July 2025 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.

This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.

Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

I don’t like the majority of the people I have tried to like in my life. I realise I was looking for approval and I was basically indiscriminate.

I feel really sad and anxious today. There's just so few people who know whether I'm alive or dead. I feel untethered and maybe I've made an awful mistake going nc with my ex sister, even though I hate her. At least she was someone, I've only got my adult kids now.

Much as I love them, they're my kids and I'm top of the tree, there's just no one else.

Making new friends won't help, it's not the same. Plus I'm fantastic at light chit chat at the library or local tesco but it isn't anything real is it. Then if I had something real I'd get overwhelmed.

Nothing really replaces not having a proper family, I don't have a husband either, I'm rubbish at that.

I feel alone in the friendship sense also. I’ve spent 40 years surviving and have missed the boat I feel. I sit with others but they’ve made their lifelong friends by my age so I just feel like a third wheel. Partly why I’m too embarrassed to get married.. who would come! 🙈

I get this @Dogaredabomb It's the void inside that came from a lack of emotional nurturing as a child. I feel nothing and nobody can ever fill this. It is incredibly hard to describe. It's a different feeling of lonliness. It's like I am falling and falling but never hit ground. That's how deep the void is. It is worst when I get sick and go through scenarios in my head. What if I need a hospital stay etc. And I don't have a mum or anyone to advocate for me or just help me up. Just to feel like I have an actual mum or anyone that would care about me like a mum would would be amazing. Not in this life.

When I see these gofundme pages of families that go through unexpected medical emergencies I feel jealous. I know it's not the right place and time, but they rally around, someone stays with the sick person, move heaven and earth to pay for medical bills or be there. I'd just be alone in a foreign country and they'd probably have to put my face on TV to see if anyone knows who I am.

@Dogaredabomb do you have a pet? A cat or a dog?

It is a scary place. But I believe we are so common in this experience. How many people are in families being abused but they can't leave or face it. I think they're in the same position, but in it and in denial which they might need in their situation to survive.
Then I think how many of us who are pretty much NC , and there will be lots of us I'm sure. It's still really hard I know. I'm an island now.

@Twatalert I've been in terrifying situations in hospital. Even when in regular close contact, they did nothing. My mum visited only to bring my son when it was clear he wanted to see me. So I've already been through it.

There were a few of us with no family support. I was in a bay once with a 25 year old alcoholic girl. Totally abandoned by the entire family. I could tell they were a dysfunctional narcissistic family when we got talking.

I watched one girl about 19 have these beautiful parents there daily. I was very confused and envious and sad all at once.

I have severe health issues and the support of family could have really helped me so much. I had none. I've had to fight and advocate half dead and it's totally shit. I hear you xx

@JoyDivision79 I'm really sorry. You are probably right that it happens to more people than we think. I went through this as a 4yo alone in hospital already, totally disoriented at night because I had forgotten I am not at home. My parents never came to visit, although other parents did so it was probably allowed but my parents chose not to. With any separation my mother was always of the opinion that it's just best to leave and not say goodbye (for example being dropped at grandparents) and it's best to not be in contact in between. They didn't say goodybe when they dropped me at hospital. I was just dragged out of the room by nurses, my mother looking the other way. So part of me thinks it can't be worse, but my system obviously keeps recalling the experience and how do you overwrite it. It's difficult.

Distraction. When my kids are emotional distraction works well. When there are no more lessons to learn and the thoughts come I go do something else. What about crochet or painting or something like that.

I just wanted to say that's an utterly heartbreaking story. Hugs.

I agree it can be so painful, but at the same time, I always look at those families and I know that underneath, things can be very very wrong in a family that looks tightly bonded from the outside. Tight bonds can hide all sorts of dirty secrets.

Thank you. I think I put this here a few times. It's had a massive impact on me which nobody ever acknowledged.

TRIGGER WARNING

I remember waking up a bit too early on the operating table and the surgeons were discussing my genitals. Even at 4 I knew it was creepy. I felt so vulnerable in this hospital. Thank god nothing more serious happened.

I try to do this too. It's probably often not what it seems. I'm just massively projecting my longing for a loving family onto them.

I feel like some people do get that. I feel like my kids have it, here, with my DH and I. It's all very normal and boring and calm. But there's this very heavy burden, isn't there, of knowing that you're offering to someone else what has never been offered to you, and that there's no 'senior' (for want of a better word) adult in the hierarchy that you can turn to. It's just you, and behind you, there's nothing. I am completely certain that if I needed help, I wouldn't get it from my mother.

I've never told anyone about the abuse and neglect I suffered as a child, I'm in my 60s , have moved away, many years ago, have/ had a lot of siblings but they were bad to me, died or just don't talk due to age difference but also due to uncaring parents, not encouraging a bond. SA, physical, unloved, emotional, neglect, I usually try and stay positive but I resent the fact that all the decisions I've made in my life have been based on my horrendous upbringing. I never ever got any warmth, kind words, cuddles. They used to say if you've been abused you're more likely going to do it to your own so I chose not to have children, I don't regret that decision I'm just feeling sad that I felt that's what I had to do. kind words mean a lot.

@Itnevergoesaway I'm sorry, that sounds horrendous, especially if you have nobody from a large family. It is commendable that you chose not to have kids to not pass down the trauma, but you are also probably not like them. Abusers don't have the insight you do! I hope you have peace.

@Twatalert i do find peace within myself but today was doing family tree and of course the nasties are missing from it, but it’s such an empty feeling. People say who haven’t a clue, we must forgive others to move on! I’ve moved on but sadly I’ll always have the “abused” label even tho I’m a survivor

@Itnevergoesaway I won't forgive my mother and maybe not my father.

Thank you for your kind words and solidarity ♥️

How to 'move on'?!?! We have! We're not weilding axes but we're not the people we could have been.

I used to wonder what handicap meant in terms of horse racing. It means handicapping (with weight I think) the bigger or more capable horses to make it a more even race.

So other people who were loved, if they were horses, would have been handicapped to make it more even for us.

Ah well, tomorrow is another day 🤷🏼‍♂️ I'm going to force myself to do good things tomorrow and try to fill the spiritual void. With something other than food and spending.

@Twatalert so much love to you and little 4 year old you who deserved so much more. You have probably blocked the intensity of fear and upset you were experiencing in that 4 year old body on some level. Because that would have been so utterly traumatic to experience. ❤️

I was in hospital for 3 weeks age 9. I remember one visit. There may have been more but I don't remember I made a great friend in there which was a huge comfort. I remember we had a TV to watch EastEnders!

I remember a real wrongun pervy guy who was a janitor or something. He was definitely a peado and I recall thinking I must keep him away from me. I remember him trying to get very close to me with a disgusting grin, handsy and knowing instinctively he was being sexual. I was in a wheelchair so that was fab ffs. Nothing happened beyond that. I recall being very savvy to this sort of creep even at 9.

It's so messed up when you think back.

I always told myself this was typical 80s parenting. In a way it was slightly but there must have been decent parents surely who'd never dump the kids like that. 🤦

What an incredibly difficult experience you have endured 💐❤️. In such a poisonous system it sounds like you were completely alone, with no safe space anywhere or safe person. With lots of siblings, I can see how for many it's only more damaged people to try keep yourself safe from. So sad and tragic and so wrong.

I feel that SA can be rife in dysfunctional family systems. Either by people within it or by outsiders and then utterly ineffective responses from the parents, or nothing but denial or turning on the victim!

Is therapy/counselling something you've tried or that interests you?

I've been watching videos about EMDR and whereas before I thought what shite, now I think, wow, there's data here saying this works.

I've had therapy for years which has been invaluable.

@JoyDivision79 in a bizzare way your 'upbringing' probably helped to read and navigate the pedo situation. It's sickening. In hindsight I'm SO lucky I wasn't sexually abused in a physical way. There was a creepy GP too, who stroked my arm and seemed aroused when he gave me an injection for my severe hay fever. Fucking creep. He stroked my arm, closed his eyes and just breathed. Such a pig.

Girls and women have a lot to carry. I didn't get physically violated by pure chance. It's sad how easy it would have been.

Those hospital experiences are the worst, when you are extra vulnerable and could do with a mother's live. Maybe in my next life.

I watched a video by Dr Ramani recently. She says that not forgiving is absolutely ok. And forgiveness might actually be unhelpful. When you think people have suffered an entire lifetime, well, not forgiving, that makes sense and may be a reflection of self love tbh.

I have days often where I feel compassion for the messed up person, but I don't necessarily forgive. I think you can get to a place where you understand and don't necessarily forgive but don't feel eaten up by it or feel anger. Just nothing. That's good for me. N

@Twatalert the void inside from a lack of emotional nurturing is such a good expression. It's a loss you don't even know is a loss? Lately I do start to feel a little sad for me as a child which is new and I'm guessing healthy! The huge anxiety I've lived with throughout life is starting to make sense now.
@Crazysnakes hope your finding the book good? The "good mother messages" in chapter 1 packed a punch. "You are special to me" "I'm glad that your here"... Imagine growing up with that!!! Blows my mind what that would do for a person!

@JoyDivision79 Today was a mega low, also overthinking work stuff. I’ve never had counselling, tbh I think it would make me worse, to remember details of abuse. i get out in nature a lot which really helps me, i went through a stage where i allowed myself to cry for that child’s miserable existence and put the feelings back in a box and take it down when i needed to. I don’t feel the need to do that anymore, I don’t forgive anyone