Why is the bar so fucking low?!

[Cuppatealover]

I'm trying and failing miserably in the dating game.
Obviously I know not all men are the same. There are good ones out there but seemingly impossible to find.
The bar is so low in terms of expectations and willingness to put in an ounce of effort. Chats on online dating either fizzle quickly as they don't seem to want to or are unable to maintain a conversation. If they do, it very quickly turns to explicit chat and I would say it's 9 times out of 10 this way.
A bold statement, but at the age or 33, nearly 34, I'm starting to really dislike a lot of men and have completely lost faith in finding a life-long partner.
This isn't uncommon for my single friends either. I hear to same things time and time again from their experiences too.
Even friends who I would consider to be in good relationships tell me about their partners/husbands and how they are e.g. moody if not having regular sex (something I've also experienced in relationships), not pulling their weight with the children/housework etc. Is this where we've really got to? Where you find a decent one then it turns to shit anyway with women once again baring the responsibilities whilst being expected to basically be thrilled when men want them for sex?! Cause it's all they seem to want!
Absolutely burnt out with it and reaching the end of my tether when I feel I'm putting effort in and it isn't reciprocated. I've stopped messaging men who aren't very communicative. Then of course the conversations just stop if I'm not initiating. I've stopped being even the slightest bit flirty/giving compliments as it just turns to sex talk. Then again, any communication just stops. Are there any men out there who actually want a relationship and don't just think about getting their leg over 23 hours of the 24 in a day! I should mention that these men I am "speaking" with are on dating apps. Clearly they aren't meant for "dating".

Hiya, I wish I had some advice for you. I don’t, as at 35 and having left an unhealthy situation which also shattered my faith in men, I’m in a similar position. If you’re anything like me, you are always working on yourself. I just can’t help but feel the reciprocation from our male counterparts is often missing. Just a message to say hi, you aren’t alone in this!! I often joke to my friends about a group of nice gals buying a big plot of land, building a house and living happily ever after with lots of wine, chatting and a lovely clean house hahaha.

Most of the good men in the world exist, but they can be hard to find. I think the best thing to do is make friends with a guy first and then turn it into romance. The friend phase of the relationship is what determines his intentions.

You have to turn your thinking around. Firstly, there is nothing wrong with wanting sex. I want sex and wouldn't be in a sexless relationship. So there is nothing inherently wrong with that. Granted, I don't appreciate someone opening with that statement.

But here is where your thought process is faulty. You see them dropping out of the conversation after you stop initiating as a bad thing. It isn't. It's information, not rejection. So you talk to 100 guys and 99 of them go quiet within the first three messages. That's great! They just filtered themselves out. Now you're down to one who didn't. You've assessed for compatibility early and they are not compatible. What would be really frustrating is carrying on chatting and wasting more time before finding this out.

I am also pretty fed up with having to do the level of sitting required for online dating but I think you have to either just ask people out early on or accept that 90% of chats fizzle. Honestly I don't mind that because if they can't hold a conversation then I am not interested.

I've also had a bit more success by making my profile more clearly a bit geeky. So talking about loving in depth conversation about science and history or mentioning your love of radio 3 or 4 or wherever. It decreases the number of matches but seemed to somewhat increase the likelihood that they're clever enough to hold a conversation.

Two things: One is about OLD. The other is about friends and colleagues moaning about their partners. People are more likely to moan about things instead of celebrating. Perhaps it would be even worse if everyone said how great their partner was whilst you're struggling to find one?

OLD is now low-effort, the low success rate means no one puts any effort in any more.

I had a short relationship with someone I met online but he wasn't what he described in his profile, just a very good liar until about month four when the cracks started to show after I called him out on his bullshit.

I've come off OLD completely this month. I'm sick to death of one sided conversations (men on there don't seem to understand that they have to ask questions to maintain a conversation), men looking for mummies as they are incapable of functioning as an adult and if I see another 'Sunday roast and a walk' prompt I will scream.

The sex talk is an instant turn off for me and I unmatch immediately. They can get their rocks off elsewhere. The bar is low because some women allow it and some men exploit that.

Maintain your standards and hopefully it will pay off. I'm 41 and my age filter is set to 38-45 and every man I have spoken to is exactly the same, so I can't be encouraging I'm afraid.

In your 30s dating especially on dating sites gets worse and worse. Men seem to be able to scent women who are desperate for marriage and kids a mile off and they either play along or just play about. I’ve had one guy at a tube station after a date which wasn’t amazing almost try to force me into a relationship with him because I was 35 and time was running out and he was my best hope. I ran! but was very down on my tube journey home. Actually when I got to my tube station and was waiting for a bus a drunk younger not bad looking man kept trying to talk to me. I tried to avoid him but when I got on my bus I asked him why he was trying to talk to me. His answer was ”because you’re pretty!” But I was too down to suggest going for a drink with him.

I’d suggest you meet people out not online. Join clubs. I know it sounds a cliche but I think you’d have more luck that way.

I actually had a good time OLD but I wasn’t looking for a relationship at the time (mid to late 20s) so there was no pressure at all and I could be really picky! In the end I met a widow in real life. I think the really good eggs are either divorced or widowed once you get into your 30s!!

Just to add my now husband is absolutely amazing, so supportive, helps with everything, super ambitious and does lots of home improvement, and we are wonderfully happy. They do exist. Of course he’s been through the most horrendous tragedy you could imagine (losing his wife shortly after they had their first baby) so this may have made him more determined to live life to the full and enjoy it.

@Cuppatealover I didn't get together with my wife until we were both in our 40s, and while there are certainly biological considerations should you be hoping for children, you still have time, don'tlose hope. As someone above said, it is advantageous to be friends first (my wife and I had known each other a few years prior, having been members of a club). I also agree about the self filtering. If you aren't getting the level of engagement you desire, then they are essentially eliminating themselves from the competition.

I can't imagine anything worse than online dating. In theory, it should just be another channel to meet people and I would expect it to be used in conjunction with going to the pub, joining a club etc. It appears that, in reality, it is now the primary channel. I am not a big message user, and would want to move to actually meeting as quickly as possible. Can't beat face to face conversation.

I can't imagine ever being in the dating pool again, even now my wife is no longer here, but the stories I hear of online dating don't make it sound especially appealing.

Good luck.

Im 36 now and have been OLD on and off since I was about 32 - it just seems to get worse! I have been on lots of dates and I think earlier on I would continue dating that person as I was a little blind to their flaws - or more naive! Now I've done lots of thrapy, self-development the same narcisstic/ love bombing types - I can spot a mile away! So I think as you become more wise to their personalities, game playing etc you see these types of men everywhere! No helpful advice here - just I completley agree with everything you've said.

I just turned 36 and after 3 months of OLD I have come off the app for the same reasons you describe. I am above average in terms of attractiveness (not being arrogant but just saying for an illustration of how crazy it can be!), good job with a high salary, live in London, own place and am kind, caring and intelligent. The men on the other hand are incapable of asking basic questions. Can’t organise a date. Openly tell me they won’t date me because of my job. Lie about everything. Honestly, I have given up for the foreseeable but I feel so low about it. I am fed up of bearing the load of everything on my own. Even just someone to ask how my day has been or show a little care would be nice, and that is too much to ask.
I already have a lot more headspace just coming off the apps though, I am going to channel more energy into female friendships, learning new things, doing things I enjoy. Went to the cinema on my own yesterday. It’s sad it has come to this but then I do remind myself that people are often even more lonely in shit relationships and at least I don’t have a man draining my energy.
maybe the right one will come along. The problem is I don’t want to be so jaded by OLD I won’t be attracting it, so I just though it was best to try and ignore the whole thing rather than ‘trying’ and being disappointed over and over and over again.

This

You need to check out Burned Haystack. It's for women who want a long-term committed relationship. The founder is an academic rhetoritician (looks for hidden meaning in words) who uses her training to figure out the OLD profile and message patterns that signal problematic men. These are red flags and these men should be blocked (not just swiped past). This approach "burns the haystack" until you find your "needle".

I read the site for academic interest, and think the underlying principles apply in other relationships too. It also does seem to help women find their needles (including the BH founder just recently), and if they don't (yet), it also helps women stop wasting their time or exposing them too much to horrible men. Might be worth a try?

Are there any men out there who actually want a relationship and don't just think about getting their leg over 23 hours of the 24 in a day!

Not under the age of 65 (I mean this seriously).

Why are you even looking? They are literally all like this.

If I ever found myself single again I can’t think of one thing that would induce me to get into another relationship with a man. Unfortunately I’m not a lesbian, so I’d be single forever but I honestly can’t see why that would be an issue.

I’m 35, I have been single years. I have used dating apps in that time, but not in a long while. It just becomes demoralising having to interact with so many unpleasant men.

If I meet someone it will be randomly in person one day I guess, but I’m content being single anyway. I really can’t be bothered with dating or men in general tbh.

And not even then. In my foray into OLD in my mid 50’s, I was inundated with messages from men in their 70’s right up to 82

Wanting sex is fine, moodiness when you don't get it isn't.

I think some of those men are just as unhappy and sceptical about online dating as women - cos I know at least 2 young men, nice decent guys who do probably want sex ( they don't tell me that as I am old!) but who do want partners and families - they won't consider OLD but also are despondent about ever meeting someone via another route.

Great advice 😁

Wanting sex is normal but jumping straight into sexual messages to a woman they’ve never even met is grim imo.

It just comes across as casting their net wide and hoping soneone bites.

It is bad out there. If i knew now what i didnt know back then on that fateful night i met my exH, i wouldnt have settled down/had kids. As much as i love the kids, theyre both ND and difficult if im brutally honest.

Honestly i felt the same way and ended up with a woman best thing i ever did🤣 the way my relationship is now men could never reach the standard of love and relationship i get now! Try it honestly

Generally find that online everyone is deeply unpleasant and the behaviour from both sexes is poor on the apps, perhaps it may be biased but everyone (both sexes) I meet at singles events has had bad experiences with OLD.

Certain behaviours and traits develop with the apps. "Love a roast" and "54, not 44 but don't know how to change it!" seem to have developed with a lot of people, and the match, one message, ummatch is common etc.

It seems that the apps cause both sexes to hate each other, whereas in real life I find everyone to be generally pleasant and friendly. My advice would be to look more at real life instead of "go gay" or "burned haystack TM".

I think you may have a slightly wrong impression of OLD. Think of it as a shop. You are shopping round for quality and in that time you are rejecting. It’s like quality control with your own criteria

I get OLD can be bad, but you just have to screen. Some guys are easy to dismiss but others do hide it. It’s a numbers game.

I did OLD for about 5 years. I was good at screening and never lowered my bar. I had lots of dates, some short term relationships which would have fizzled out if we meet in real life. Also made some great friends and had fun.

I found DP 4 years ago. We never would have met in real life. Most of my friends have met great partners OLD.

you just need to accept it’s a shop that can he full of tat, but if you keep digging you will find some gems.