or widowed. Since they have no wife to soak up their behaviour, they default to me, and believe me their behaviour is awful.

People have told me just not to listen, ignore them etc. but it is not that simple. I want to, but I am finding it hard.

Someone once told me that they "mither me to death" and I think this is a good description. I have always thought deep down that the men in my family have had a major hand in the deaths of my female relatives, as in they were treated very badly, and I am really scared that I am going to end up the same way. I thought this is an irrational thing to say, but my DH actually agrees.

I would like to go for some counselling to help me navigate my relationship with blood family, whether that be coping techniques, or helping me to go NC with them because they are affecting my MH and my relationship with my DH and DC.

To avoid picking the wrong kind, can you tell me what kind of counsellor should I be looking for?

In my opinion, you don’t need a specialist counsellor. Although the challenge is with your male relatives, the person needing to understand themselves and learn different skills and strategies is you. They are irrelevant.

In fact, they are irrelevant, full stop. You are important.

What are these relatives doing?

any good counsellor can help you. You have awareness already, which is excellent. Now it’s a bit about exploring your emotions around it and setting your boundaries and achieving your goals.

I agree that you probably don’t need to see a specialist counsellor. People need Counselling for a huge variety of reasons and a
good Counsellor should help you explore why you’re behaving in the way that you do.

I had Counselling after an event that affects about 1000 people a year in the UK, so not that common and most Counsellors won’t have heard about it. My Counsellor was brilliant and really helped to dig me out of a black hole.

One thing I would say though is to pick a female Counsellor if you can.

I also have to manage a difficult relationship with a man and I am finding that a more "life coach" approach works well.

Like you I know what the issue is, and my own "stuff" is not contributing to the problem, nor is their behaviour going to change...so what I'm trying to change is how I respond to it.

So there's nothing for me to realise in the normal counselling sense, but having my therapist tell me "it's ok to say no, practice not answering his texts immediately, or even at all" is somehow starting to override my inherent people-pleasing tendencies. It's like her expertise is giving me permission to behave differently...because she knows what's reasonable behaviour and I can trust that.

It's not an immediate fix, it's taking a while, but I am gradually becoming more able to stand up to him and not play the games he is so good at. Some days it's more comfortable than others, but over time it is definitely getting easier.

Would something like that work for you do you think, so you can start to not feel so dragged about by the demands of others?

This. The focus will be on why you appear to feel they’re your problem, and on unpicking your damaging thought patterns like it being, according to you, normal for badly-behaved men to have wives whose role is ‘to soak up their bad behaviour’.

I don’t think it’s normal for women to soak up men’s poor behaviour, but this is what I’ve grown up with.

I’m an educated, assertive, successful individual with a lovely husband and DC. However, growing up I saw many things that I indirectly attribute to the men around them;

My own mum dying of cancer, following a lot of stress in her life including having to put up with poor behaviour from my dad, and other male relatives. I would say that my mum was “mithered to death”.

An aunt who also died of cancer, whose DH refused to look after her and my mum did all of it. My mum was then exhausted, upset and ill. She got fobbed off by the doctor and was then diagnosed with terminal cancer.

Another male relative whose wife dropped dead from the stress of his behaviour.

A cousin who died who’s sibling to this day refuses to give up the parental home to be sold for her young children.

Now I’m the last one remaining, and feel the dogs have been set on me. I know that is highly irrational, but it’s how I feel. My rational, sensible husband agrees!

Aside from this, it’s now all coming out about both my dad (his affairs, his behaviour) and now also about my dead mum and her behaviour, which has really shocked and upset me as I’ve comforted myself over the years with nice memories of her.

I feel like the autonomy of my own MH and wellbeing has been taken away from me, and is now beyond my control. Usually I’m really good at navigating my own life, steering my own ship, but feel helpless as the men around me individually chip away at me day after day.

So, yes I think I need a counsellor, and quick!

Bless you, that sounds awful. It’s their bad behaviour. It isn’t associated with you. You don’t have to tolerate it because they are related to you.

I have a badly behaved relative that needs my care and involvement. I have worked out what I can and can’t do, and stick to that. I recommend they get a PA whenever I’m pushed for more. Someone said recently better to feel guilt than resentment. But I don’t feel guilt! I know I do plenty!

You cant cancel our arseholery with counselling.

Just reduce your contact. Vote with your feet!

No contact is the way to go.

then some counselling. Then if you desire it. You can increase contact.

block them, ignore them, change your emails and phone numbers. Don’t answer the door. Let your DH be your gate keeper.

toxic people should not be tolerated.

Look up the Grey Rock technique, it helps you to turn everything back on them,
male family member says bla bla bla
you say, gosh sounds hard, what are you going to do about it
male family member blalalalalalal
you say, yes, it does indeed sound hard, what are you going to do .

Repeat first and second sentences of your over and over and over and do not vary from these words.

I'm not sure you need counselling, but you do need boundaries.

Maybe support with people-pleasing and assertiveness?

You're not obliged to run round after your male relatives.

So, all hell has just broken loose.

I just spoke with the main toxic male relative, and I told them I cannot do this anymore.

I have been put on an urgent pathway WRT a medical issue I have. Last night I was in A&E with my DC and now I have to take them for tests. I just cannot do this anymore. This is where I feel history is repeating itself. Woman is really stressed by them, gets sick, goes for tests, has something nasty.

So, I spoke to them and they started off with the usual him-fest and the misery. I just snapped and said I have my own problems, and I cannot do this anymore and I am taking a few weeks break from talking to them whilst I sort myself and DC out.

Now I have missed texts and calls from another male relative who is angry as they have called him and viciously blamed him for what I have said.

It has all gone tits up.

Block them.

you can block on your phone so they cannot ring you
you can filter their emails so you do not see them (or just block them)
every messenger app I am aware of has a block function,

use it.

Be glad it’s gone tits up. Now is your chance to build strong boundaries, block them and move on. You’ve got enough problems with caring for your family and your own health. Take this opportunity to break free.

You need therapy to help you find the anger they deserve, it will spur you on to NC.

I hope your health is recoverable 💐

Try and think it through.

These men do not care about you as a person, with thoughts and feelings, because this is not how you treat people you care about. You could be anyone to them, you could be a stranger in the street who listens to them ramble on.
You are just a wall for them to throw things at.

If you cut them out, they will just find someone else, these men always do, you've said it yourself.
So their wants/needs will still be fulfilled, and you will GAIN the peace of mind.

Anyone who tries to get you to be nice to them is again, only thinking about themselves. They are thinking 'i dont like change' 'must maintain the status quo' because thats in human nature. If they cared about YOU, then their concern for you would override this and they would be telling the men to back off, or try to have a talk with you about how you are feeling and if you need support, but thats not whats happened. They are annoyed you have upset the status quo instead. Why would you sacrifice your wellbeing for people who simply do not care about you as a person. Or, if your people pleasing tendencies are too strong, then think about why would you put your husband and children through having to see you in pain, to please people who dont give a shit? Whose more important here?

Have a look at this webinar from Jefferson Fisher (from last night). The first case study is from a woman asking about how to deal with men in the workplace and I think you might find his suggested techniques useful;

Quite. Nobody has a clue.

When you say "all gone tits up", be extremely specific and clear in your own mind about EXACTLY what has happened.

No house caught fire
No-one drowned in a lake
No child left abandoned
No pets abused
No car crashed on a motorway
No-one started a fight at your birthday party
etc.

This is precisely and exactly what has happened to you: you spoke to someone, and now you have a load of missed calls and texts.
That is it.
That is the sum total of all of it
(plus your medical issue which is no-one else's business).

Are you particularly scared of men getting angry with you?

Do you honestly, deep-down, believe that it is women's correct role to care for men?

I'm saying this because you need perspective.
These people have no real power to hurt you.

I’m very much a fight your own battles type of person, but has your dh told them to stop or suggested they ring him instead? If he hasn’t, why not?
Block their numbers.

I would suggest you check out the Mel Robins 'Let Them' idea... if they feel disappointed that you aren't doing what they want... let them be disappointed, if they are unhappy when you say no... let them be unhappy/ deal with their own unhappiness (not your problem to fix), if they get angry about something... let them be angry (but not on your time/ head space).... You don't need to learn to deal with them, you need to unlearn your desire to please/ placate them/ centre their needs.

Useful phrases... 'why are you telling this to me?/ what are you going to do about it? <whatever problem they have called you about> /why are you asking me to do this? /

Now I have missed texts and calls from another male relative who is angry as they have called him and viciously blamed him for what I have said.It has all gone tits up.Not your circus, not your monkeys. If they want to fight amongst themselves, that's up to them.Drop the rope. As pp have said, "let them". It's not for you to referee your relatives. If they're abusive in call or text or in person towards you, say "dad/John/bro, I'm not going to let you verbally abuse me and I will block you if you continue." And block them if they continue. If they're demanding your time, energy, emotional labour and you've none to spare or no inclination to do it - just say "I haven't got the capacity for that, you'll have to figure something else out." You don't have to martyr yourself on the altar of family, especially if they're largely arseholes.

Good post from @StandingDeskDisco.