SEPTEMBER 2025 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

@Genuineweddingonedsis blocked both my now young adult dc shortly after she blocked me as she can no longer manipulate them and they know what she is upto. They don’t want any contact with her either. The whole situation is sad as it’s about money we got in the way of her controlling and spending dm money so she’s blocked us all and made it incredibly difficult for us to see dm and obviously fed everyone a pack of lies they believe but despite that special occasions remind me of how things were before and that things will never go back to how they were

thanks everyone for the kind words ds is going to book his holiday at the weekend with his friends and as part of his birthday present we are contributing / paying so he is happy and enjoyed his birthday so I was feeling bad for nothing and both dc despite being adults who work full time still do well out of us as we help them out and treat them to things

I’m sorry for all the awful stories here. I’ve been NC with my mother for just over a year, after about 15 years of LC, she started escalating things last year when I was going through a bereavement and I really just couldn’t cope with her any more. Recently a couple of family members confronted me, saying she hasn’t really done anything wrong and I should stop being’bad’ and I should be in touch with her. Basically the whole narrative of my life which is took me many years and loads of therapy to move away from. Everyone in real life who knows the situation thinks she has behaved outrageously and that I’ve done the right thing. But these accusations have really got to me and I feel sick to my stomach about the guilt and the fact that I ‘should’ be speaking to my mother and in contact with her.

@Spendysis you have obviously brought your children up well. They have empathy and decency. A real credit to you.

@Newsunflower believe in yourself. Your truth is your truth. The people that matter to you believe you and know the truth. There’s no ‘should’ about dealing with toxic family members. Far more people should walk in our shoes.

update from Monkey Towers.

ALL the arrangements have been made now for Mr Monkey’s brother’s funeral after the brother died very suddenly on Sunday. Paperwork is sorted - I hate admin, but I needed to do it for MM - death certificate issued and things are in motion. MM has arranged a secular funeral with the people who were in touch with brother-in-law and cared about him top of the bill IYSWIM.

Toxic Brother / Golden Boy has been informed.

Obviously, he’s not helped in ANY way this week or checked in with Mr Monkey. GB has just been told about the funeral arrangements and wants a call about it this weekend. MM was cool as with ‘just ring me and if I pick up, I pick up.’

Fuck off, mate, the arrangements have been made. We’ve been there for BIL through thick and thin. Have you? NO.

Sister-in-law is giving a speech thanking BIL for all his help over the years - how he was like a dad to her kids (GB had fucked off when she’d divorced him after years of his infidelity and abuse of every kind) and BIL paid her legal bills when the toxic twat was trying to take the family home e.g., the roof over GB’s sons.

It’s a very subtle but pointed speech and anyone who hears it will know EXACTLY what she’s referring to. So proud of her.

GB is in for a shock when he realises his conniving to get back into his brother’s will via his eight year old daughter making her uncle friendship bracelets (RIDICULOUS and clearly she was ‘persuaded’ to do it) has come to fuck all as GB is getting fuck all.

I’m going to be busy in the next couple of months organising a renovation of BIL’s house to put it on the market.

I want to do this, but it’s going to make me incredibly sad to think about the life Mr Monkey’s kind brother could have had if his life hadn’t been brutalised by MM’s twisted mother.

Such a mess.

@Newsunflower I suppose you have recognised these people as flying monkeys? They are not independently thinking people. Can you remove them from your life? With distance your truth will be THE truth again.

@Newsunflower believe in yourself. Trust your boundaries, and that your expectations of others are reasonable.

I couldn't agree with this more! It's taken me a while to realise that I don't have to answer someone's question or comment/compliment with a negative one. I'd just grown up with that as my baseline for communication because of my mother.

Also, my lack of decision making, I'd always say 'I don't mind' because growing up, having a definitive opinion was risky if it didn't match hers. Sitting on the fence was a way of playing it safe. But I realise that really it just made me a bit of a pain in the arse among friends. They actively wanted my opinion.

It's funny you should say that, but I was absolutely the same when it came to saying what I wanted and making decisions. I simply couldn't do it. I would always defer to what other people wanted or wait for them to say. Drove my husband up the wall. It took a lot of work to undo it, partly because I had to overcome the fear of giving the 'wrong' answer, partly because I didn't know what I liked half the time because I had a. very limited experiences and b. had never been allowed to find out. I also had opted out of saying what I wanted because I had been let down and disappointed so many times.

With my mother I was expected to always support her choices, and to do this by making sure my wants aligned with hers at all times.

With my father it was more complicated, but basically whatever choice you made, he would criticise it. You've got no taste/your dress sense is awful/you're stupid/you're embarrassing yourself/no normal person would like that/you're boring

If you went along with what he said was the 'right' choice, he would very often twist that and throw it in your face. He would say he was only joking when he said that thing was the right choice, he couldn't believe you'd taken it seriously, or say that he'd been testing you and you'd just proved how stupid you were, or he would deny having ever said it was the right choice and accuse you of embarrassing him on purpose.

Sometimes I wonder why I'm such a poorly functioning adult who can't stand their parents and then I remember.

Newsunflower

re your comment

"Recently a couple of family members confronted me, saying she hasn’t really done anything wrong and I should stop being’bad’ and I should be in touch with her".

Please block them from being able to contact you now if you have not already done so.

Indeed these are the flying monkeys no doubt sent in by your mother to do her dirty work for her. They tend to be easily manipulated relatives and have their own agenda. They do not have your interests at heart and are not interested in hearing your side of things either so their opinion should be ignored. Enlisting flying monkeys is all part of your mother's hoovering attempt to get you back into her dysfunctional fold; it is a commonly used tactic of narcissistic people.

Hi Monkey

You are in my thoughts re Mr Monkey's brother's upcoming funeral.

💐

Spendysis

Sadly money is indeed the root of all evil.

Dumb and Dumber (the two sons of the nice aunt) barred us Meerkats and her sister (unsuccessfully I might add) from buying their mother foodstuffs from the likes of M & S saying they would do it. Well they made such a hash of it that we stepped in instead.

When her carers ever arrived (for their 15 minute visit and or when they decided to show up) they were nowhere to be seen and when she was in the nursing home their 20something manchild shouted at her, a woman now in her mid 90s, about eating crisps of all things. Over time she stopped eating entirely and died. I miss her so very much but my conscience is clear.

If I saw his car in the nursing home car park I would visit her anyway. It was and remains all about money to them as well and now they have it. It will not make them happy because they are unhappy people.

@AttilaTheMeerkat thank you. Mr Monkey is doing an amazing job as Executor.

Strangely enough, Golden Boy didn’t take the call giving him the news of Slave Son’s death. Something to do with him having two SIM cards. Right-o. He only got in touch when his learning disabled son called him. I wonder why he has two SIM cards, he’s probably cheating on wife number 2.

Even ‘odder’ was his call on Saturday where he gave his excuses about the funeral because of a ‘hernia operation’ the day before. It’s not like you can’t rearrange those things…clearly, he doesn’t want to face ex-wife, his sons (one of whom refuses to speak to him at all) and family and friends giving him a polite cold shoulder. He doesn’t cope well with humiliation.

Even, even ‘odder’ 🤣 was in the 30 minute call him asking FOUR times about the will. Of course he did. He was shocked to learn that Mr Monkey is both Executor and Beneficiary to a lot of money and property.

No doubt, GB will challenge it. Apparently, he’s phoning Slave Son’s solicitors this morning. Revealing his hand. I don’t think the dick knows that you can get a will online, but you need to pay £14 for it. Probably, he can’t afford it. We need to lodge probate today. The twat won’t be getting a penny if we can help it.

He did nothing to help his mother - in fact, he told people she was dead, when she was very much alive - deserted his kids, and didn’t contact Slave Son until he realised he needed money.

And, of course, there were the abusive C-word messages to both Slave Son and Mr Monkey last February. He knew then that he was cut out of wills. The messages have been kept.

He’s disgusting.

Im so emotional and proud of myself. Today my niece asked why I'm no longer speaking to my parents/her grandparents. She's 11 so I said it is because I don't like how people there treat one another and that I don't like that one has to watch their every move and sentence. That i don't want that. She said she understood. Later on I got the most wonderful declaration of how much she appreciates what I do for her. That she can always turn to me and that she's really happy about it. I told her she's a really important person to me and the best niece in the world.

Its exactly what I wanted. I just felt it was right and appropriate being honest with her. Taking her seriously and not brushing her off. Im hoping so much that our relationship is strong enough to survive my narcissistic mother and any stunts she might pull.

Im Just so proud of my journey. I came back completely devastated from my last visit three years ago after the final straw. I didnt know how i could continue life on my own. I didn't know what was ahead of me or how I would get through this. I knew I didn't want to be treated like that anymore and I couldn't stand by and watch my niece being treated like that too. I couldn't be complicit. And today I just feel I went the best path for myself whilst still nurturing the relationship with my niece just being a safe person.

@Twatalert that’s fantastic. I’m strongly of the opinion that good things happen to good people (eventually!) how fantastic that your niece has you in your life and it WILL counterbalance the hate. Children are very perceptive. They see bullying at school and recognise it. I also think children have a very strong sense of justice. Your niece has you on side. And vice versa. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

@Twatalertthats great. Your niece is very lucky to have a good relationship with you and will hopefully learn to set her own boundaries in life

Thank you! I feel as though im doing a little bit of cycle breaking. Perhaps she felt a bit validated too. That she isn't the problem there, I'm around for her and will never take their side.

Damage has been done, but I will try and send her into life with whatever healthy seeds I can.

@Twatalert yep someone has to be the cycle breaker and while it can be a lonely role it has to start somewhere. As the saying goes and I am sure it was on here I read it first - It ran in the family till it ran into me. That is my mantra now.

I removed a cousins adult kids from my social media the other night. I removed the cousin last year when I realised she was sitting with my mother listening to the woman slander me. My mother has often pitted me against this cousin because SHE holds her in high esteem but honestly I think she is as bad as my mother anyway. The last straw for me came when my stepdad died and none of them sent condolences to me and my son - my son being known as stepdads favourite grandchild. He was 15 when my stepdad died so had his own phone etc and not one of them even contacted him separately so I just thought why on earth do I let her sons and daughters in law see anything I post as shes my mothers main flying monkey, well there are two of them but the other one is a complete knob anyway. It is only a small thing really but an internal victory for me knowing that I genuinely will never miss these people.

You know what amuses me and this is about myself personally but I am so picky about friends. I dont just let anybody into my life as a friend they have to be proven as trustworthy etc and I have cut many people out of my life over the years from friends to acquaintances without a backward glance if I thought they were not good for my mental health but with 'family' I have let them walk all over me all in the name of blood. It really is silly when you think of it. Blood doesnt tie me to them. It means little to them so why the hell have I tried to make it something to me? I am single and have been a long time but I sat and thought if I met someone and it was really serious would I be happy introducing him to these people? And the stark reality is no I would be embarassed by their behaviour and treatment of me and it is only me that has the power to stop their behaviour towards me. Mel Robbins is right, Let them but Let me also. Let me walk the fuck away from the abuse with my head held high because my abusers are stuck in their own heads and wont get further but I still have years ahead of me to become and even better version of myself. That is the real win.

@Twatalert & @Genuineweddingone it is so hard to break the cycle, but you’ve both done this. @Twatalert your niece may not know the meaning of break the cycle, but it’s clear that she knows something is off and doesn’t want that shit continuing. She sounds like a very emotionally intelligent girl and she will grow more so with your support. @Genuineweddingone your mantra is fantastic.

Mr Monkey has broken the cycle, it’s taken years, support from my family and friends and therapy.

Twat son texted about the will again today, the fifth time he’s asked. MM has ignored it and everything is going via our solicitor.

We’ve arranged a very cool celebrant for MM’s brother’s funeral. I told him about the family situation privately and Cool Celebrant sent me this.

imagine yourself sitting beside a stream on a warm, sunny day. Close your eyes and listen to the sound the water makes as it rushes along. Listen to the bird song. Can you identify the species in this scenic woodland setting? There are insects too. Maybe you can hear the zizz of dragonflies as they hover by, perhaps the splash of a fish or the deep throaty sound of a frog. Now if you sway forward every so gently, you can allow your fingers to play with the rippling water. Relax. Now, very slowly, open your eyes. Look into the water. Can you see the startled look on the face of the person who pissed you off the most as your hands hold them firmly under the water, and the bubbles of their last breath rise to the surface to pop satisfyingly in the afternoon warmth?

I haven’t seen my mum in 9 months now.

There have been the occasional back and forth texts, me reaching out and getting nastiness back. She’s been telling all sorts of lies about me, playing the victim and bad mouthing me to anyone who will listen.

She left 3 bin bags full of presents outside the front door on Christmas Day.

I came home today from picking my children up from school and found a boxed chocolate gateau just placed on the door step. I know it’s from her.

The mind games are exhausting ☹️

Hi everyone. I think this may be a place where I can voice some of my thoughts with people who understand. I'm currently feeling I can't escape being dragged back in to prioritising family who I had distanced myself from without any big dramatic falling out. Also wondering how people deal with not being the self sacrificing dutiful daughter when an elderly parent needs help and as far as the outside world can see the parent was perfect.
To summarise my story, my parents always did a lot for me and my brothers and I can't really point at anything they did in our childhood and say they were abusive or neglectful specifically. But both of my brothers were allowed to behave as they liked, including being violent and manipulative. As the sensible/kind one in private they would tell me that they were upset by the behaviour too and the expectation was that I needed to avoid provoking outbursts and do more around the house etc to prevent our parents having to put up with even more. As they got older and things became more heated their behaviour was increasingly denied and/or excused. They were very careful to make sure that to the outside world we appeared to be a lovely close family. If they behaved badly outside the home the narrative was always that it was someone else's fault and/or they were being victimised. The shitty behaviour continued in to adulthood and extended beyond the family. I could write a book about all the shitty things Goldenballs1 did in his private life (but people would probably say it was too far fetched and no one would get away with being like that) but parents continued to excuse him, cover up for him, bail him out etc. Goldenballs2 was not as bad but also acted very badly and was constantly shielded from any consequences etc. I was always expected to keep up the pretence that they were lovely and to join in supporting/defending/shielding them even if they were threatening me and if helping them was detrimental to my wellbeing. My mother sacrificed herself for her own extended family and I think to some extent she thought that was just the right thing to do. If I ever tried to prioritise myself I would be told 'It's not all about you' (including on my wedding day!) and if I ever hinted publicly that things may not be perfect I was called disloyal. If I put myself last I was heavily praised.
When I had my children I decided that I must not allow them to experience all of this so I tried to quietly break contact with Goldenballs1. Parents pushed against me being 'too busy' etc and tried to force me to have him living with me for a while so I eventually I was forced to tell them all that I did not want any contact with GB1. Everyone was told that I was selfish, nasty, ungrateful etc and DH was blamed. Extended family attempted to make me see sense, parents and GB1 and 2 pleaded/shouted/threatened etc. Parents and GB2 denied that anything I said had really happened and I didn't explain to extended family (partly to avoid more upset to parents and partly as I doubted they would believe it). Over time parents grudgingly accepted my decision, GB1 behaviour became even worse and then he died young. GB2 was still an arse, but I was able to keep my distance.
Now Dad has passed away, Mum is elderly and needs care and GB2 finds himself for the first time ever without them to fix everything for him. Mum and GB2 clearly had an expectation that I would step in to the role of GB2's support human and are angry that I won't. History has been fully re-written so the 'public' version of events is expected to be agreed as true. I have apparently always had it easy and somehow owe it to them both to do more, but GB2 is an expert in everything so should dictate what I do and how. Mum does not want to live on her own but will not even consider any sort of shared living for the elderly arrangement (GB2 was VERY aggressive when I suggested even considering it). I know they are both (probably subconsciously in Mum's case) expecting that with enough pressure I will be forced to move her in with me. I agreed to do quite a lot to help her in Dad's last few months and immediately after his death so the expectation is that this will continue but I should be doing far more. GB2 is frequently verbally abusive and trying to bully me not only in to doing more for Mum but also in to helping him. It's almost darkly comical - he will shout at me, threaten me and call me and my family all sorts of names then finish with 'And why don't you ever even bother to visit me!'. Mum is experiencing cognitive decline and is still grieving so I feel the time to try to sort out old family problems etc has well and truly passed. I would not want to give up my life to become a full time carer even if our relationship was perfect. But I feel now that there is a pressure from the extended family etc to 'pay back' a fictional lifetime of care and support and play happy families with GB2, whereas privately I feel they are lucky I am willing to do anything at all. DH is aware of the situation and supports me fully but I know from past experience that if I mention sibling disagreements etc to friends they will (understandably) not really get it and will suggest talking to GB2 to try to help each other through this difficult time and work together.[hollow laugh]

I'm new to this thread and just reading over previous posts. This one stopped me in my tracks because it's exactly how I feel at Xmas every year. I can't remember a particular incident or pinpoint a reason but as soon as the Xmas decorations and Xmas music starts to appear in shops I feel a sort of sense of dread. I always decorate at home and did Xmas activities with the DC when they were small but always felt I was having to battle against an unspecified unsettling feeling to try to look like I was enjoying it. Some Xmas mornings I just want to hide- despite the fact that I have a lovely DH, lovely DC, we are always joined by my lovely MIL and everyone gets on and helps out. I've never been able to explain why I feel this way at Xmas but not other times of the year. For me I think part of it might be that there's such a focus on sharing this time with family and everyone having a great time whereas my experience growing up was that Goldenballs brothers would be particularly nasty and there was no escape for days as friends etc were all with their normal families.

@awkwardcow It sounds like you’ve carried an enormous amount of responsibility in your family for a long time, often without acknowledgement, and now the pressure is intensifying.

I don't think your boundaries are wrong. You can care about your mum’s wellbeing without becoming her full‑time carer or taking on GB2’s needs.

People outside the situation will naturally see the “public” version of your family, but that doesn’t obligate you to take on more than you can reasonably manage. You’re already doing more than many would in the same circumstances, and it’s okay to decide what level of involvement is sustainable for you and your own household.

@awkwardcow I would like to encourage that you don’t need to put up with being spoken to (shouted at) in that way by your brother, no matter how much you might have been raised to put up with it. It wouldn’t be ok for anyone else in the world to be so disrespectful and it’s not ok for him either! You could maybe let him know that you’ll be leaving/hanging up any time he does that, eventually the message will get through to him. I did this with my mum.

@AttilaTheMeerkat @Rubyred3 @Twatalert Thank you very much for your kind and encouraging words, it’s really helpful.

It’s been more than a year since I had any contact with my mum and I have felt really awful about it and still feel awful. I have written so many messages to her that I haven’t sent. Every time that I think of sending anything I remember all her last replies. When I wrote to her - when she had insisted that I tell her why she is not invited to my house - I really wrote from the heart, I was honest about why I don’t feel able to invite her and I also expressed that I would like that to change in the future, and that I love her and value our relationship. I kind of fantasised that she would be able to give me a loving and honest reply where she recognised what I said and said that she wants to make amends and improve our relationship. I was really actually wanting to invite her, fantasising about things we would do together when she came to visit, imagining having a relationship with a mother that would be loving and supportive and we would be honest about the past and positive about the future. Of course it didn’t happen that way, she wrote back lots of times blaming me, saying that this proves that I am not forgiving enough and that all the issues are because of my emotional problems. It destroyed the wish/fantasy/desire that I would ever get through to her and we would ever have a close relationship- it was completely predictable of course, and the same way she has been for her whole life. I was going through a bereavement when all of this happened, which she knew about. It hasn’t got any better over a whole year and more, it still feels incredibly painful. It also feels so shameful to have such a definitively failed relationship with my mother and it’s hard to get over that feeling, even after years of therapy and knowing that it’s not right, but still feeling that I am not doing the right thing and this is all because I am so bad. The relations who repeated all this to me over Christmas- that I am so bad for not being in contact with my mother - stirred it all up again. It feels like horrible anxiety and like a physical pain, all day every day.
I don’t know at all what I am looking for here except to want to be able to say these things somewhere. I hope nobody will mind. Thank you!!

@Gudinne Thanks for reading my post, which turned out to be a lot longer than I expected! I know, rationally, that what you have said is totally right but part of me can't shake off the feeling that if I'm doing anything for me it's outrageously selfish. I also know extended family are all expecting me to take over and look after everything and will have been fed the story that I'm being an awkward cow again (hence the user name). I know I am an adult and can just tell them the truth or simply that I am not willing to discuss the subject. But this is exactly what happened when I went NC with GB1 and I'm bracing myself for the phone calls and attempts to make me 'see sense'.

@Newsunflower- That sounds awful. Do the relations who speak up for your mum have any idea what she's been like or has she also managed to make them believe it's all on you? I know in my case part of me still won't quite let me be open about our family history even with people who defend GB1 and GB2 partly because I know it will upset mum and partly because I know the first thing they will say is some version of 'it can't have been that bad, you didn't complain at the time, we would have noticed, you must be exaggerating, it's all in the past so can't you put it behind you etc'.
Following the most recent incident with GB2 I have (so far probably only temporarily) blocked him on my phone so I can't receive the inevitable follow up ranty calls/messages. Mum thinks I'm over-reacting and it's all OK because GB2 has told her he knows he said too much (not that he's sorry, or shouldn't have been aggressive, or what he said was threatening) and it was only words, he didn't hit me. But he is frequently in the background giving his orders when mum calls me. Mum is now staying with GB2 and they are both complaining that there is not enough space/GB2 has too much on himself/it's not fair on GB2's family etc. But neither are willing to consider the alternatives of mum getting used to living alone or looking at some form of assisted living etc. Mum still wants me to do everything I was doing for her when she was in her own home and I feel like refusing would play in to their hands. So I am still having to take at least one day off each week plus spending time at weekends etc to take her to medical appointments (or anything else where she needs to leave the house), do her washing, help her shower, check her post, deal with all her finances and admin, arrange all her medication. All whilst GB2 rants about me doing nothing whilst he does everything. I suspect GB2's plan is her staying there to be as difficult as possible for me. Since I won't be giving in and agreeing she should come to me instead, I don't know what his next tactic will be to try to make me do what they say. I arranged a social care assessment a while ago but they both lied about how mum is and told her GB2 does everything and all is well.

I’m so sorry. The mind games are exhausting. Are the people she’s badmouthing you to repeating what she’s saying to you? This is really horrible. Is it possible to say: Sorry, I love and respect you, but I’ve drawn a line under my relationship with my mother for many reasons, and sorry under no circumstances do I wish to hear about her.

And repeat. And repeat. Until people get the message.

Your mother is mental leaving those bin sacks on the doorstep. I suggest that next time this happens is donate the gifts to a charity. It will give you a warm glow in the knowledge that you’re doing good, and your mother clearly isn’t! The gateau? Can you make an effigy and throw the cake at it?

sending hugs, x

Bloody hell. And great name and keep being awkward. Although you’re not actually being awkward, you’re simply standing up for yourself and refusing to kowtow to people’s rewritten history and selfish expectations of you. That dynamic between you and your brothers is a nightmare and you are right to keep out of having your mother living with you and becoming her full-time carer. GB2 is clearly not wanting to spend money on proper sheltered accommodation. The entitlement of these people is bloody exhausting.

I had a similar situation with my late mother in law and I ended up NC. I had to get hard ass about it all and make myself think: I’m not wrong to not want to deal with the witch, I refuse to be guilt tripped and fuck what other people think.

The pressure on people, especially women, to be ‘good’ is relentless. So many people don’t have a fecking clue about dysfunctional families and buy the myth of every family is like the fecking Von Trapps. Give yourself a big hug.