SEPTEMBER 2025 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Just dipping my toe in here. I had a lot of support a few years ago. Thank you. After years of emotional stuff I have sadly gone nc with my parents (the final straw was going to them over Christmas and constant dirty looks of hatred from my mother). A few weeks passed and I pulled away. Dh father died and my parents came to mass and in the church my mum fxcked and was a disgrace how she treated me. Then at the burial called my dh over to ask could she see the grandkids. All while ignoring me.

Two years have passed a a friend of my father's called into my work to tell me my dad had alzheimers. Its transpired mum told my siblings not to let me know. After that a cousin of my father's also contacted me. He has a very rapid form and confused and in care (relatively young)

My siblings are hurt by mum too. But tolerate her. She's now mostly housebound (she's in her late 60s) and worse than ever. I'm so torn .I am going into see my dad. I'm afraid and live in a close community (happily married) my name is blackened now as people must feel I am so mean and bad. My mum covers up her nastiness. If you come to our house she's brandy, baileys up for a laugh. Then gives me a look and says what a state I look. I've made a good life for myself. It's such a mess

Im having such a hard time im besides myself. I decided to attend my nieces birthday party (child) and booked flight and hotel when I was told the date. Her birthday came and they actually had a party then and not the weekend after. I felt a bit weird about not being told but at least it meant I wouldn't have to see my NC parents.

So here I am. I arrived today. Brother and niece picked me up from the airport. We pick up dinner on the way home and eat. Then the door goes. My heart sunk.

My brother says 'you do know that this are the parents, right. They want to see you. Don't spoil it for niece' .

I started having a panic attack. I said im not feeling well. Nobody cares. Parents walk in. Narc mother plays very friendly and approaches to say hi. I say I don't want this. Im not feeling well. I say I wasn't prepared for yhis. Bitch says you don't have to prepare to say hi to your parents. One must be able to talk through things. I sit there in my panic attack. She pushes over an envelope with money. I say im not taking anything from you anymore. She gives me a nasty look and they walk out huffing and puffing. Im still in my panic attack.

Idiot brother pimped me out to my parents. He texted them that we had arrived. So these weirdos decided all could be solved by blindsiding me.

He asked if I could at least tell HIM what the issue is. I say I might one day. I was stupid.

Im not even angry anymore. Im so sad for my child self. Ignored, walked over, excluded, blindsided. I stood up for her today. She will get to live her life at last.

For the first time the thought of getting rid of them all crossed my mind. But then I stared at my darling niece and its just not an option.

I won't be getting any sleep today. Im just repulsed by them. Disgusted.

I saw it coming but then I didn't. When my brother said he will pick me up I made it clear that I won't visit my parents. Normally they'd pick me up (last time two years ago) and we'd go for dinner at my parents. I thought hopefully he'd not ignore my boundaries and wouldnt just drive us there. But I thought it would be kidnapping and he probably wouldn't do this.
But they pulled this other shit like a bunch of lunatics conspiring together.

I can't believe they pin this on me. That im spoiling things for my niece. That im the one who can't be reasoned with.

They uninvited me from the birthday party and didnt even tell me and then fucked me over. But im the issue.

I had to go searching for this thread, thank you @AttilaTheMeerkat for mentioning it yesterday on the other 'immature parents' thread.

I've bought the book about immature parents and will work my way through it when I can. 💐

@Twatalert Sorry to hear that your trip has been hijacked. I know this is exactly what you feared and tried to avoid. This is exactly the sort of thing my family tried to do when I went NC with GB1- asking me to go to events for the benefit of totally innocent family members then engineering a situation where I have to 'make a scene' or put up with GB1 being around. Mine never really gave up on the idea of persuading me to 'get over that silliness' but did eventually grudgingly accept that I simply wouldn't be anywhere near him. In my case, it worked in my favour that DM didn't want other people to realise we were NC so she'd rather pretend I was busy than have to explain why I walked out as soon as GB1 appeared.
You mentioned that your DB asked if you would tell him why. Do you think there's any chance he'd actually listen if you did? I don't mean that as 'can't you just talk it through' (which we've all heard too many times) but rather whether there's a chance that as an adult with a daughter of his own he and his partner might possibly be ready to listen to your side of things.

@Spendysis I think we all appreciate that unpleasant family members will often accuse other people of the very things they are guilty of. My GB2 is currently trying to claim that anything I do to help our elderly DM is in order to get my hands on 'valuables' (= old and slightly broken gadgets/kitchenware) that she tries to give to me and that I plan to 'shove her in a home' once I've got it all. I'm not sure whether to be more annoyed at the accusation of dishonesty/greed or the implication that if I was money motivated I would be so inept that I spend £20+ per visit in petrol, plus bus fares/taxis for my DC when I'm not around to give them lifts, plus bits of shopping etc and waste a full day each time getting her ready, going to appointments, doing her washing/cleaning etc just to get my hands on some stuff that I could have bought on e-bay for less than £5. And of course, that I would then encourage her to sell her house (that I know I'll get a share of in her will if she still has it) and spend all the proceeds on a care home.

@awkwardcow im glad you get it and sorry you went through this as well. My brother has been flying monkeying in the past and can't be trusted. He's part of it all and I don't believe for one second he'd be prepared to question the narrative. His comment yesterday about me not spoiling the reconciliation for my niece was highly manipulative.

I think my mother drove past my hotel this morning. Not in a million years did I think they would stalk me but here we are. The woman looked the same from a distance, did the usual headshaking and huffing and puffing. Its highly unusual for her to run errands on a Saturday morning and nothing is on the way to my hotel. Im worried they will turn up again. Im going to remind myself how to call police in this country in case they come and make a scene.

I felt completely violated yesterday and can't believe they all pushed me in a corner like this. Mother, brother and SiL all said one must be able to talk through anything like in some weird cult.

Hi everyone, I used this board for a few years with a different user name. I had to delete that account last year due to an abusive ex from years ago contacting me on sm and threatening me. I had to go to the police and so on and deleted anything that could be linked to me.

You may remember me though. I’m the one where the siblings have pushed me out of the family. Basically block me from seeing my parents, well feels like it. So I’m NC or LC with everyone. I speak to one parent weekly the other rarely (it used to be parent and step parent who I saw but now divorced). I also have agoraphobia and ptsd and so on and until I had therapy due to all of the above I didn’t realise I was emotionally neglected. I’m sure some of you will remember. I live a few hundred miles from any family (apart from DP, DC and pets) as I moved away over a couple of decades ago. I also have lots of siblings and half siblings.

i am finally used to the fact I’m estranged and rebuilding myself. Christmas was very hard as always but I’m used to that and we don’t really celebrate to make it easier. My DC also lost a very close friend just before so we’ve had a tough six months.

But I’ve had a terrible few days. I had made plans to see my mum later in the year for a special birthday, my DP suggested I check dates with NC siblings. I did that last spring even though I didn’t see why I should be asking for permission and was not sure it was a good idea, but yes the adult thing so I did it. Anyway at the time no problems none of them were interested in what I’m doing with mum etc and will see her different dates. so we booked our summer holiday to cover those dates to see her.

Then we get to now and the texts start. One sibling got one of the others to do the texting. To cut a long story short they are all going away on those dates taking my mum with them, she doesn’t know it’s a surprise. So one sibling and partner organised it all, the other sibling let me know. So I’ve been in bits.

If you are away are you able to book a different hotel further afield and not have to worry about seeing any of them? Or fly home early?

Sending love to you and your DP. You will see from my post above that I had to disappear for ages. I had thought of you both and had hoped that things would improve x you were always very supportive to me…my old username being tbr….. you may remember.

Thank you. Im trying normality for my niece. You will all think I'm crazy but I spent the day with them and will be doing the same tomorrow. Not seen my parents since friday/the hotel stalking incident. I feel I'm completely crazy. Will be interesting to see my therapists face next week lol.

@Twatalerti am so sorry your trip didn’t go as planned i know it took you courage to go there and you did it for the love of your niece. She is really lucky to have you on her side supporting her my vile dsis not content with being gifted tens of thousands from dm over the years doing an equity release on dm property and having her change her will so she is the sole benefactor even stole the trust fund dm set up for ds when he was a baby it wasn’t much in the grand scheme of things about £1k dm was despite being well off was very frugal when dsis registered poa she took that as well

Try to enjoy your niece. It’s that generation and us having time with them that misses out.

I’m stopped from seeing all of my nieces and nephews but I hope one day they will understand. Before my other posts tonight I thought I was at a good turning point as one sent me a lovely little gift from their pocket money at Christmas and one of the older ones has invited me to their wedding.

@OneNewEagle they never stop. I didn't think my parents and brother would do what they did. I have to wonder what's next. I did remind my friend yesterday to not engage with my mother in case she makes contact.

Im sorry they fucked you over like that and they don't even think it's weird. Its like these people will never stop.

It is lovely though that one niece/nephew sent you something for Christmas. I do wonder what prompted it.

Im gonna be on edge all day. I was worried open the hotel curtains today, wondering whether my mother would be outside. Its totally sick.

Not completely selflessly I do worry they will put my niece under enough pressure for her to cave completely. It would devastate me for myself and for her. She's not the same with me now. Its too dangerous for her. She will feel she needs to side with her parents to keep safe.

I would continue to send things like birthday cards and use the phone. Be her consistent and safe person.

Her parents and your mother have to keep up their dysfunctional narrative because if they do not the whole thing collapses in on them. It is in their interests to make you the problem.

Your niece is currently under her parents' control and wider influence. Hopefully when she is of age and away from them (living away from home at university for instance) she will further realise what her parents are really like.

Dysfunctional families never ever play by the "normal" rules of familial engagement and the rule book truly goes out the window when it comes to such dysfunctional families. People in such families end up playing roles.

This is my plan. Years of therapy are showing and im SO excited to be able to be a safe person.

Even though I had a panic attack I feel more stable and grounded than ever. There is no way I will bend again. If they show up I know I can just be calm and repeat the same statement. They will be the lunatics because they won't know what to do.

I know that I don't have to talk about anything if I don't want to. I could choose not to address something even with a reasonable person. Wild that i didn't know this before therapy.

@Twatalert I’m SO sorry this has happened to you and ruined your time with your niece. The lack of respect!!!!!! Why don’t people just leave things alone and believe victims, rather than trying to become a ‘hero’ who sorts everything and everyone lives ‘happily ever after.’ Dysfunctional toxic families are real. I’m very glad you’re seeing your therapist next week. Take care xxxx

@OneNewEagle thank you. ❤️ I’m so sorry to hear about the abusive ex appearing in your life and all that that entailed. That’s absolutely horrible of your siblings. So vile and nasty. Sending huge hugs to you. Xxxx

Twat brother excelling himself on the will front.

The texts to Mr Monkey about recently deceased brother’s will and seeing a copy stopped as MM ignored them.

We, obviously, didn’t think the problem had gone away.

I persuaded MM to chat to his solicitor during the week to understand the nature of a possible challenge to my late BIL’s will which names MM as sole beneficiary and executor.

I always think understand everything that a worse case scenario could bring. All part of being a realistic optimist. It’s very clear that the grounds for challenge aren’t there - twat brother wasn’t financially dependent (I bet he wished he had been!), BIL wasn’t coerced and BIL was in sound mind.

Solicitor has been contacted numerous times by phone - solicitor has been ‘unavailable’ obviously - last week and then the solicitor was emailed by TB using legalese language about a challenge and he demanded to see a copy of the will to which only MM can give permission for him to see.

Solicitor said “your late brother’s will is unambiguous. TB is written out of it. That’s in black and white. I advise releasing the will so you are being ‘reasonable’. It’d be interesting to see if he does come back with anything.”

Solicitor laughed about TB’s email being wrong on every count.

I remarked to MM that if he was on firm ground about a challenge he would have rolled out the big guns of a fancy solicitor as he loves status and he likes intimidating/bullying people, especially MM. I observed that TB can’t afford a fancy solicitor these days to write a £650 letter (like he did in the toxic divorce with his ex-wife, my lovely SIL)

I reckon he’s been feeding his entitled lamentations through ChatGPT with the prompt ‘make this sound like a posh lawyer has written it.’ This is entirely probable as he’s such a fucking dick.

His days of being able to afford the flash things in life are over. He drives an ordinary car (no longer is there a collection of BMWs, Porsches etc in his drive), he doesn’t have a Fucking drive as - with a bit of detective work - I’ve discovered he’s living in a rented flat and he dissolved his business (thank you, companies house) with £11k to his name.

MM was ‘but he used to have a business worth 10 million. That’s what he was always telling us.’

People believed TB’s bullshit.

I pointed out that you don’t lose 10 million overnight. You can’t even spend 10 million very easily. His kids didn’t go to private school, the family home was nice, but nothing extraordinary, he didn’t take flash holidays, he didn’t do much ‘luxe’, apart from his flash cars, buying my SIL designer handbags on the numerous occasions she’d caught him cheating. He tried to take the family home from over his kids’ heads because he needed the money from a house sale, not ‘just’ spite aimed at my SIL.

I think TB has been spinning yarns about his high rolling life style. Doubtless at one point he had money, but not millions. It’s very obvious that the interest in late BIL’s financial affairs is to plug the gap. Not just the financial gap, but the gap in the reality between being a fucking fat grubby no mark and being George Clooney.

He’s such a fucking dickhead.

@Twatalert I agree with pp about remaining the 'safe person' for your niece. I wonder if perhaps you could arrange things so that in future you meet on neutral space eg. taking niece out for the day/away for the weekend so there's less chance for the others to hijack the arrangements.

I would caution that you should think carefully about how far you are willing to compromise your own wellbeing and boundaries to maintain the relationship with your niece. They are already using it to manipulate you and unfortunately as you have identified they will push the 'twatalert is the unreasonable one' narritive. In my case, I actually did lots for GB1's children and helped his wife (who I think was his biggest victim) when he was at his worst- including looking after them for school holidays/taking them on holiday/arranging their school uniform/taking them and SIL out etc (he believed that I had been 'guilt tripped' in to helping him by removing the stress of having children around, actually SIL and I arranged it to protect the children). Unfortunately as they got older they believed their Dad's side of the story and stopped wanting to visit (strange how he ramped up the lies when they were old enough to be self sufficient but was happy to let them stay with me when they were younger). They are now almost 30 and barely speak to me, which hurts. Last time I saw them all SIL was perfectly pleasant but the children would speak to me if I spoke first and then gave one word answers. Hopefully things will be better for you (I know my situation is complicated by the fact that GB1 died) but I wish I'd been a bit more mentally prepared for them ignoring their own experiences with me and choosing to believe that if only I'd not been so mean to GB1 everything would have turned out fine. I would still have been their safe space when they needed it but might perhaps have been less shocked by their current reaction to me. I'm hoping that perhaps if/when they have children of their own they might see why I took the stance I did when I had mine.

@MonkeyfromManchester Your TB really is an arsehole isn't he! He sounds like just the sort of person who will be trying (and probably succeeding in the short term) to convince new friends/women etc that he is some sort of big shot. I bet your solicitor thinks he's an absolute arse sending that letter. I think people like your TB and my GB1/GB2 end up almost believing their own tales and forget that there are people out there who actually know more than them and see through them. It's shit that you have to do anything he asks but hopefully following your solicitor's advice will work. Although it sounds like he's the sort of arse that would try to make a claim even though he clearly has no grounds, just to annoy you and in the misguided hope that the normal rules don't apply to him. You have my sympathy. Hopefully it will all be over soon and you will have even less reason to acknowledge his existence.

@awkwardcow my therapist suggested the same. Its difficult getting anywhere without a car and I don't have the confidence to drive/rent one. I know now that my parents sabotaged that for me when I learnt to drive. I drove on egg shells so to speak! Its on my list to 'get over it' one day too.

I imagine its really hard losing that bond to nieces and nephews. Im thinking about the 'what if' a lot. Its my first visit in two years. I have said no to her asking me to come for Christmas. I really can't do it. Im a virtual/phone auntie. Sometimes I think this won't be enough to sustain a close-ish bond. I decided I will make the most of what I have and yes, I will be v v sad if she gets too deep into the fog one day.

Well done for what you did! Its not the relationship you hoped for but you probably still have influenced them in a positive way!