Please help- extremely clever husband who is cheating.

[PeppyLemur]

Hi,

I am going crazy. I think my partner is cheating on me. Maybe even gay. We have been married for 11yrs and have two children. I can't leave without proof due to the culture I am from. My eyes were oblivious to everything he was doing until one day he was acting very odd (3 or 4yrs ago now). He works two jobs so is hardly at home or is at home when we aren't. I work during the day and that's when he's home. He's home for an hour after the kids get home from school then is off to his next job. He has one full day off from both jobs in the week. 3/4yrs ago, on that one day off he was acting very odd. I didn't say anything, just kept watching and observing him. Anyway, he basically pretended to go to sleep really early because he was very tired but went to bed dressed with socks etc on. He placed his wallet and watch outside in the hallway very carefully. I got into bed, pretended I fell asleep. As soon as he thought I was asleep, he began using his phone. He had called an uber and was waiting for it. He then very carefully got out of bed, got his wallet, watch, keys etc and went out of the house. He returned at 1 or 2 am. He went fresh and alert and came back really tired, out of it. He was very careful to open the door and be very quiet. He shut my room door and went straight in the shower. He was in there for an hour. I heard him brushing his teeth, using mouthwash etc. then he put the laundry on with his clothes inside. He then went and sat in the living room for an hour. Very stupidly, I just lay in bed, frozen and in shock. I should have confronted him then and there. But so many questions dawned on me, how long had this been going on for? How long has he been making me a fool? How long have I been so stupid to trust him? So many things were going through my mind that I couldn't confront him. For a week, I watched what he was doing. Everytime I'd come home from work, I'd realise the laundry was on and he'd hang the clothes out etc (always refused to do it when I asked him). And it was always his clothes. Then some days he slacked and only put them in the laundry when he realised I was getting suspicious. I checked them, he had obviously been masturbating because he had cum in his boxers. Anyway a week went past. I tried to get into his phone, I couldn't. Didn't know the password, he had so many locks on there. Then I tried to put the sim in my phone, managed to change the password for his email and instagram. I found out nothing because he deleted everything and unknown to my knowledge at the time- he had other accounts too. I found on his email, emails that he had changed his password, he done this daily- I found that odd. Anyways after a week I was done, I was killing myself. Trying to watch him, trying to get into his phone when he fell asleep, etc. I only saw him msging men on fb/instagram but couldn't see what he was typing or saying. I confronted him, I asked him if he was gay. He told me he wasn't but his hands were shaking. He showed me his phone but of course I didn't find anything in there because I didn't know where to look at the time and also because everything was hidden. He let me look at the phone for about 2mins. Then he started getting defensive and arguing with me about how dare I say that etc. anyway fast forward to now, I have been suspicious of him since then. He has a password on his phone that I don't know, he has a facial recognition on his phone. He will never let me hold his phone. He wouldn't let the kids on his phone but now does but doesn't let them out of his sight. Just in case I might take a look at his phone. If my battery is dead and I ask to use his phone to call someone, he will go put my phone on charge, wait till it's 3% then give it to me to call but not give me his phone. He knew my phone password, kept going on my phone and checking my msgs, my bank, etc. but after him not allowing me, I've also changed my lock etc. he has a lock on everything, WhatsApp etc. he now has a black screen so I can't see anything when next to him. I noticed he has three diff TikTok accounts. Before, he didn't have all privacy settings on TikTok so I could see what videos he liked, they were all gay ones. Then he noticed I was looking at his profile everyday and changed the settings. Recently I've noticed he gets so many notifications from Snapchat (mostly from men but some from women) but I'm on his Snapchat and do not see any of his snaps up. I desperately need to get into his phone but I can't. I need help. I am so desperate to get out of this relationship. In these 11yrs he has been controlling, playing mind games with me (so much so that I doubt myself now), he gaslights me so much, the mental abuse is unreal. Always comparing me to other women etc. before anyone says, just leave him you don't need proof- please don't. If I could, without proof, I wouldn't think twice. I wouldn't kill myself like this. I can't eat, sleep, rest. I know he's doing something but don't know what. I need help- please! Everyday, he refuses sex with me but I come home to see that he has masturbated, showered etc. I am acting totally dumb like I don't suspect him, don't know of anything. In the hopes that he will slip up but he is way too clever for me. He does not slip up, even when exhausted. Someone please help me get out of this. When I have proof, I will pack his bags, show him and his family the proof and apply for a divorce- I'm not suffering anymore. 11yrs is more than enough.

Absolutely all of this !!!!! The projection onto Op is clear as day.

You have more than enough proof. The only way you will feel sane is after you leave this man and stop being gaslighted and abused by him every day.

You cannot see the wood for the trees at the moment because it has become so normalised for you. When you are out of the abuse it will all become clear that he was 100% at fault and acting completely insane.

You will start to feel like your old self. Your kid will be happier, you will be happier, not walking on eggshells and getting criticised all the time. Your only regret will be not leaving him sooner.

Can you separate from even for a couple of weeks, go stay somewhere else? This will help clear your head so you can start thinking rationally.

Thank you everyone for your replies. Sorry that I can't reply to all of you individually.

Sprycat, your post opened my eyes a lot. I think since posting this here, I have realised how toxic this marriage is. I knew before but not the extent. I knew I was being gaslighted but didn't understand what was being said to me through words and actions.

i only caught him going out once but I don't know if he does still go out or not. He doesn't do anything during the night because it's too obvious but I'm unsure if he does it during the day as that's when I'm at work. He could do it when he tells me he's going to work but again I wouldn't know as I have the kids then and have to attend their clubs etc to try to spy on him. I also refuse to drive myself any more crazy than I already have become.

How do I get in contact with an IT specialist that can help me get into his tech? In the UK?

I don't know which private investigator would be good either in the UK to help me or how I go about finding them. I know they're expensive so will pay with a credit card and pay it off eventually. My freedom is worth any money.

In the past, I have tried to leave many times because of gaslighting, toxic etc but in my culture these things are pretty much normal and it is expected of a woman to deal with it. Many times I have tried but my family, his family and him have managed to get me back. That's why, this time I want to leave with the deck of cards in my hand. I'm not going to bother telling my family, I'll do what I need to for myself and my children but I will tell his family and because I'll have leverage, they'll leave me be. I've got a feeling they knew he was gay before our marriage.

Everyday feels so heavy. I almost don't want to be here anymore. I just don't know what to do. Please don't say just leave because it doesn't help me. Please don't ask me what I'll do, live with him forever? Because that also doesn't help. When someone posts on forums like this, you have to understand they are at their lowest to be asking strangers for help so please be kind.

Could you put fake profiles on dating sites, you are male looking for a male for some fun? Put in an area close by and search to see if he on there?

Hey listen, from everything you’ve said you DON’T need any more proof. Anyone can leave (and do leave) a marriage at any point for their own reasons.

I do feel from your updates that you are seeking some sort of validation to be able to call the marriage a day, but in contrast you also say that your aren’t bothered what others think.

So I guess the question is, what’s stopping you?

Your culture only constrains you as much as you allow it to. It's worth understanding what you are so afraid of if you do leave now. Is it that your family will disown you? That your community will ostracise you? When you think of all the things that might happen, is staying with your husband better than that, or worse? Cultures that make it difficult for women to leave marriages have designed it that way to subjugate women. Do you understand that and accept it? Because you can choose not to accept it - that may be at great personal cost, but you might decide it's worth it.

Regarding protecting yourself from sexual infections/ diseases. Go to a sexual health clinic in person and explain that you need to register but cannot give your number/ email address due to your situation within your culture and then ask to be put on prep medication. Explain all your concerns you have mentioned here and that you cannot speak to your husband about the concerns or protect yourself from harm and abuse but you need to at minimum minimise your risk of contracting hiv. You will be eligible for prep. You can completely confide and ask that you are not contacted by them via text messaging/ email. It’s really the least you can do to potentially prevent yourself from contracting an incurable disease.

Is it stupid to say that I am scared of doing something like that for fear of being caught? I don't want this whole thing turning on me. For him to be able to turn around and say, actually you're cheating because you're on these websites. I wouldn't even know where to begin either. Like what websites does he visit or not, I've no idea.

From this whole thing, I have realised one thing. In 11yrs, I haven't really figured him out as much as I thought. It's almost like I've been living with a stranger.

Lina, I am waiting to do this. I have tried booking an appointment at the SHC but they are a month away. I am waiting for holidays from work to go into their walk in clinics. Thank you for your advice, I will ask them to do that.

MaybeIAmJustABitch, I guess what's stopping me is my own conscience. I want to know I'm doing the right thing. I want to know that I'm not leaving this marriage because I'm weak (I know I'm not but it's how culture will portray it) but because actually he not only was horrible to me but also cheated. Tomorrow when my children are slightly older and ask me why I left their dad, I can say with 100% certainty that it was for the right reasons.

I really am unsure if he goes out and does things or has people in the house because last week he was very odd. I was at my mums house and he was constantly calling me. I missed 4 of his calls. When I called him back, he said "yes I'm coming home, I'm on the way" and cut the call. So I left my mums house and began driving home, I was getting ready to go anyway. As I was driving home, I called him asking why he came home (it's very unusual for him). He realised I was driving so he began asking if I had left my mums house. He then started to sound panicky. He was asking me where about i was, what road I was on, what way I was coming home. I replied with why? Genuinely confused as to why he was so panicky and asking me so many questions at once. I told him I had just left my mums house and was coming home the way I always come home. I asked him why again. He was hesitant. He didn't know what to say. He then said "I wanted to ask you to pick me up a takeaway on the way home as I haven't had dinner yet". I told him I didn't have any money, he told me he'd transfer me some but I told him I was in overdraft and it'd just go towards that (I knew he wouldn't want to pay my overdraft so I lied). He said okay and that he'd make something at home to eat. He kept trying to cut the call, i asked him why he was in a rush to cut the call. It slipped from
his mouth as he was beginning to get irritated by me that he needed to have a shower, I pretended I didn't hear that and he tried to cover it by saying he wants to get changed into his pyjamas and relax. I got home after 15mins, he was literally changing into his pyjamas then and was in a hurry to do it, almost trying to hide the fact that after 15mins he still wasn't in his night clothes. It was very odd. After this he began acting very ill and shady but he was visibly annoyed. I don't know if he was going to go out, if someone was going to come around or if he was going to have some kind of session on his phone.

If you’re not going to take clear opportunities like that one, you’re even less likely to get proof than I already thought. You might as well resign yourself now to staying with him forever.

He is very panicky isn’t he! I don’t think he’s as clever as you think@PeppyLemur, it’s easy to lock down your phone with unknown passcodes but it’s his panic that’s the giveaway. You were off work and he kept checking to see how far away you were, delay your journey and an estimated time you would arrive home! He was annoyed when you came back because you had interrupted his plans. It sounds like he has a male escort visit your home.
I would act as dumb as he believes you to be, stop acting suspicious or asking questions about his phone or why he’s still not in his pyjamas. You need him to become complacent to feel you are completely unaware of his obvious behaviour that he is up to no good.
I would look up small listening devices to put under furniture like the bed and sofa that you can record everything.

You have explained why you won’t leave without proof so ignore unhelpful posts telling you that you have missed clear opportunities to catch him out and might as well resign yourself now with staying with him forever!

You need advice and clarity that other people agree your husband is acting suspicious too because you’ve been gaslighted for so long that you question yourself because your husband has tried twisting reality to make you the scapegoat for his unhappiness. We can help you untangle his actions and words to reveal his manipulation. We can offer advice on how to empower yourself to see that you are not the person he is trying to project you are.
He is rejecting you because you are female, everything he says that he finds lacking in you as his partner he would say to any female because he wants a male partner. There is nothing wrong with you in the slightest @PeppyLemur x

I say what I say because I think OP requires a standard of proof that will never be attainable and I want her to be crystal clear on the implications of that.

And this latest post makes me wonder if her heart is even in catching him in the act. For someone on high alert to his lies it seems incredible that she kept giving him warnings of her imminent return.

I read OP’s posts as being the first time she has reached out for help, she has an emotionally abusive husband and she is trying to not only make sense of being gaslighted but to tentatively see her options on how to get proof. I think OP would find it hard to lie to him because of the repercussions and would avoid catching him in the act with her DC with her if there was another way of getting proof without her having to physically catch him.

True. OP could have said she’ll be a while and then snuck into the house.

One silver lining is that he’s clearly pursuing things in his own home so OP might be able to set up some sort of recording device to get the proof she needs.

Agreed

Honestly, if you genuinely think he's bringing people into your home, the most obvious thing to do is to set up a camera. You don't have to do it forever - set one up for a fortnight, for example, and plan to be gone for an evening etc. with your kids during that time. It's a matter of safety in addition to cheating - who knows who he is bringing there while your jewellery etc. is lying around. But set yourself a time limit and stop filming after a defined period, because it's not fair on him for you to film forever if actually there isn't any evidence of wrongdoing.

Thank you. I do ignore the posts of people who don't really know what they're talking about. I put it down to two things, either they have never dealt with a situation like this so don't know what it feels like or they have and life has made them very bitter. Either one, it's not kind.

Thank you for understanding Sprycat, that's exactly how I'm feeling.

For those who are saying that I'm on high alert of his lies etc and I wasn't clever enough to catch him out that day- you have to understand that my sole purpose in life is not just to catch him. I have beautiful children, I have a full time job, I have a home, I also have other problems in life. I cannot always catch up with him. I cannot always lie. It's not who I am as a person. To even get to this stage I have had to change so many things about myself which I do not like but have had to do so that he doesn't suspect that I know. I get tired of trying to catch him out. I am mentally exhausted trying to deal with everything that life brings and then what he brings. I am not always going to be 100% on the ball with what he's doing and there's lot of times where I don't have the mental capacity or energy to keep up with him.

At the moment, I am literally acting very dumb. Oblivious to him masturbating, oblivious to why he had the laundry on and hanging out before I got home, oblivious to why he wants to know everything, oblivious to what he's doing on his phone. I think he's trying to test me at the moment because he will leave the room and leave his phone on the sofa or the bed but I literally act like I couldn't less bothered by it.

The only way I've thought I could catch him out is when he gives the children his phone. Though he is always on edge when they are. If I go into the room where the children are with his phone he will immediately follow me to find out if I'm checking his phone or not. I need him to be very complacent before I could do that. So much so that he doesn't come after me when they are on the phone. I need just enough time to add myself onto his face recognition so that I could go onto it at night or something.

Maybe you should shop for something like this and see what it provides?

Thank you. The alarm clock looks quite good but I'm worried it might make him suspicious.

I've also been looking at recorders but im scared to use it. He looks everywhere. There really isn't anywhere in the house where he doesn't look.

Get an airtag and stick it in his car. Detection methods are not risk free though

If you bought a couple of diffusers, he would check them and a few weeks later you could switch them over for the cameras. He will only be looking for anything new. I would dab some of the aroma from the real ones on them so they smell nice.

If you could leave your phone in the room he is in when you suspect he will be making phone calls - you get a 'Sleep talk recorder' app which activates and records whenever someone talks/ makes noise. Might catch something that way?

There really isn't anywhere in the house where he doesn't look.
….. what is he constantly looking for exactly?
Do you think he knows he isn’t trusted to the extent that he would check plug sockets for cameras?

So he’s Muslim. I’d hire a PI. Or follow him somehow.