DH and Dad fallen out and I can't see any way forward

[PumpkinTwistyWindToots]

I’m really struggling with an ongoing fallout between my DH and my dad. It all started last Christmas, the first one after my mum died, and I hosted. It was such an emotional time, and there was a row caused by my dad. Everyone was grieving and on edge, and dad behaved badly .

In April my dad tried to make amends, but he never actually apologised - he just wanted to sweep it under the carpet. DH was rude to him when he tried, and since then they haven’t spoken. I can see both sides: DH wasn’t wrong to be angry, and my dad’s behaviour did trigger a lot of DH’s own family trauma. But DH’s refusal to let it go has made my life so much harder, even though I respect that he’s entitled to his boundaries.

My dad now directs his frustration at me because he won’t talk to DH directly, and I’m just drained. I’ve decided to spend Christmas with my brothers this year, which dad is invited to, (DH’s staying home), but dad said at the weekend that he wanted to stay home and I should 'forget about him'. DH doesn't mind me leaving him for Christmas by the way - he doesn't enjoy the season much and he can see his kids Christmas Eve and Boxing Day.

Has anyone else been stuck in a situation like this? How do you protect your peace without feeling like you’re betraying someone and your own integrity? Dad wants an apology which he won't get from DH and I feel like if I give him one I'm being disloyal or something. I am desolate at the idea that dad and DH will never be in the same room again together but I want to put it behind me, but dad can't let things go if he thinks he's been wronged. He won't accept that he did anything wrong at Christmas and just focused on DH refusing to let it go.

Don't become the go between , it's never a good position to be in .
Can they get in a room ( maybe a cafe or garden centre coffee shop so they don't shout ) and discuss it out ?
Maybe it will work out , maybe not but at least they tried .

I don't want to be a go between or be involved at all. But my dad won't let it go. We had an argument on Saturday on the phone because he had to bring it up. I don't think either of them would want to be in the same place ever again, and actually I really don't think that would help. I know my dad very well, he's stubborn, always believes he's right and holds grudges. It would almost certainly make things worse. I have to accept their relationship is over.

No idea why the OP copied in bold - I wrote it in my notes app first.

Honestly? I don’t know how old your dad is or how much longer you’ve got with him but I think your DH should apologise to just let it go.

Probably then , time is a healer so hopefully in time they will see it was all a bit pointless and will tolerate each other at family occasions .

That sounds really hard OP and it’s not fair on you being stuck in the middle.

While your DP is entitled to his boundaries, lots of us make concessions for the sake of our partners, even if we’re not in the wrong.

It sounds as if everyone was grieving when the first row blew up. How bad was your dad’s behaviour - can you give any more detail? Is it something that your DP could let go with grace, for your sake, if your dad would accept that your DP doesn’t owe him an apology?

Is there any way you could say to them both that it’s tearing you apart and ask them to put their differences aside for your sake? Or were the things that have been said and done just too terrible? Does your dad have a history of being vile?

I have been in your DP’s position where I was treated very, very badly by inlaws, and also watched them treat DP badly and hurt him very much. It’s a ridiculously long story but the upshot was that I just let it go - eventually. DP didn’t want to lose contact with them and they moved overseas so I decided to be gracious for his sake. They were utter dicks to me, but I believe that they’re decent people fundamentally who just went through a period of having their head up their own arse! So I do understand what it’s like but I think sometimes just seeing the bigger picture - your dad was grieving, Christmas is an emotional time etc - can help with a bit of perspective.

I would say though much depends on how bad their respective behaviours were, and if there’s a track record of them not getting on.

None of this is fair on you, and it’s shitty of the pair of them to leave you in the middle for what is presumably just a case of stubborn pride?

The two of them are very annoying and triangulating you. But you are allowing yourself.to be triangulated and based on info your dad sounds like the arsehole here.

My 2p

Spend christmas with your DH irrespective of your dad!!!

Simple starters for 10 is to tell your dad you cannot control your dh and he cannot take that frustration out of you it is just not acceptable.
If he does you say "i've asked you not to do that. I'm leaving/ hanging up now" and leave or end the call.
Say "i cant help with that. You'd need to talk to dh and apologise properly if you want to improve ypur relationship with him" a lot

Your dh... it is hard to say without more info - is he refusing to have your dad in the house? What did your dad do? Is dh jistified?

This is a very one dimensional view of it. OP doesn’t say what her dad did, but it must have been bad for the bad blood to exist a year later.

So, it’s possible that they are both right- or both wrong. I’d find a phrase that acknowledges that and just keep trotting it out.

I’d also remind them that I have feelings too- they aren’t the only one allowed to care how other people behave.

You aren’t obliged to sort this out, they aren’t obliged to tolerate each other.

Let go of the idea this is something you need to resolve and focus on managing things to please yourself. Say what you like, do what you like, stop pandering to these egocentric men and their moods.

So when either one of them raises is- a breezy ‘I know, he feels the same way, what you like the pair of you!’, and move along.

I don’t know what happened, so there may be a more appropriate response, but frankly ‘stop it, you’re like a pair of toddlers!’, leaps to mind.

I'm so sorry, OP. This sounds very difficult.

My dad behaved very badly towards my DH after my mum died. It was awful as DH had actually done so much to help. My dad didn't ever apologise.

There was around a week when DH insisted that he wouldn't ever see my dad again, and I felt awful being trapped in the middle. I knew my dad was in the wrong, but he was also grieving and vulnerable, so I felt really torn. Thankfully DH decided to let it go for my sake - he hasn't forgotten, and I don't think he ever will, but he chose to rise above it. I will always be grateful to him for that.

Well it sounds like your dad had just lost his wife so it was obviously going to be an emotional time for him and your DH should cut him some slack

I'd be asking them if their dislike/hatred for each other outweigh their love for you? That whatever is going on between them you want no part of.

I wasn't a massive fan of my ex in laws. But I tolerated them for my then wife and daughter.
Your husband needs to grow up

I was prepared to say your DH should give your dad a break given the circumstances at the time of the fall-out until I saw he didn't apologise ans tried to brush it off. I cannot stand people who won't apologise.

Your DH deserves an apology.

At that time. To still not apologise almost a year on? That's just shitty and entitled behavior.

What did your dad actually do? It’s really hard to say whether it’s something your DH should let go to keep the peace without knowing what it actually is and how bad it actually was. But this sounds really hard for you. Definitely refuse to be a go between and remind your Dad that DH is his own person and if he keeps bringing it up shut down the conversation by walking away/hanging up if he won’t listen.

So your dad won't apologise for what he did wrong, but is insisting your husband apologise to him instead. Yeah, he can get lost. Stand by your husband.

This sounds extremely similar.
i wish my DH could have let it go. He did intend to - but when we arrived at the place where we were meeting my dad was grumpy and had a 'tone' to him when he said hello - this pushed DH's buttons and he snapped and dad and decided to leave. This is what dad is so angry about because he did this in front of other family members and he feels embarrassed.
Neither of them behaved terribly - but badly enough to have upset and offended each other. Unfortunately with the way DH is, he is bad at revolving conflict and will avoid it instead. That's what he's decided to do with dad. He just wants to be left out of family events. I'm ok with that I guess and my siblings 'get it' too but dad is still furious.

Simple starters for 10 is to tell your dad you cannot control your dh and he cannot take that frustration out of you it is just not acceptable. If he does you say "i've asked you not to do that. I'm leaving/ hanging up now" and leave or end the call.

I need to learn how to do this. It's so hard when you've got 45 years of conditioning to placate your father and caretake his feelings :/ someone asked if he has a history of behaving badly - absolutely yes. Picking on my DH was very much in his playbook, which is partly why I'm so angry with him for his behaviour.

Thanks for the advice to spend Christmas with my DH - honestly I'd rather be with family for my DS's sake - he would be disappointed to spend it at home with just me and DH! I also love my siblings very much and will enjoy spending the time with them. This is honestly not an issue between DH and me. He will happily spend the day with the dog, a takeaway and a bottle of gin.

If your Dad brings it up just say that you do not wish to talk about it as it puts you in a difficult position. Just close the conversation down.

Let go of the idea this is something you need to resolve and focus on managing things to please yourself. Say what you like, do what you like, stop pandering to these egocentric men and their moods.

Yes to this. I can see the socialisation in action and I'm frustrated with myself

He does. And he won't get one. But I'm sympathetic to posters saying DH should be the bigger man/let it go for my sake. But I think it's too late for that. Dad sees himself as so wronged he would expect a fulsome apology from DH which also won't happen.

Your dad has a bloody cheek.

Why do you all kowtow to him? Why don't you think your husband is worthy of a proper apology? I'm not talking grovelling, but an acknowledgement by your dad that he was in a bad place at the time, but was rude and out of line and is sorry? Why is that too difficult for him and why are you so keen to let him off the hook and place the ones on your husband?

If this were a man, posters would be saying it's bad news when a spouse doesn't stand up for the other against a parent (usually the MIL).

Then he needs setting straight.

So, you could do what your dad has done. Calmly and quietly but determinedly push back. Use his words, as it helps.

A technique I find useful with people who are uninterested in other people’s feelings is to get in first. Start the conversation with how fed up you are. Stop doing the sociably acceptable thing of protecting him from your feelings. It’s not your job.

OP

"I know my dad very well, he's stubborn, always believes he's right and holds grudges"

So more of the same from your dad then. He's always been like this and he has not changed since your childhood. And this time his wrath was directed at your H (and in turn you as well BTW). Do not use your H here as some form of buffer between you and your father.

People from dysfunctional families end up playing roles and are you now acting out the roles that perhaps your late mother played too i.e trying to pacify and otherwise cajole a miserable and now old man out of his misery.

Why are you spending Christmas at your brother's home rather than with your H?. Do not do this and do not further reward your dad's behaviour by being in his company. Where does your primary loyalty lie; with your family of origin still or with your H?. Are you not really wanting to rock the boat here?.