MARCH 2026 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."
6

I’m sad because I’d believed my mums lies, which then made my relationship with my father very strained. I found his home to be a safe space but was confused by the lack of violence. My mum said my dad had repeatedly hit her, causing her to lash out at him with a knife.
I found that was untrue and that they’d been arguing and my dad had his back to her. He wasn’t argumentative with her at all. In fact I think he was scared of her. He never once bad mouthed her, none of that family did. But my mum insisted on telling me about how dreadful my dad was, how he’d be letting me down and not collecting me on day trips etc that he’d (apparently) organised.
my stepmum is one of the most loving and kind people I know. My mum used to slag her off for being “wet”.
I personally believe my mother has Boderline personality disorder but she’ll never admit it, she thinks everyone’s out to get her all the time and is extremely paranoid to the point where she breaks up families and friendships (people get wise to her though). My childhood was very unhappy as she would constantly berate me for things that I hadn’t done, diagnosed me as a pathological liar and I would be later diagnosed with GADS and (unconfirmed but told by a psych- who was unable to diagnose- I appear as) CPTSD due to her behaviour- obvs there’s other trauma in there too.
she used to be a very oversexualised woman, she’d tell me about the size of her partners penises and also my dads… why I needed to know that I don’t know. She’s also put her male relationships before me but would tell me profusely that I was the main person in her life.

Sorry I appear to have gone off on a tangent! But to answer your question my relationship with my dad was very fractured, my children never met him even though I wanted them to. I felt he wouldn’t have been bothered and wasn’t interested (that’s what my mother had told me). I’d last seen him at my grandads funeral around 10 years ago but have enjoyed an ongoing relationship with my stepmum for probably around 15-20. I know she’d tell him what I’d been up to. And we were planning on meeting in May, just me and my dad and my stepmum, but unfortunately that’s been cruelly taken away from me.
My dad was a complex man and had his own issues- mainly severe anxiety. I understand to an extent how crippling anxiety can be having suffered with it myself for many years so I don’t blame him at all. If anything I just feel so sorry for him that he was hurting so much. He hadn’t tried anything like this before and clearly had had enough.
when I told my mother what had happened her words were “I know exactly how he felt” how I didn’t tell her to fuckoff and put the phone down I’ll never know.
But my god, his death became my mother’s show. I was getting bombarded constantly with texts and calls to the point where my brother had to step in and tell her (and my stepdad) to leave me alone. They were causing me so much anxiety and all I wanted to do was to grieve my dad and be there for my stepmum.
She tried to insist on coming with me to my step mums house and the funeral to which I said absolutely fucking not. I didn’t even tell her when the funeral was until it was over- and I didn’t tell her either, it was my brother who did. My brother (who I should’ve mentioned was a stepbrother from my mums marriage to my stepdad) came with me to the funeral and after meeting everyone and hearing about my dads life (he worked a lot with disabled men and enjoyed this work so much) went very quiet.. and then said “I don’t believe a single thing your mums said about your dad”.
So there’s a little more background. I apologise in advance for the wall of text!

@ConsistentlyPeeved I’m so sorry to hear about your dad. Your mum is a monster for doing this to you. I’m glad you have your stepbrother now as an ally. Sending hugs.

Im sorry that sounds awful. Narcissistic parents really do not care the chaos they cause in their bid to remain right, even turning the kids against the safer parent. What your mum did is unforgivable. Your dad sounded extremely vulnerable and you find yourself in this position now also due to her problem. I hope some sense can be made and you can pull yourself apart from this.

I'm sorry you didn't have the chance of a better relationship with your dad peeved. Perhaps he cheated to get your mum to discard him 🤷 she sounds enough to give anyone anxiety. Step brother and step mother sounds nice people though, so it's good fate has brought them into your life. Don't feel bad if you need to block mum and stepdad so you can grieve in peace though, whether you decide to unblock them in future or not.

My children’s behaviour has changed a lot this last week. My daughter has been so clingy. My son has gone from 3 teacher meetings about fighting the previous week to independently taking himself off to work alone and helping friends with their work.

I think the situation with the grandparents and nephew might have been doing more damage than I’d thought.

@ConsistentlyPeevedi am so sorry for the loss of your Dad

Slow sloths

Do not reply to your mother’s letter. Doing so will incite a response and that door needs to remain firmly closed.

welliies

Walk away from both your mother and gb2. They are one and the same. No good to you will come from
being at all involved, and what Sam and Annie writes on her post of 11/6 at 20.53.

@SlowSloths I probably wouldn’t bother writing either. If you do, I would do it from a “this is what I want to say so that I have said it” perspective, without expecting her to understand or take it in or change. Just for the sake of knowing you have said it. But I think she sounds like a lost cause really.

@ConsistentlyPeeved I have no advice, but wanted to say I'm sorry you're going through this.

@SamAndAnnie @AttilaTheMeerkat @Eeriefairy Thank you for your thoughts on my situation. It's really helped me to reflect on what's actually happening. I don't think Mum's trying to play us off against each other (her manipulation has invariably been to try to get me to spend more time with GB2, not to argue with him). But I do think it may be a sort of wonky version of how for most of my life, certainly all my adult life, our parents would complain to me about unreasonable/difficult things they were having to do because of GB1 or GB2. It was always presented as something where for various reasons it absolutely had to be done but at the same time doing it would not be good for their wellbeing. Usually one would complain about the impact on the other until I felt I had to intervene and help out, when we all knew that if I had been asked directly in advance I would have said no. As a bonus this was often something that they could talk about a sanitised version of to others to help show how close we all are. Eg. DH doing a 5 hour trip the night before our wedding to collect GB1 (who we were brow beaten in to inviting) and his family to save Dad (who had a chronic illness) having to do it when the train tickets bought for them had been 'lost' (definitely handed back for a partial refund). The narrative was that DH insisted because he wanted a chance to get to spend some time with GB1 (he absolutely did not) and of course that's the sort of family we are- we all rally round when there's a problem.

I'm starting to wonder if this is a sort of dementia twisted version of the same. She does not want to live alone and does not want to go in to residential care. GB2 wants to move in with her (for his own reasons) and although she would never admit it she knows that it would become a disaster. As usual she won't say no to him, or directly voice the problems she anticipates so she is complaining to me and hoping I will sort it all out. I know that if I challenge GB2 she will not voice her concerns and she also repeatedly tells everyone how concerned she is that GB2 is doing too much (for her and for his own family). So I suspect somehow she thinks if she complains I will offer to solve the problem in a way that means GB2 doesn't move in, she doesn't live alone, she doesn't need paid care and she doesn't move to residential care - which could only possibly mean me staying with her some or all the time. This will absolutely not be happening.

So I think that at least for now I have to leave them to it. If later down the line I think that mum's not being cared for I will raise a concern with social services but unless she's in danger I think I have to get better at not involving myself.

Does anyone ever feel that the more they look into narcissism the more they start to analyse there other relationships? I feel like society is based on humans walking around using other humans to regulate their own emotions. I have a friend who is drawn to people in trouble. She loves to “help” people but as soon as the help isn’t required she is off. When we met I thought she was a good person but the longer it goes on the more it feels like she is helping people in order to fix something within herself. She keeps offering me help, anything I need. I don’t need help though and it’s starting to annoy me. I want a friend to come over without a crisis to fix. For a second I thought perhaps I’m too boring but on reflection she just needs a crisis.

I think I actually struggle with friendships. People seem to always want something and that isn’t me, it’s what they can fix or regulate through me. What is this that I’m describing? Is this a co-dependancy thing? I don’t want relationships to use this way.

MustIgo Offering help that isn't wanted or needed could be about needing validation or a feeling of control, or it could be loan sharking (they want to have you in their debt so they can call in a favour later, or use it as a stick to beat you with.)
People seem to be increasingly self serving and nasty. I'm fed up with it.

This is what I’m talking about. I now seem to be noticing the self serving in so many relationships. I think I’ve over researched!!!! I don’t want to be someone’s validation, just want to be a friend.

Reminds me of the narc and the enabler, you scratch my back and I’ll overlook things and scratch your back. These just aren’t genuine relationships. A healthy person would bring up the unhealthy behaviour. I don’t really have a huge number of friends but I’m not into this kind of relationship. I always thought the narc partner was innocent but I’m coming to understand that they get something from this relationship, it’s not always out of fear which is what I used to think. I used to believe they couldn’t help it they together under duress but I’m starting to see a dependency.

@MustIgoI have to say, I misunderstood narcissist as a blanket term for difficult people, but when you start reading about it, my god. Certainly explains a few things about our family dynamic. And then I read about triangulating- it’s blown my mind. All these years I’ve been trying to “fix” things, never understanding where the flare ups come from, not appreciating that those flare ups are like oxygen to a narc. So there is no fixing it! I feel a bit liberated (and a bit daft, but nevermind).

It feels like they have weaponised and woven their trauma into their personality. I haven’t invested many years into my friend. I’ve tried to help her but she ends one chaos then into something else. It’s like she has learned she is only alive when she is the victim or the hero of another’s chaos.

Because it keeps her central and important. In our family, the chaos is created as an antidote to boredom. I can’t believe I didn’t see it until now. It isn’t conscious, they don’t know they’re doing it, and if you tried to tell them they were it would all be turned around on you - you’re being unreasonable. Crazy. Knowing it isn’t going to stop makes it easier to make choices though.

This is my friend. She is always needing to be integral. She claims to have ADHD. She may have. When she is your support she is fulfilled. I keep telling her to stay away from women in need. Stay away from those in crisis. But she won’t. She needs to help. Sad really as her kids are the ones she should focus on.

@MustIgoIt is sad, but at least it sounds like she’s actively channeling it into something positive if it does help someone. I’ve realised that my mother has been stirring the pot for years to everyone’s detriment and the benefit of no one. Well, I suppose it has fulfilled her need to feel important and it has stroked my brother’s ego, but from my family’s perspective it’s been absolutely bollocks and we’re all sick to the back teeth of it.

Yeah I don’t think her kids are that well off really as she puts all her energy into other people. She’s very depleted with them.

@MustIgoMight be a bit similar then, especially if she then makes a point of telling her kids all about it.

This describes my DH’s family very accurately. I couldn’t actually get my head around why there is such a need for drama, but “being central” in some big drama is probably the entire point. Like main character syndrome. With my MiL she is so entitled, she will make a big fuss about some small thing she expects for herself until it creates a huge problem with others around her (think along the lines of extending her house without planning permission just so she can have an extra downstairs bathroom), which is quite obviously narcissistic behaviour.

But the sibling, I’ll just say brother as that’s who he is, he was always inserting himself into others drama and trying to “rescue” people. It didn’t present in the same selfish way. But that’s it - if he can get in the middle of someone else’s drama, he can be the big hero or the big victim and either way he’s being the main character. Why didn’t I put this together before now?

The moral of the story is they will never change.

Re- enabler being innocent and involved through duress- I used to think this applied to my Mum with my 'difficult' brothers. Their behaviour, and the way they treated her (as well as others) was awful but she always fully supported them no matter what, even if this meant covering up/denying/putting up with some pretty awful things. For a very long time I saw her as entirely a victim and sticking by them (even if it meant not supporting/protecting or even falling out wit me or other people) out of fear that without her support they would be worse and hope that perhaps with support they would change. Now that I have adult children of my own I see it slightly differently and believe that although it undoubtedly caused her great stress at some level the constant crises and being needed to 'save' them fed some sort of need in her.

I can now see that she constantly involved herself in trying to 'fix' problems for other people as well (even if they didn't want help or even know there was anything to fix). As an example, a few years ago an elderly neighbour had been in hospital and then moved in to a care home. She saw his daughter clearing some things from his house and asked if she could go and visit him (I suspect the daughter assumed they had been friends, whereas in fact I'm not sure they had ever said more than hello). She went to see him and he must have told her that he was not keen on moving in to the care home and not being able to have all his belongings etc. Mum took his daughter's phone number from him and called her to 'sort it all out'. I don't know what was discussed but Mum was convinced that the daughter had 'tricked' her dad in to going in to a home but had agreed that Mum could 'rescue' some of his most precious belongings for safe keeping until he managed to 'sort things out'. She told all the other neighbours about the 'terrible business' and her having to save his belongings from an unkind daughter. For years Mum had a room in her house full of a stranger's random books/pots and pans/tools etc (frankly it all looked like total rubbish). She fully expected the daughter to come round regularly to collect things for her Dad and was extremely annoyed when she learned that the neighbour had passed away and no one had told her/collected his belongings. Even now that she is elderly and unable to do very much for herself she is attempting to involve herself in other people's business by suggesting that I do things for other people.

@EeriefairyI’ve spent years of bowing, smoothing, apologising, placating. Everything’s ok, you relax, and then there’s another shit storm, usually preempted by my brother.

For example, we’re still awaiting a response from him to our invitation to Christmas dinner 2025. My mother and father came. Mum said my brother couldn’t be bothered. When I pointed out that’s quite rude, it was nothing to do with her.

He lives with my parents. My nephew has a room there too. My kids have never spent more than a couple of hours there but that’s a separate issue. The upshot is that it feels like their house rather than my parents’ house now. And my mother seems to actively encourage the discrepancies and make a point of rubbing all of our noses in it.

The penultimate time we went to visit my parents (me, my partner, our two children) my brother hid upstairs the whole time. I forgot my sunglasses and went back - he’d come down as soon as we left. Other times he sits in the dining room adjacent to the lounge listening to everything we’re saying.

The last time I went we all left straight away, making a 3 hour round trip only to discover my father had decided to take my cousin out somewhere. I rang when we set out - my mother didn’t say a word! Too far.

My mother reports constant crises around my brother and his son. His ex had gone from surrogate daughter (my mother bought us both all the same presents when they got together) to the devil incarnate.

But all this gossiping and drama gives my mother something to do. It keeps her central in everyone’s lives. It gives her intimacy. It makes her important. And she is absolutely bored out of her mind living in the middle of nowhere. My dad never wants to go anywhere. I can’t believe I didn’t see it until now.

I think it doesn’t get put together because a lot of the behaviour could be classed as normal. Helping people is normal and decent but it’s not coming from a decent place. I mean I will help people I love and if I want to but I certainly don’t feel the need to do this all the time. I’ve got my own things to do also. I don’t insert myself into others situations. I tend to stay away. I think there is line of normal then it oversteps also the motive behind what they do.