Interfering, childless friends!!

[mum2toby]

I don't know if anyone has the same problem, but I have many friends who do not have children, but seem to put it upon themselves to tell me how I should or shouldn't be doing stuff!!

Like quoting statistics about the dangers of having diamorphine during labour. How it can affect the way you bond with your baby. And how they "would NEVER have drugs during labour."

Or saying things like "Oh should you be feeding him baked beans, they are full of salt and I read that......" blah blah blah. My son is 19 mths old and a few baked beans once a week is not going to damage his kidneys!!!

Why do these women think they have the right or the knowledge to comment! Have they been through the agony of labour and child birth? Have
they been so sleep deprived that they could scream for hours!!

Have they ever had a toddler who won't eat??

They answer is NO! So keep your nose out I say!

I have at least 3 friends who are like this. If I hear once more that I should "just leave him to cry during the night" I will slap one of them. How do they know what it's like to just want a nights sleep??

Just wait until they have kids and we'll see how disciplined they are and how tidy their houses are and how much sleep they get!!

So a message to all the interfering women out there who have no children:

"STOP CRITICISING US PARENTS AND KEEP YOUR OPINIONS TO YOURSELF UNTIL YOU HAVE THE EXPERIENCE TO COMMENT"

...aaah that's better.

Thanks for that, Lindy

I was thinking of asking Mumsnet to start a "frivolous subjects" topic, so that miserable gits like me who feel driven to make a serious comment can stay away!

Can you just start smiling when they start, giggling when they continue and breaking into maniacal laughter if they keep on with the suggestions? Then say, "Oh that's too funny." And if they act all serious, wipe the tears of laughter from your eyes and say, "Well, I'll certainly remember you said that." (Thinking of course, that you will remind them if they have kids.)

Take in mind that this advice is from a person who has always tended to laugh when nervous....

Just mentioned this to my husband and he said that he would take any suggestion as an invitation to babysit. Don't know how relevant that is in every circumstance, but some, maybe, especially overnight. Actually, it's easier on children when the parents aren't around to help them break that bad habit of waking up. It only takes a few nights. (This is what you tell them... not what I believe.)

Not that you'd do it. Just let them think. But be so happy that they offered.

Lindy, re your 'professional mothers' comment, perhaps they don't have much else to talk about. I'm a full-time sahm, and I struggle to hold an adult conversation! Kids are my life, and I;m happy that way, but while I try to have 'outside' interests, my kids are by far the most interesting and important thing I have in my life. Plus, they are the only thing I can talk about with any authority!

Mum2Toby, I sympathise, my sister is just like this, (and a couple of mates to a lesser extent). I was only 18 when I had ds, and she's 2 years older. She always thought she would be the first to have kids, and I think that's part of the reason for her attitude. She hates accepting that I might know more about something than her.

Anais - I too am a SAHM but I like to have a variety of interests (my point is anyone can be a bore if they only have one subject to talk about, it could be their job, their hobby, sports team .... or kids) - anyway, I know from previous threads (especially HEd) that you have plenty of interesting subjects to talk about!

Sobernow I have friends/relatives who always phone at inconvenient times of the day too (tea time, bath time, you name it) so I tend to let the answering machine get the calls. I've got one of those phones that gives you the caller's number, so you know who it is before you answer it. Comes in very handy if you don't want to be caught up in a long conversation!!

I used to say (before I had ds) that I would make my baby fit in with me, and that I couldn't understand why people with babies subjected themselves to 'routines'. Now I am the biggest advocate of routine ever - ds thrived on having a routine and he was a much happier baby for it. Amazing how different motherhood actually IS, from what you imagined it to be.

Tillysmummy - your tale about entertaining childless friends is opposite to my experience. My child free friends are great baby sitters (keen to get some practice in perhaps) and always very consious that we work to a different timescale to them (one of then is starting their flat warming party very early evening so we can stay for a while without staying up late). Its a good friend with 3 kids that is less considerate.
I suppose the pattern started when they had 1, and we were child free - they'd come to visit, hand over their dd and promptly fall asleep. At that time they'd talk to us about other parents with poor parenting skills as though we were also parents (I suppose we've helped a lot with neices/nephews (13 total) & friends kids and we had similar attitudes to parenting but obviously no direct experience).
I don't think they've forgiven us for having ds (not as mobile or willing to babysit till he's old enough to mix it with their 3) - They can't see why one wee boy is causing us a problem, anything we're going through is old hat to them, and generally expect us still to fit into their plans which are much more free & easy due to the prescence of aupair and school age children who sleep 8-7. I'm being a bit harsh - they're good friends who genuinely feel for what we're going through (their memories arn't that short) but look on with amusement and sympathy.

We have had a number of friends who were quite generous with their advice to us in their childless days who are in the family way themselves and it is hilarious.
We were always expected to be so flexible and ignore ds's routines etc etc to accommodate very un-baby-friendly social engagements with several of these friends and now they all seem to be so rigid and inflexible themselves. I have many a secret chuckle to myself!
I can honestly say that I never, ever dolled out advice in my pre-child days as I thought babies and children were very scary beings (still do!!) and avoided all possible contact.

Janeway, your post really struck a chord - we are in a similar position with dear friends whose boys are quite a bit older than ours and have always slept about 14 hours a night. Having left the joys of toddlerhood behind them, they love to ask us all to stay, and how could we say no - we enjoy their company and their hospitality is legendary. BUT we always pay the price with an awful night's sleep and a grumpy little git the next day (and that's just dh).

MY GOODNESS!! I've opened a right can of worms here!!
Tissy - I wasn't talking about my close friends! If they said things like that to me I would laugh and tell them to bugger off (In a light-hearted way). I'm talking about friends of friends, work 'friends', people I occasionally socialise with (ds is 18mth now, I almost have a social life!!) etc etc etc. People that I might have a moan to about a sleepless night, or ds having a tantrum.
I love my friends dearly childless or not. If they offer useful advice then I'd be grateful (I like the idea of getting them to babysit!).

I'm talking about the kind of naive, disapproving, know-it-all, pearls of wisdom that just flow from the mouths of childless women. Not offering advice, just telling me I'm doing it all wrong coz ds wakes at night or the fact he wasn't breastfed for months!

I can totally relate to the inconvenient phone calls! Fortunately, I've got most my friends trained to phone me after 8pm when ds is sleeping (most of the time!).

I know we've all been childless to begin with, but I would never have told someone with children that they were doing it all wrong!

Mum2toby - have you ever considered writing down these comments and keeping them for when they have children - at least it will give you a laugh at the time!!

Jaybee - excellent idea. I'll start a wee excel spreadsheet!
One the afore mentioned people is pregnant at the moment. Hee hee hee.
After witnessing my ds having a tantrum, she went on to tell me I'd dealt with it all wrong! And a few days after that when I told her I was getting broody again she said............

......wait for it.....

"How can you have another one when you can't even handle the one you've got"

I'm sorry Tissy, but there is a line and that's crossing it!!!!

OK I confess to being slightly smug about the sluglet's sleeping habits, but I'm always at pains to point out that she has a very even temprament and has inherited her parent's love of the duvet. Having said that I LOATHE those professional parent types. One of my sister is like that. The rest of them are perfectly reasonable people with a sense of humour about the small creatures who inhabit our homes, but for her raising the perfect child is a mission. I'm sure she measures out every gram of fat and every ounce of salt she gives those poor kids. There just seems to be no fun in that house.

As for those childless friends, I took the opportunity just after the sluglet was born to describe in graphic and very colourful detail exactly what it was like to have a forcepts delivery after two and a half hours of pushing with no anasthetic. Exactly how much blood was lost and what it feels like to be stiched up without anasthetic especially when they couldn't stop the bleeding, so kept on putting more stiches in, the packing, the catheter and drips. Then offered to show them the scar and bruising.

Not surprisingly, none of them have offered child raising tips. I wonder why?

Ooooooh Mum2Toby - I am sending a cyber slap to that friend of yours !!! How could she ??? I am insensed on your behalf !

The biggest culprit for ringing up during bathtime is my MIL. Obviously I can't answer if I'm bathing DS. And if DH is bathing him I don't answer anyway out of principle.

Thanks Scatterbrain. When she said it I nearly bit my tongue off!!!

Oooooh, outrageous Mum2Toby, a slap from me too!

clucks just want to say thanks so much the brilliant laugh you've given me today. Thanks for the entertainment!

I heard that the only people who know more about bringing up children than childless women, are women who are pregnant with their first child!

Aha - that's certainly true Musica - that's coz they have plenty of time to read the infernal "baby books" - I remember swotting up before dd was born as though she were an exam that I must pass !! Have I touched any since ? (well - apart from GF and Toddler Taming obviously !) - No !

Also - my mother and mil frequently ring at bath/bedtime and every time they say - what time does she have a bath - I say 6.30 and then a few days later they ring again at 6.35 !! Worst culprit is dh though - rings me to tell me how he's getting on in the traffic - like I care !

And - I've just remembered another really upsetting annoying thing - an ex-friend who just happened to be a midwife, single, childless with dogs (say no more !) - rang me a few years ago when we were TTC - she didn't know this however - and said "are you pregnant yet ? why not ? you'd better get on with it my girl or you'll end up with a Downs baby !!" - I had to finish the conversation immediately as I was about to burst into tears !!

How a qualified midwife could be such an insensitive cow I still don't know !

But even worse - I didn't inform her when I was pg - but did send her a birth announcement card - she rang immediately and told me off for not telling her I was pg and proceeded to tell me that from the photo in the announcement it looked as though dd was going to be a very plain child ! She isn't - she's gorgeous and this person is now off the Xmas card list !!

Can you believe it ?

Scatterbrain, I've just read your post and my mouth dropped open.....what a cow! Her comment about having a down's baby is unforgiveable, she should be ashamed of herself, and fancy saying that about your dd's picture.....bet your dd turns out to be a supermodel

D'you think she might have been reluctantly childless and venting her envy on someone lucky enough to have a beautiful daughter. No excuse for it, though!

2 days after having dd2, a close friend got married 150 miles away. As dd2 was 16 days late, we had originally planned to go to the wedding (she very graciously said that she would "let" us bring our new baby to the wedding, even though it was a strictly child-free occasion). I was still considering it the morning of the wedding, but finally had to admit defeat and decided not to go. I always felt that she didn't really understand why I hadn't come, and was sooooo pleased to speak to her 2 weeks after her dd was born last year. I got her to try and imagine travelling 150 miles to a wedding, as well as having a 29 month old to leave at home with MIL. I think I am finally forgiven