SEPTEMBER 2025 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

It does sound like BPD with her too.

Wonder why he begs her back.

Because he suffered abuse as a kid. People like this often attract other damaged people.

Hi, I'm new here.
My mother (88) has NPD, after many years of abuse and psychiatric help I eventually went NC in 2014, the same year I met my husband. We were so incredibly happy together, got married in 2016. Unfortunately in 2022 I had a few mental health issues when I was bullied at work, same year my daughter got married and I had to see my mother again. Certainly not easy but I got through it. A few months later I set up as self employed cleaner and life was good again. Spring of of 2024 my husband had falling out with his family when his own mother was very ill in hospital. Sadly since then things between us just haven't been good, he's really changed. Last Christmas was horrendous, he actually told me the love he had for me had died. I was devastated. After Christmas he went for counselling and things greatly improved for quite a few months but recently I'm beginning to think he may also be narcissist.
Before we met I had so many friends, now I hardly have any, slowly they have all drifted away. His own family never visit and rarely did even before their falling out. He now blames me for our lack of social life.
Sorry this is so waffly and long.
Last night we were having a bit of a disagreement and once again he said "this isn't all about you" something he says alot recently. Is this gaslighting?
When we're having a good time I'll tell him I love him he never says it to me or writes it in cards anymore.

Sorry for such a long post. Can't understand how went from being so very happy to this

You won't be responsible for anything, and if anyone does try to put responsibility on you, you are allowed to say no. We are not legally obliged to clean up after our parents or deal with their mess. Honestly, in my experience, you might not even be told. I was estranged from my father for decades. I only found out that he'd died because I used to google his name periodically, just to see if he was still alive. He'd been dead for several months when I found out - his estate was in probate and so notices of that had been posted online by the solicitor dealing with it. No-one tried to contact me, even though I was mentioned in the will (I was disinherited). The state has processes in place to deal with people who don't have anyone to manage post death arrangements.

I'm back after a bit of a break (with a name change). I seem to be in a place where my mother and I are back to LC verging on NC. We've messaged twice in the last 5 months and that's it. I'm still wrestling with very difficult feelings and trying to work on what I want going forward, if I want to say something, if so, what that is, how to fix things, if I want to fix things, how I am going to deal with it all.

It all sort of fell apart a bit when she phoned me and then proceeded to try and start an argument about a particular topic (she'd been asking me about this thing for a few months prior, asking me to explain it, and like an idiot, I'd thought this was genuine and tried to explain it - when she called she basically told me that I'd got it all wrong. She's got form for rushing in to start an argument like this. She almost seems to enjoy it and gets visibly excited if an opportunity presents itself). This led to me telling her that I felt the way I did because of my teenage years living in that house with her and my father and how desperately unhappy and terrified I was, that I'd had frequent panic attacks and had developed selective mutism. She told me that she hadn't realised. She didn't know. I was coming apart at the seams right in front of her and she didn't notice. I suppose on some level I had known this, but to have her admit it to my face was something else entirely, and I don't know where we go from here. She cannot do this to me any more. She can't start arguments with me because she's bored and gets a kick out of having 'debates,' oblivious to the impact it is having on me. It is like dealing with a bolshy teenager only that teenager is your mother. If she wants a relationship with me, she has to be the parent, she has to behave like a parent, and she has to be kind. I don't know if that's possible.

Nice to have you back. The simple answer is they don’t notice you and no you can’t have the relationship you want. You have one purpose and that is to validate her only, so unless you want to forget and get amnesia, stop being needy, stop having sensitivities and just shut up then there is nothing and there never was. We need to hang up the apron of hope, which is hard as it’s human. We can fill all the wasted hope with nice things.

@crazylizardss Would you sum up all you said as 'she needs to take accountability and reach emotional maturity'?

I don't know what it is with these people. I told my mother I was suicidal at about 15 or whenever that was and there was no follow up. It got ignored and never discussed again. I literally don't understand how this works for these people. Do they not hear it at all. How do they live.

I think that unless these parents commit to therapy and actually stick it out for a few years there is absolutely no point. Having done the work I did I cannot see how anyone could do this on their own whilst sitting on the sofa.

@DoubtsAndConfusion we didn’t even have a funeral for our mother (3 sisters) and have never regretted it!

I think at this point if they grew empathy the truth would annihilate them,

Misunderstood your post.

I don’t think you can anyway. It’s like being autistic, you can’t take that away. They are what they are and it’s up to us to behave accordingly.

I think for personality disorders yes. Obviously it's against the nature of the narc to ever see real. I think a lot of enablers could technically see it though, but it ain't going to come overnight and I think what is missing is that they don't suffer in a way that would cause them to seek change. So whatever the situation is works for them. It's hard to digest that this means many would rather not have a relationship with their child.

My mum never accepted she did anything wrong. She called me a "dirty liar" (her favourite expression) when I told her how much her abuse affected me.

She said she never touched me as a child. I said youve either forgotten or are lying and she said she neither forgot nor was lying. She said she never once hit me or harmed me and infact once i was a teenager I was abusive to her which was lies.

She had no idea how abusive she was or how terrified I was of her. She thought she was an amazing mother who had a couple of nasty kids.

Interestingly, my sister has turned out the same. Not yet in relation to her kids, but they're still quite young. But she certainly gone that way against her husband - being violent and abusive and then blaming him for driving her to it.

No amount of therapy would have convinced my mother that she was anything other than an amazing mum. No amount of therapy would convince my sister that she was anything other than blameless

Neither of my parents have a relationship with or by default their only grandchildren , they have either never noticed in their minds things are different and that is what relationship is ( not speaking for years and sending thrn money at Xmas but otherwise no interest ) x

Yeah definitely a narcissist employing the usual tactics. Apologies, I wasn't trying to suggest narcs would ever attend therapy or that it would work on them. I think I was replying to crazylizards without actually replying directly.

They just fucked, they aren’t a complete human so don’t think and function like one.

In my own case the reason mine don’t see my kids is down to me. I don’t take them, I am controlling they are the victim, they are amazing and all the family think so. I just have to come to terms with being portrayed like this.

Min don’t because I stopped making the effort and they stopped speaking to me because I pointed out one of their rude and racist opinions and challenging them means the silent treatment I am still shocked that they’re need to be right means more than their only daughter and grandchildren

Doesn’t sound like a loss if they rude and racist. Tbh most of them have little value other than what they are “supposed” to be. Mine have appalling views about people. I wouldn’t want my kids hearing it.

Yes my children heard their views they are now teenagers they are big impressed and don’t miss them so that’s a good thing

Lemon don't worry about the how, you kind of already know anyway, he changed. Just worry about what you're going to do about it.
If the marriage is dead why do you stay with him? I'd prepare for divorce and then when you're all set get the ball rolling yourself. He doesn't sound like he'll start it until he meets someone else. Not much point in you sticking around as a stop gap for him until then is there?

Have your friends all deserted you because of him and his behaviour? You could contact them, explain you realise he's an arse and offer to meet up with them without him and away from the house. They're your friends, you don't have to sacrifice yourself and your friendships to provide him with a social life. He can put the effort in to get out there and make his own friends if he wants to.

Gaslighting is denying your reality and falsely telling you something is/isn't true when the opposite is the real truth.
So it's not all about you? Depends on the situation doesn't it. If it's a conversation about how his moody behaviour and general nastiness is affecting you, then yeh, that is about you because it's affecting your life! I recommend don't let him drag you down further, do stuff to boost your self esteem (including stopping having sex within if you still are, because that won't be making you feel great if he's upsetting you and it's only out of duty), get some friends new or old for a social life and get your ducks in a row for a divorce, whether you go through with that right now or not.

Basically build a healthy life for yourself that doesn't revolve around him and what he wants and what he's feeling etc. Then you can worry about if you want him to be part of that life or not, and if so, whether he wants to or not.

That makes more sense Twat, I'm glad she's not stalking you.

So who else is dreading Christmas? This is my first Christmas NC and the time when they're likely to notice Something's Up. I've got curiosity about how it will go and also dread about what attempts at contacting me could be made via accidental FM, who don't mean me any harm but also don't know the half of it and don't see the problem.

Posted twice by accident, deleting this post

Hi, hope ok to reach out. I've read some of these threads before - feeling a bit isolated.

My sister and niece are blaming me for being difficult to deal with - that's their reason for not sending birthday wishes to my daughter.

I get on well with my other niece and don't want her to get caught in the middle.

I feel at risk of being blamed by my daughter, and jeopardising the one good relationship I have with my other niece if I defend myself. It's also giving me a sliver of self doubt.

I've worked hard over the years to learn to maintain my own boundaries and believe in my own expectations of how I should be treated.

Grew up in DV household, and left DDs Dad's as his behaviour was verging on emotional abuse. Had a lot of therapy over the years!

For my sister, there is bad blood between us. When she got married many years ago, she ditched me to try and fit in with her in-laws (I was too westernised) and blamed it on me swearing once during a row about something minor.

Her marriage wasn't nice. She stayed in it a long time until just recently but gave up working etc. Not had therapy as far as I can tell. Our re-established contact broke because I found her self serving at my expense and challenged.

The last time i saw the other niece, she seemed enmeshed with her, with her own social boundary issues.

Dont deny I dont have issues. Just think its easier for them to blame me than work through tricky situations.

Sorry its such a long post. I think I am just tired of dealing with all this.

Anyone who can’t separate issues with adults from the children is an idiot. That’s weaponising in my books, you don’t make a child suffer because you have issues with the adult. Just look at how it’s making you feel and all the doubt it’s feeding into and the eggshells. That’s probably exactly what they wanted to achieve. I guess there is two ways to deal it, wade right in and tell her straight you don’t accept this type of treatment or pull right back and ignore. I’d certainly be telling my daughter that it’s all on your sister and decent folk don’t behave like this. Your sister is using your daughter to hurt you by playing this silly game. Don’t tread on egg shells, get right in there and tell it like it is! No ones special, we all have issues it’s just some people like to deny and project.