Married to someone with Asperger’s/ASD/ND: support thread 16

[BustyLaRoux]

New thread.
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This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
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It's complicated and it's emotional.
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The old thread is here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5299389-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-15?page=1

For me, it feels like I’m the parent of a moody, sulky teenager.

With a sprinkle of toddler behaviour - you know when, with toddlers, you need to think if you can Yes to something because it will become Yes all the time and you can’t possibly allow that?
dc1 was like this. I remember wondering like that about wellies of all things. Same pattern here with dh 😢😢. If I have a better day and try to do something then it’s becoming expected all the time.

It’s becoming very obvious to me that dh is totally self centered. I don’t exist, my needs don’t exist.
Whatever is beneficial to him, or whatever he feels is ok, yep no issues.
Something I need but he doesn’t see the point, like an appointment with a private consultant? Nope.

Currently working in separating our lives. No divorce just now. But living life as separate as possible so I can regain some agency over my own health and needs.

im feeling very sad though.

Lots of love @SpecialMangeTout3 sounds both positive step for and hard and is bound to make you feel some sadness. Best of luck with making arrangements.

DH is in a bad way this evening, he's stopped taking his meds because of the pain and the doctor yesterday saying he can stop. The providers for his titration have claimed to have called him (he says no missed call) and now made a follow up call in nearly 3 weeks' time and he is convinced this is them 'punishing' him for pushing back against them, which I think might be that 'overly negative' approach I mentioned. I never ascribe to malice what can be ascribed to incompetence personally. I'm half considering calling them myself and saying 'Please hurry it up and get him back on the meds because he's going to be a mardy sod for the next 3 weeks otherwise'.

They are the centre of their own universe. What I find sad is how many times I’ve not honoured who I am. How many silly things I’ve dismissed because it’s not important to them, how many missed opportunities for me because I listened to them, how many times I’ve hated myself for not being like them enough. How much of myself has been lost over the years. For example not celebrating Christmas early, not embracing the joyous feeling it gives me. Not collecting more mushrooms and fairies for my fairy tree because they laugh at me. This is the real sadness I feel.

Hugs @SpecialMangeTout3 and @Percypigspjs and @Echobelly 💐.

I’m just doing a mini mid life crisis so for once it’s not DH having the meltdowns 😂🙈.

Mines been happening since childhood as my mum has zero interest outside of herself, a whole lifetime of dismissing myself to try and get some interest. I’ve realised I’ve picked up joint hobbies just to try and remain connected as when I do what she likes we get to spend time together and those times are nice, but it’s never reciprocated. I’m deep In perimenopause early at 42 and im just starting to not give a dam anymore as I’ve wasted too many years on her. I can’t switch on and off like she can, only showing interest when doing a joint task or she wanst something and having zero emotional connection all the other times. She is a terrible mother really.

Husband rejects ASD .. and projects onto me..

I have a 14 y/o son who is AudADHD and a husband who from my observation is undiagnosed ASD - but he is in deep denial. He literally ticks all the boxes - sensory overload, rigid way of thinking, monotropism, communication challenges, cannot do small talk, all in or all out, stimming, cannot see other persons perspective - you name it. We went to a great talk recently by Pete Wharmby (Author of Untypical) and it was like listening to him describe my husband - who incidentally was sitting beside me. I though - well at least this might be a moment for him to reflect on himself?!

Not at all..
Instead when I gently suggested that they shared some similar traits, he immediately started talking about why he thought I was ND! This is not the first time he has deflected like this... I asked him had he ever done any self tests (he hasnt).

I told him that I had a few times, not because I actually thought I was ASD but in response to him raising it,, and that I also had spoken to other people who have experience with ASD (who dismiss it entirely in my case), and that while I have some ADHD traits, I have never scored very high on ADHD tests, and always score very low on ASD tests.

For context, my husband is in his late 50s. I am ten years younger. I have read a lot about ASD over the years, both in trying to make sense of the challenges in my own relationship and in supporting our son. I had a eureka moment a few years ago reading about what it is like to be a NT partner to someone with ASD. Since realising a couple of years ago our son is ASD, he has become a bit more open to it.. and a bit less judgemental of it. I thought that might have opened the door to him doing some self exploration, but not yet.

Does anyone else experience this total denial of ASD coupled with your partner then trying to project ND onto you?

Any advice?

I had a eureka moment a few years ago reading about what it is like to be a NT partner to someone with ASD

@StillBaffled can i ask if you remember the title if the book?

And yes dh is resisting the label too. From deep shame really.
The result though is that there’s no way in to help him get some insight on his behaviour.
It’s typical of him though. He is avoidant - if you don’t name it, it doesn’t exist. Which is great for him because no acknowledgement = no new demand put onto him = demand avoidance preserved. So in some ways, you could say it’s an autistic reaction too. Or at least based on it.

I don’t the answer. I haven’t found one that works for us.

@Percypigspjs i get where you’re coming from.
Its the neglect steaming from that that’s impossible for me to accept or forgive.

@SpecialMangeTout3
That is a way of understanding it - another instance of PDA.. this is interpreted as a demand I guess.
yes I think in my DH case it also comes from deep shame - he grew up in a very critical household, permanently compared to a sister (who died young).. never "enough".. so I can see how the masking happened early. I remember his mother saying once that he was a really talkative boy (never stopped talking) and that then he suddenly stopped (aged about 8). I wonder did he suddenly decide that his talking wasnt helping him and so suddenly started masking?

Book is called "Untypical" by Pete Wharmby. he was only diagnosed as autistic aged 34 (now 42).. so he has had a rapid learning journey - but in his case he is proudly autistic and seems to have loved discovering it.

I find the refusal to even explore and gain some insight so strange.. and so frustrating. Particularly when he can be pretty insightful about our DS behaviour. And perceptive/ understanding about other ND people - several of whom are the people he most connects with (but he doesnt see this link either!)

It’s a weird feeling because it’s not done on purpose, but her lack of awareness has had a detrimental effect on me because at the end of the day getting love from someone is something pre programmed. We give a lot of ourselves away trying to get this not realising that it’s always gone one way.

Sorry - I quoted wrong book..
22 Things a Woman Must Know If She Loves a Man with Asperger's Syndrome
by Rudy Simone

I can’t understand the shame from knowing yourself better. What does it matter? You’d think it would be beneficial to understand yourself. Do they believe that they are perfect with no flaws, nothing to work on it’s absolutely everyone else’s problem?

In my husbands case,, he is allergic to the "label".. and always comes back to the idea that by saying I think he is ASD I am saying there is something "wrong" with him...

Yeah, I'd say that it's not a criticism of them to suggest they are on spectrum, but I don't know if that still get through to a person determined to be offended by it. I've had friends on spectrum suggest I am and I'm honestly not offended whether it's true or not.

DH managed to speak to titration service today regarding changing ADHD meds and has got them to give him an appointment this afternoon rather than in 2.5 weeks because he does want to carry on with meds, just not the previous ones.

There is nothing wrong with being “wrong” sometimes though is there? Being wrong sometimes doesn’t make it all the time. If it means that your relationship develops and everyone feels better isn’t it ok. Are they never wrong in any relationship or situation ever?

FWIW with the "acknowledging they are ASD" piece: when I first wanted to pursue diagnosis for DS (13 years ago) DH was massively against for all the labelling reasons, and wouldn't even hear that he might also be ASD. Getting DS diagnosed (recently following the wheels coming off) and wanting to support DS has led DH to own more of his ASD and he is beginning to reinterpret some of his life experiences. It's been really interesting from the sidelines: frustrating as hell that it has taken 13 years and I could howl into the void about what those 13 years have been like ... I guess there is room for growth and change, but living with someone like this exacts a huge toll ...

I can’t understand why you’d be against getting your child diagnosed and getting them them the support that they need and what you know deep down that you wish you’d had. Why would you wish your struggle onto your child? Surely us undiagnosed adults would have given their right arm for support as a child. I know I would. Why not do everything you can for your child. I can’t understand this. For my children you could give me any label going if it helped them.

@StillBaffled fir dh, I think his resistance is from shame. Because it means There's something wrong with him. Basically confirming what his bullies were telling him so many years ago.

The avoidance (as in an avoidant personality ) is his way to manage demands and stress due to his autism.

Thanks for the book! Ill have a look too.

@Echobelly oh that’s great he had an appointment today. Hopefully the new meds will work better for him.
Its always hard with new meds to find what works/dosage etc…. Lots of tweeking required

dh doesn’t cope well with being wrong.
Or making a mistake himself.

At all.
I've seen him fall apart for really unimportant things.

But why? Why does he think he can never ever make a mistake? What does making a mistake mean? To me it just means I need to try again or learn more or research more. You can’t be right all the time, we can’t know everything or always get everything right.

@StillBaffled my DH varies in whether he considers himself ASD or not.

He is more PDA in presentation as he can be very charming and funny - but any amount of socialising at all wipes him out for days, he is enormously rigid, and often finds it hard to understand the bigger picture of what anyone says to him because he focuses on tiny irrelevant details.

He is extremely low energy, his life revolves entirely around his (very typically autistic) special interests, his executive function is shockingly bad - if he were older you’d swear he had early stage dementia - and when he’s able to force himself to do something he doesn’t 100% actively want to do, he is subversively compliant, does it in a half arsed or really irritating way, or ruins it for everyone by being a total sulky moany shit.

Remaining in work is very hard for him. Collaboration is very hard for him. Everyone else is an idiot, everyone else is doing things wrong. He resents every second he has to spend doing something that might conceivably benefit anyone else.

He is convinced I’m ASD because I ask him to leave the kitchen if he’s neither going to pitch in with the housework nor have a conversation with me.

I’ve explained to him a thousand times why it’s depressing as fuck to spend an hour cleaning and tidying around a man who’s just sat there staring slack jawed at his phone.

I’ve asked him directly to do household tasks and he finds reasons why he can’t, or says he’ll do them and then doesn’t, or he goes into a thunderous mood. The only way to keep myself from basically wringing his neck is to make a rule: no sitting there doing fuck all while I’m clearing up YOUR fucking dinner dishes. Go read the internet elsewhere, on your own.

DH thinks sitting there ignoring me while I tidy up after him is keeping me company or being sociable or spending time together.

And because I don’t revel in the companionable silence while I’m cracking on single-handedly with the housework he refuses to engage with, it apparently means I have social communication deficits.

In his case I think it’s equalising behaviour: you think I’m autistic? Well you’re even more autistic, and you can do my fucking dishes while you’re at it.

I’ve unfollowed all the smiley happy PDA advocacy people on social media recently as I can no longer kid myself that it’s not a deeply shitty thing to live with someone who needs to be ‘above’ other people all the time, and is never to be able to do the simplest thing anyone wants or needs from him. I don’t doubt that life is hard for him - but it’s also fucking hard for me, dragging him kicking and screaming through adult life.

I got a bit nervous before choir rehearsal as DH was insisting on doing maths 'revision' with DH and he was getting pretty short with him but not losing it. I came back from choir wondering if I was going to hear a tale of woe but it sounds like it went OK. I did worry when DH said 'It's fine to get it wrong, I only gte cross when you are careless' and I thought 'well, when does a mistake become being careless?' because what DH sees as 'careless' may not be something that's obvious to DS.

DH is a natural mathematician, it's a 'language' he can speak fluently and while DS, like me, isn't bad at maths, he's probably on track for a 6 at GCSE, I expect he's not a natural like his dad. I could do maths but I found it hard to understand why things worked as they did so I'd probably make 'careless' mistakes too just because certain things weren't obvious to me like they are to people like DH.

@VoltaireMittyDream I hear you! Also agree in the influencer BS.

@SpecialMangeTout3 sounds like we have the same challenges with avoidance, it’s a particular kind of hell isn’t it. Hope everyone is doing ok 💐