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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is OLD as hard for men as it is for women

316 replies

Beanfry · 03/07/2025 06:52

I keep reading about how OLD is a cess pit for women, that there are no good men out there. But are men finding it the same in reverse, or are there really 100 women to every good man?

starting to think about dipping my toe back into the dating world, but the stories of how bad OLD is is putting me off. For context i turned 40 last week, so my dating age range would be 37 - 45

OP posts:
3678194b · 03/07/2025 16:50

I don't know, but I've given up. Yes I am quite choosy as I have my life in order, look after myself and I'm 5ft 8 and yes, I prefer someone taller.

I did get messages from men, but without trying to sound too fussy, none I'd want to message and do get the feeling it's a copy and paste.

I think there are many more women presenting themselves much more attractively than there are men, and any half decent men on these sites would be snapped up quickly.

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:05

arethereanyleftatall · 03/07/2025 15:59

It’s actually super mean to swipe right on everyone, especially as detailed below by twisted wonder, on some sites both sexes have to pay to see likes.

the poster below has detailed this as a ‘poor menz’ situation, but it’s the exact opposite!! At least they know that if a woman swiped right on them, it’s because they actually like them. This makes is harder for women because likes don’t mean anything.

as an anecdote, randomly I joined tinder today, not to view the men because I can’t care less, but for a friend who wanted to know if her bf is on there. Anyway, I have put the two obligatory photos up - both totally black shots showing nothing- and no info whatsoever, other than female. I had 100 likes within minutes.

The way the system has gone is that it has become a numbers game.

Dating apps were supposed to democratise dating, but it appears that it has just reverted back to gendered behaviour, where men are expected to make the first move and then women follow (even Bumble seemed to remove the requirement for women to make the first move).

I don't know this (but no one has corrected me in this thread), but I don't think women will go and swipe on any men in a discovery feed, just swipe yes or no on the likes received feed, therefore it creates a system for men just to swipe right on everyone to be in that feed.

In many respects both parties are to blame for the situation, rather than it being "poor menz".

LittlleMy · 03/07/2025 17:17

palmleafsinwinter · 03/07/2025 08:07

I’m interested in this, as a woman.
I find OLD monotonous… Men seem to either be unable to make conversation beyond “hows you?” Or they seem to be over the top, wanting to message constantly and overshare before even meeting…

And then the ones who are clearly just after one thing “Id love to give you a cuddle right now” etc

I would be interested to hear from a male perspective: do these approaches ever actually work on women?

I haven’t done OLD for over 15 years now and even now as a singleton never will. However, I agree that responses were only ever at one or other extreme of the spectrum: either absolutely no conversation beyond asking ‘how are you?’ and then those that overload obsessively. With a sprinkling of passive aggressive in the middle asking to meet up immediately! Oh and that rare gem of normality who ghosts you for no reason after a few (seemingly promising) texts!

Flatbellyfella · 03/07/2025 17:18

Not able to give an opinion on this topic, as I have never been on any OLD sites,
but I was close to a very intelligent lady I met at work, who worked on the Bank of a Hospital part time, after her husband went off with a young student he lectured in college .Over a period of several months dating , she would visit “friends” in various parts of the country at weekends, I thought it odd that they all lived in areas that had no or very little wifi/phone signals, It turned out she was meeting up in hotels with men from dating apps. She did find a man to marry eventually.
I am sure I had a great escape from what I thought was a relationship.

palmleafsinwinter · 03/07/2025 17:23

LittlleMy · 03/07/2025 17:17

I haven’t done OLD for over 15 years now and even now as a singleton never will. However, I agree that responses were only ever at one or other extreme of the spectrum: either absolutely no conversation beyond asking ‘how are you?’ and then those that overload obsessively. With a sprinkling of passive aggressive in the middle asking to meet up immediately! Oh and that rare gem of normality who ghosts you for no reason after a few (seemingly promising) texts!

Edited

”I’m not looking for a pen pal” is a heavily used quote from the type of man who often wants to pencil in a date after a 2 minute chat.

I’m not looking for a pen pal either, but I’d like to know a little bit more about you besides your name before I waste time and effort meeting up with you!

To me it’s a helpful deterrent, if they’re so pushy to arrange a date so quickly, they’re likely going to expect me to jump into bed straight away too… so I move swiftly on…

See also “Don't want dramas”. Ahhhh so you want a woman who just puts up and shuts up. Nobody actively looks for drama and usually if you have a pattern of “dramatic women” in your dating history, you and your behaviour are the common denominator.

Tidekiln · 03/07/2025 17:23

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:05

The way the system has gone is that it has become a numbers game.

Dating apps were supposed to democratise dating, but it appears that it has just reverted back to gendered behaviour, where men are expected to make the first move and then women follow (even Bumble seemed to remove the requirement for women to make the first move).

I don't know this (but no one has corrected me in this thread), but I don't think women will go and swipe on any men in a discovery feed, just swipe yes or no on the likes received feed, therefore it creates a system for men just to swipe right on everyone to be in that feed.

In many respects both parties are to blame for the situation, rather than it being "poor menz".

What app has two different feeds?

StripyShirt · 03/07/2025 17:24

TheGrimSmile · 03/07/2025 10:51

What's a 7,8,9,10?!? Is this how we define people of the opposite sex now? Who decides what makes someone a 10?

I'd expect there to be a fairly broad agreement, if a number of people were shown pics and asked to give ratings.

LittlleMy · 03/07/2025 17:29

palmleafsinwinter · 03/07/2025 17:23

”I’m not looking for a pen pal” is a heavily used quote from the type of man who often wants to pencil in a date after a 2 minute chat.

I’m not looking for a pen pal either, but I’d like to know a little bit more about you besides your name before I waste time and effort meeting up with you!

To me it’s a helpful deterrent, if they’re so pushy to arrange a date so quickly, they’re likely going to expect me to jump into bed straight away too… so I move swiftly on…

See also “Don't want dramas”. Ahhhh so you want a woman who just puts up and shuts up. Nobody actively looks for drama and usually if you have a pattern of “dramatic women” in your dating history, you and your behaviour are the common denominator.

Oh yes - ‘no drama’ is such an oddly specific request. As said, no one wants it or actively looks for it so if it’s finding you so frequently to the point you have to specifically make it clear you don’t want it - well, that is rather worrying straight away!

Also those people who put in their profile stuff like ‘don’t like liars, cheaters or time wasters’ - like it’s so angry and off putting and again implies they either haven’t got over a past relationship or again are one of those always finding themselves in such predicaments!

Thats why although I’d like a partner, you couldn’t pay me to go back to OLD - 15 years clean! 😅

LouiseMadetheBestBroccoliPasta · 03/07/2025 17:31

Your original point was: "Studies have shown that the majority of women on OLD pursue the top 20% of men, in terms of appearance. The other 80% barely get a look-in."

The study doesn't talk about such percentages. It actually shows:

" although women receive more messages than men overall, the distributions for both display a classic “long-tailed”form—most people receive a handful of messages at most, but a small fraction of the population receive far more. ... We find that both men and women pursue partners who are on average about 25% more desirable than themselves ... Women initiate far fewer contacts than men, but both sets of curves fall off with increasing desirability gap in all four cities ... both men and women combine aspirational mate pursuit with less risky prospects."

So men show exactly the same aspirational dating behaviour as women.

Other interesting points:

"average desirability varies with age for both men and women, although it varies more strongly for women, and the effects run in opposite directions: Older women are less desirable, while older men are more so (18, 19). For women, this pattern holds over the full range of ages on the site: The average woman’s desirability drops from the time she is 18 until she is 60. For men, desirability peaks around 50 and then declines. In keeping with previous work, there is also a clear and consistent dependence on ethnicity (15, 20), with Asian women and white men being the most desirable potential mates by our measures across all four cities. The final panels in the figure show how desirability varies with educational level. Desirability is associated with education most strongly for men, for whom more education is always more desirable. For women, an undergraduate degree is most desirable (13); postgraduate education is associated with decreased desirability among women. These measurements control for age, so the latter observation is not a result of women with postgraduate degrees being older (table S2)."

GuevarasBeret · 03/07/2025 17:34

ZoggyStirdust · 03/07/2025 09:05

Thank you
i mean, it’s been a while and I’m no expert. I was doing it about 10 years ago for a few months, then a couple of years ago for a few months. Happily off the dating scene now with only a few metaphorical bruises and stories.

my mate is just starting out online dating (at the age of 56) and I said to him that there are lovely people out there, they can just be a bit hard to find. he’s a great bloke and I hope he stands out as being that amongst a sea of horrors!

what I have found is that a high percentage of men I have matched with, have had their profiles written/edited by a female friend.

Most profiles are dross, and if those men were serious about being in a relationship they would ask someone “help me out here”. What is the fish photo supposed to say to a potential partner? What’s the messaging?

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:40

Tidekiln · 03/07/2025 17:23

What app has two different feeds?

All of them.

There is the discovery feed, and then there is the section for "Liked You".

I know the difference because the Liked You section is empty.

Tidekiln · 03/07/2025 17:47

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:40

All of them.

There is the discovery feed, and then there is the section for "Liked You".

I know the difference because the Liked You section is empty.

When I first did OLD it was Match then POF and more recently Tinder and Hinge and I've had plenty of dates over the years and I had no idea there were two feeds on any of them! I just sign up and the people just appear like a card deck and you just swipe left or right or on Hinge just click the option for yes or no. I didnt realise there was any other way! If someone has liked me before I've liked or not liked them it just shows on their profile if they have liked me (although there were a few times it didnt say they had liked me and only after I liked them did it match us up as they had actually liked me).

TwistedWonder · 03/07/2025 17:51

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:40

All of them.

There is the discovery feed, and then there is the section for "Liked You".

I know the difference because the Liked You section is empty.

But to see the liked you feed you need to pay. I can’t see the point in paying just to see endless people you haven’t bothered swiping on

GlassFanBan · 03/07/2025 17:56

TwistedWonder · 03/07/2025 17:51

But to see the liked you feed you need to pay. I can’t see the point in paying just to see endless people you haven’t bothered swiping on

Not the case with Hinge.

Tidekiln · 03/07/2025 17:57

TwistedWonder · 03/07/2025 17:51

But to see the liked you feed you need to pay. I can’t see the point in paying just to see endless people you haven’t bothered swiping on

Yes and for a woman anyway its pointless because if you like someone and they like you back (or vice versa) that's it your matched and can start to chat. No need to pay.

foreveryoung100 · 03/07/2025 17:58

I’ve not finished the whole thread. I have recently started online dating sites. Had 100’s of likes, couple of matches but when the chat was boring, I blocked (actually told them first it is not working). As a woman I still like to be messaged first. I look younger or decent for my age so I expect men to be the same. I consider myself an average woman so I would like swipes from decent average men. Instead I get swiped by too good looking which I know won’t work or absolute bangers which I won’t touch. No hair is not a problem given my age, but all we want is decent ‘no hair’ hairstyles not ‘I will cling onto the last 2 strands’. Only been on tinder and hinge - tinder pics are the worst, bumble quality looks better. A male friend told me it is worse for men, due to all women wanting the top 10 guys. But I have also asked the same question - are you trying to date comparable women?

foreveryoung100 · 03/07/2025 18:02

StripyShirt · 03/07/2025 12:46

Things that were a 'no' from me included:

  • Cliches. Particularly any variation of 'long walk to a country pub with log fire for Sunday lunch'
  • Poor English
  • Poor punctuation
  • 'Me and my horse' pics. The direct equivalent of 'man with fish'?
  • Extreme body types
  • Group pics - so which one are you? It was never the attractive one.
  • Any sort of photo filter, eg cat ears
  • Big lips
  • False eyebrows
  • Too many 'having a drink' pics
  • 'Day at the races' pics
  • Photos with children. Apart from them being entirely uninteresting, haven't people heard of safeguarding?
  • Bad taste in interior decor (not a euphemism!).
  • 'No cheats or liars'. As if that would stop them.

...and more, some of which have been covered in other posts here, eg 'No dramas' 😱

Edited

I’m a woman, and the amount of men on tinder with their kids in the pics make me very sad. I’m not sure if women do the same? But wow anyone can take a screenshot or target you just because you have kids.

User32459 · 03/07/2025 18:05

Most men on OLD can't get a single match and if they do it goes nowhere because the women are all drowning in options.

OLD only works for the top 10% of men. It's shit for everyone else because the top men women all match with rarely commit and just use it for easy sex.

Tidekiln · 03/07/2025 18:09

Can any men on here explain something that's always confused me about tinder-

A lot of men's profiles say something along the lines of "cant see likes just message me" and I've always thought what are you on about? You will know if a woman likes you back because it will pair you up, if she doesnt like you, you will know because you won't get paired up. And you cant message people you arent paired up with anyway. So why do men put that on their profiles? Is tinder set up completely different for men?

Okigen · 03/07/2025 18:11

Yes various friends I talked with all said it’s extremely difficult for men to get a match. My bf had some terrible experience.

User32459 · 03/07/2025 18:15

arethereanyleftatall · 03/07/2025 08:16

@ZoggyStirdustThats probably because men have no issue with messaging women way out of their league. I, as a woman, tended to ‘like’ those I felt were broadly on a level with me. Whereas you get unfit, unemployed, unattractive 50 yr old men messaging gorgeous 30yr old intelligent women and wondering why they don’t get a message back.

Men just swipe right on everyone though.

On online dating platforms like Tinder, men and women swipe right (i.e., express interest) at very different rates. Here's a general breakdown based on aggregated research and data analyses from various studies and experiments:

🔹 Men Swipe Right Much More Often:

  • Men swipe right on 46–65% of female profiles on average.
  • Some studies report up to 70% right-swipe rates by men, especially in urban areas with large dating pools.
  • This suggests that men tend to be less selective when browsing profiles.
🔹 Women Swipe Right Much Less Often:
  • Women swipe right on only 5–15% of male profiles.
  • Some studies show an average of around 12%.
  • Women tend to be far more selective, often focusing on a narrower set of criteria (e.g., height, education, profile content).
📊 Example from Real Data (Tinder Experiment):
  • One oft-cited experiment by Quartz (2016) showed:
  • Men swiped right on 62% of profiles.
  • Women swiped right on just 4.5%.
Another analysis using a large dataset from OkCupid and Tinder observed:
  • Women matched with about 10% of men.
  • Men matched with about 0.6–2% of the women they swiped right on, due to the imbalance in selectivity.
🔍 Why the Big Difference?
  • Men: Tend to use a "swipe liberally, filter later" approach.
  • Women: Tend to pre-filter heavily, possibly due to an overwhelming volume of matches/messages.
MemorableTrenchcoat · 03/07/2025 18:22

Okigen · 03/07/2025 18:11

Yes various friends I talked with all said it’s extremely difficult for men to get a match. My bf had some terrible experience.

This is what I’ve heard from male acquaintances. I’m not sure why PP don’t accept this.

BeEagerTurtle · 03/07/2025 18:45

Beanfry · 03/07/2025 06:52

I keep reading about how OLD is a cess pit for women, that there are no good men out there. But are men finding it the same in reverse, or are there really 100 women to every good man?

starting to think about dipping my toe back into the dating world, but the stories of how bad OLD is is putting me off. For context i turned 40 last week, so my dating age range would be 37 - 45

It’s different, not sure about better or worse, lots of female profiles are generally good, some are appalling - generally ( not always), women don’t initiate anything on OLD and (generally) don’t reply either - so as man it generally feels like you are talking into a void - so it’s a pretty depressing experience overall and not one I would like to try again

BeEagerTurtle · 03/07/2025 18:55

StripyShirt · 03/07/2025 12:46

Things that were a 'no' from me included:

  • Cliches. Particularly any variation of 'long walk to a country pub with log fire for Sunday lunch'
  • Poor English
  • Poor punctuation
  • 'Me and my horse' pics. The direct equivalent of 'man with fish'?
  • Extreme body types
  • Group pics - so which one are you? It was never the attractive one.
  • Any sort of photo filter, eg cat ears
  • Big lips
  • False eyebrows
  • Too many 'having a drink' pics
  • 'Day at the races' pics
  • Photos with children. Apart from them being entirely uninteresting, haven't people heard of safeguarding?
  • Bad taste in interior decor (not a euphemism!).
  • 'No cheats or liars'. As if that would stop them.

...and more, some of which have been covered in other posts here, eg 'No dramas' 😱

Edited

Oh yeah - horses , filters & drunk group shots are a no 😆

Laughlikeadrain · 03/07/2025 18:55

arethereanyleftatall · 03/07/2025 07:15

i very much doubt it.

i, as a woman, had a look once at women’s profiles, and they are generally far better than the men’s.

I doubt women would just ghost so freely, nor would so many pretend they want a relationship just for sex.

I also think that the married women who have found a good man, will recognise it and cling on, I don’t think that’s true for men who still have affairs etc even if their wife is gorgeous and brilliant, so those women are single.

Agree about married women staying with a decent guy. I’d also say that not only do they recognise they’re onto a good thing, but they are far less tempted by other men because there are far fewer decent ‘other men’ to entice them away.