Should I dump this man over sex or keep seeing him

[Mynotebookisfull]

Sorry it's long but want to avoid obvious questions.

I've recently met and have been dating a man. I'm early 40s he's late 40s. He ticks a lot of my boxes and is clear about what he wants which makes a change from so many men I've met through the apps! He has lots of good qualities.

Now the sticking point - sex. We've slept together - in the same bed - and had some intimacy but no actual sex. I'm all for talking about issues early so we've had a conversation initiated by me.

Short story is he doesn't do penetrative or oral sex from what I can gather. He has some issues clearly but I don't know yet where it stems from. It doesn't sound like his last two relationships were sexual in the traditional sense and he prefers role play, toys, kink (spanking, dirty talk, leaning into role play dynamics) and self pleasure - basically wanking next to each other. He says he has ED and viagra doesn't help. He probably hasn't had PIV sex in nearly two decades.

When we've been together he's touched himself but not me sexually although he is cuddly and affectionate. Not a hand on a boob let alone between my legs. When we've been intimate we've kissed (but not much, he doesn't particularly enjoy snogging or initiate it). It feels a bit like we're having seperate sexual experiences next to each other rather than 'together' if that makes sense.

I like vanilla sex I suppose you would say and feel it's important for intimacy and my enjoyment. I love kissing and touch. I need that 'normal' sex to bond with someone and feel close before moving on to kinks and other stuff.

Can I really continue seeing a man who doesn't do penetrative or oral sex at all?
I know sex might not always be as important to me as I move through menopause - but now I'm peri and horny and I love sex.
Appreciate any views or things I haven't considered.
Should I keep talking to him about it? Should I see if he tries to do something different? We've only just had the conversation - he knows what I want. Do I give him a chance to deliver or at least try?

It's not a conversation he enjoys or finds easy... I suspect deep repressed issues and yes I have considered whether he's grossed out by women's genitals or is gay etc.
I don't want to waste my time or life or have to teach a man how to fuck, frankly.

For contrast the last few men I've dated I've had great sex but they've been crap in so many other ways.
This one is great in the ways they were rubbish and I'm conscious of just discarding an otherwise good man - there aren't many out there and I do want a relationship.

I agree. There is no way on earth the OP needs to see a therapist because this bloke has a messed up view of sex. Good grief, are people really this desperate for a man that they'd suggest this- its pathetic

Somebody once told me that people show you who they are. I think he's already shown you very clearly who he is and what you can expect from him. And, as you'll already know, at this age men won't change.

Also, imagine how you're going to feel 5 years in, when the honeymoon period is over and you've not been touched or had proper sex for years. You're going to be so frustrated and could have enmeshed finances/housing by then. If you were 70 I may say go for it, but at early 40's, Nah, are you honestly thinking of becoming celibate at your age? Because that's the reality here for you - celibate from early 40's. You'll end up hating him, and fancying other men who are attractive and "normal".

As others have said it often causes so many problems:
Death grip
Not letting themselves build up sexual desire as they’re always wanking
Normal women not comparing to the fake stuff on screen
Porn women doing weird and extreme stuff
Porn isn’t an effort

No - I think you're thinking of people who are addicted to sex.

For men who are addicted to porn, it's most common for them to stop being aroused by or interested in sex with a real live woman. Real age appropriate women who have their own needs are never as good as the fantasy they have with the teenager on the screen who is only ever fully "into" his wants and needs. <can't find the vomit emoji to put here>

If you stay, this will erode your sense of self esteem. Been there, it’s not worth it

I met someone like this in my 20s and it disturbed me for ages. Even now, I cringe when I remember what I put up with and wish there had been mumsnet in those days for me to confide in someone and, no doubt, be told to run for the hills. He was clever enough to introduce his kinks gradually, as I too am a very "vanilla" person. I couldn't understand why he didn't want to touch me, I thought he was being respectful at first then when I walked in on him pleasuring himself wearing his (deceased) wife's bra and knickers, I realised we both wanted very different things from a relationship. He actually made me feel disrespected and dirty. I'd dump this guy as things will only get worse.

Please please please leave him and do it soon.

I married someone like this when I was young. Don't ask why - I guess I never had the wise people on Mumsnet to tell me I was stupid. Plus he was so handsome and great in every other way....
but the no penetrative sex killed me slowly from the inside... gradually we stopped cuddling as he felt guilty... I was desperate and left him so I could have sex with someone else.

It just did my head in. And of course we didn't conceive and no kids was a big deal for me x

Be careful. This sounds dangerously close to thinking that you're obliged to give him that love and affection because it's his right. It's well intentioned, but risks ignoring what YOU want and need from a relationship.

He has a human right to be able to have a loving and otherwise intimate relationship without sex. That does not mean that he is entitled to one with a you specifically. At all, but especially if your own desires and needs aren't being met.

His right to a relationship without sex does not trump your right to want sex in a relationship. It just means that you two aren't a good match.

Nowadays, we're all used to bending over backwards to demonstrate our tolerance for various approaches to sex. It can almost begin to feel as though we are somewhat unimaginative and dull for just wanting a bit of "vanilla" how's-yer-father.

But unless you have always had a secret desire to explore these fetishes, or want to spend the rest of your life struggling to unravel why someone is deeply fucked up, you're on a hiding to nothing here.

I'd be very surprised if he's not been grooming you to view him in the best possible light, so that he can test his control over you by consistently denying you pleasure. This is probably part of his general fetishism, and it won't get better with time.

Would it might help to think of this in terms of food? Would you want to be with a partner who could not simply sit down with you and tuck into a meal, but insisted on facing in opposite directions and rubbing the food slowly for hours, then leaving it on the table? No, because life is too short for this kind of bollox.

There are plenty of men out there who would be more than happy to bonk you. Some of them are very nice!

I'm not vanilla in the slightest but the lack of wanting to touch you or kiss would send me running. He doesn't care about your pleasure and just sees you as an object to fullfil his sexual gratification. He doesn't want to learn to be a better lover or take steps to solve his ED. He could strap up and fuck you etc, but he would never do this as he is only interested in himself.

What about you deserving intimacy? It's not just sex he's not interested in, you said he doesn't like to kiss or touch you.

I don't know why you're so hung up on the sex when most of the absolute basics of physical affection are absent as well.

Does he have like a massive house and huge income?

He's affectionate. I thought I said this?

Would your view differ if he was poor or rich?

I was just wondering if there was some lifestyle factor making you willing to compromise so much. There are decent blokes that will also shag you.

When we've been intimate we've kissed (but not much, he doesn't particularly enjoy snogging or initiate it).

You said this, so I took it that you don't kiss much.

I wouldn't.

His intentionality elsewhere doesn't mean he isn't avoidant. My last relationship was with a guy who lovebombed me, would do anything for me and my son, was so mindful of making every date special, called me 5 or 6 times a day, was a total sweetie - absolutely refused to commit, and had sexual issues too. Took me two years to find a backbone and an absolute age to get over him, because he was so confusingly lovely and I worshipped the bones of him.

You deserve relatively uncomplicated sex on reasonable, mutually agreeable terms and this relationship is starting a million miles from that.

but also aware we ALL have issues and if he is nearly perfect in other ways, how important is sex? I think it is important otherwise I wouldn't be asking - just wondered if there were things I hadn't considered.

This reminds me of the final scene in Some Like It Hot.

this relationship will involve you contorting yourself and your sexuality into pretzels to accommodate him. just let it go.

I think in years to come when he comes out as gay you will kick yourself if you stay now. If it's not that he is gay, ask him to explain specifically why he feels as he does and ask if he will consider therapy. If he doesn't take you up on it, I think you are best out of it.

I'm wondering if one more shot having had the conversation about it

I will not ever be with any man who needed persuading to have sex with me!

Absolutely no way i’d continue.

Exactly my thought.

One of my biggest turn ons is when a man desires ME. What on earth does he do that will give you that.

Id definitely throw this one back. At the very least he has a huge amount of issues around sex he’s got no interest in dealing with. It’s actually extremely selfish of him and nobody is selfish about sex and nothing else.

Run for the hills, OP

Short story is he doesn't do penetrative or oral sex from what I can gather. He has some issues clearly but I don't know yet where it stems from. It doesn't sound like his last two relationships were sexual in the traditional sense and he prefers role play, toys, kink (spanking, dirty talk, leaning into role play dynamics) and self pleasure - basically wanking next to each other. He says he has ED and viagra doesn't help. He probably hasn't had PIV sex in nearly two decades.

Is that the sort of sex you are into and want to have? Some kind of kinky stuff and then get yourselves off individually? If it isn't then you should dump him because you aren't compatible.

When we've been together he's touched himself but not me sexually although he is cuddly and affectionate. Not a hand on a boob let alone between my legs. When we've been intimate we've kissed (but not much, he doesn't particularly enjoy snogging or initiate it).

Oh FFS OP, he doesn't even touch you sexually. He doesn't enjoy snogging so you're barely kissed. If he didn't want PIV sex or wasn't able to do it, but was able/wanted to give you pleasure in other ways then maybe it could work, but he's not doing anything apart from lying next to you and wanking and expecting you to do the same.

Just bin him off.
He can find someone else who is happy with this kind of arrangement, someone who doesnt want PIV sex any more.
And you can find someone else who does want to have sex with you and will at least snog you!