Should I talk to my wife about her cheating 20 years ago?

[Tyg46]

Looking for help and advice please. I'm desperate.
Married for 20 years. Great relationship. Amazing kids. Good life.

A long time ago I suspected her of cheating - 2008/09. No concrete evidence. Just a timeline of odd things. But her job is in a male environment so there was a lot bonding and banter. She always denied and got upset.

2010 - 2024 life was great. I never thought or spoke of it again. But, as we moved house in 24, I found some stuff. In 2007 she spent some weekdays away on a course for a few weeks. We missed each other so much. I recently found folders of her notes. And in it was a childish letter which was clearly being shared with a male colleague in class.

The jist of the scribbles are him asking her if she's OK. Telling her she looks cheeky, asking her what she's thinking. She then writes that if she wasn't married she'd educate him. Being married means she has to walk away from him even though she fancies him. He jokes about leaving the class and she asks if its for a quickie. The notes clearly show they haven't done anything up to this point as she's saying no, I'm married I have to behave etc. Him.saying, you wouldn't do this etc. But, she says, she has to behave because she'll be drinking at the night out 'tomorrow ' and she can't be thinking dirty thoughts.

Do I trust her? I honestly don't know. Was she enjoying the power over him and reading him. Or did something happen at the party the next night?

My world has fallen apart. Should I show her the notes? She'll just get mad and deny. Although she can't deny the words. It's too long ago right?

I think she is clearly putting down boundaries. The guy should not have followed up with her when he knew she was married. She’s brushing him off.
It could be read as flirting or it could be to get rid of him with him still having his ego in tact. But either way, she’s clearly brushed him off and told him she doesn’t want to think about him. Now let’s say she was flirting and she did fancy him, to use a nineties expression, she has still brushed him off. That is the point to focus on. Why would something have then happened at the party? In which you have said from the notes, your wife said no, she was married, and she said this more than once. Like, the boundary of her being married and not doing anything is clearly there.

Honestly, if your marriage is otherwise strong and you are close and you have met friends from the conference, I would clear this away with the notes mentally and physically.

When throwing them in the bin, ye, prob best to go through and make sure there's not info in there thst she still needs. Oh and given the nature of the notes, prob best to go through and remove anything that might be confidential. Thanks for your support though

Will she even remember or care about this bloke or the course 20 years on? I think you should give your head a wobble, don’t go snooping again and move on

Married for 20 years. Great relationship. Amazing kids. Good life.
If all that's true, I would honestly just let it go. Many people don't get to have that at all. Would you give it all up for the desire to have it out with her?

When throwing them in the bin, ye, prob best to go through and make sure there's not info in there thst she still needs.

Why would she need stuff from 20 year old notes from a course that took a couple of weeks? And - as you do not work in her field and did not take the course - how would you know what she does or does not need?

Oh and given the nature of the notes, prob best to go through and remove anything that might be confidential.

If that were ‘the nature of the notes’, you shouldn’t have been reading them and they should have been shredded, not put in the bin.

You were snooping and you’re being ridiculous. I also note you’re not addressing the nonsense about ‘others’.

Agreed. In the notes she twice says she's married and being married you have to walk away. However, after each occasion she follows it up with an inappropriate comment. So I'd say the boundary is there, but why write that sort of detail then. Why not just go with something like I'm married but I fo like you. Why talk about quickies?

I don’t know, and I am not sure it matters twenty years on.
I don’t think you can judge the past with the lens of now. You don’t know the context of the conference, the types of jokes which were being made, or what other ‘banter’ was happening in the room - which might seem horribly inappropriate now. You have two pieces of paper entirely out of context and are going straight to the scenario where your wife was cheating. Against all the other evidence you have said about your long and solid marriage.
For example, I was watching Boston Legal a while ago and I had to stop because I was like, how did anyone think this level of innuendo and sexual content in office banter was appropriate? It’s from 2008.
Even take the worst case scenario that your wife was getting a kick out of some sexually charged flirting, is that something which matters now? She came home to you. And nothing will have happened at the party because she told him she was married and nothing will have happened at any other point as you met the friends from the conference. So you have two pieces of paper out of content, from a different time, and a marriage which has lasted. Focus on the latter.

I honestly don’t know, I can only guess, the same as you, but I’m wondering if she was on this ‘blokey’ (for want of a better expression) course maybe she was trying to fit in? One of a few young females on a course filled with very ‘blokey’ blokes? You say the vulgar language isn’t her, so, was she just adopting a language she thought would suit, and it was an act? Maybe it was fun to be flirted with as well? Many people flirt, and it seems like her industry maybe more than some? You also said her 2 girlfriends said she talked about you non-stop, so wasn’t she trying to put some barriers down there? Hoping the other bloke would get the message that it was just flirting, nothing serious? She was much younger then and probably quite naive? Maybe it was a rather silly, childish game to pass the time? Only she can tell you obviously what was going through her mind then, and she might not even remember properly now? She’s obviously put him in a box for 20 years, it’s whether you can, or need to discuss it with her.

To put it bluntly, if you pursue this, you risk your marriage over something that didn't happen.

"I might not believe her..." that says it all, she'll know you don't believe her.

Get some counselling & change how you view your wife.

I’d let it go. Why open dusty chapters long closed with a bit of childish flirting in it? Chaos will ensue just because you have an itch.

Sounds like she’s grown and changed since.

You need to drop this you've got proof now that she shut him down and didn't cheat as she already told you.
If you choose To bring this up again and use this letter as "evidence" of an affair expert her to leave you.
Quite frankly you saying that you still wouldn't believe her that nothing happened is a massive red flag about you and your behaviour, how many times have you accused her of infidelity over tge years? What if anything would it take for you to finally let thus go?
I truly feel for your poor wife who has put up with your accusations and the knowledge that you think that she a cheat and is now going to be accused by you again. Nobody deserves to live like that. You need to speak with someone to deal with your insecurities before you completely wreck your marriage

Not sure I'm to blame?? Not strange at all to be chatting to a colleague about having a quickie and a screw. The issue lies with me being suspicious. Come on. Not all men are to blame for everything.

I've accused her once. One single discussion in 2009. Again in my OP, I state that I had suspicions in 08/09 based on other evidence which i haven't highlighted. Thats when i asked her. Like I said at the start I never thought of it or mentioned it again.

I've never ever accused her of anything during this work course in 2007.

you stumbled on these notes when you were moving in 2024? So you’ve been stewing on it for at least 6 months and now you’re posting on Mumsnet? You found a couple of scraps of paper inside large files of notes but weren’t snooping/searching? All sounds ultra dramatic and unlikely to me, but on the off chance it’s not a creative writing attempt, No, you shouldn’t drag up stuff from two decades ago that didn’t actually lead to anything, you should focus on your own issues.

We know Mumsnet is mainly for women, and rightly so. But, to the OP, ignore 'stewing', 'snooping' and any of that shit.

The guy's in pain. It may be irrational, but if you can't talk from a place of compassion, go on another thread. There are some great ones about shagging! 😉

Thank you to everyone who has offered supportive comments. It's impossible for me to explain every bit of detail in a forum. There's definitely some good advice in here.

You’ve posted before, OP. You presented things slightly differently, but I recognise the verbiage.

I think you need to therapy at this point, tbh. It’s not healthy to keep doing this. Your poor wife.

Very difficult discovering something that is ancient history for one party, long submerged by the accumulation of life experiences, but a fresh, acute source of distress for the other. She won't be able to recall the details of time, place, people (whether those would confirm your worst fears or set your mind at rest), so you'll want answers she can't give you, and she'll resent you for wanting them. FWIW, I would infer that nothing happened, 1) because you never detected anything in her behaviour or what others said, at the time or since, to suggest she cheated and 2) because, if she had a guilty secret I don't think she'd ever have stashed the indirect evidence in your loft (and, yes, I think she'd have weeded incriminating scribbles from the files in that case). Also FWIW I recommend saying nothing, hard though it will be to button it up, but I don't see where that conversation can lead, except to her feeling bad about you and you feeling worse than you do already.

Somethings never change. Man has suspicions and he is bad. Woman has suspicions and man is bad.

Ignore all “snooping” accusations it is perfectly normal to look through old training notes before throwing them away.

I would say just ask, don’t treat it like some kind of smoking gun or assume it is cheating but better to ask and just see. I’m curious why you were suspicions of cheating 20 years ago? There is a strong possibility she may not remember the exchange at all.

For those who assume the marriage will end of you ask a question about some inappropriate notes she exchanged with someone else years earlier, then the marriage is basically already broken. If it was just some silly flirting years earlier the worst response should be a conversation and moving on. If there is more than that then there is something else. If you constantly accuse her of cheating and she hasn’t, then that is the issue. If you don’t and she blows up over that then her response shows something else is wrong.

It’s perfectly normal to look through someone else’s 20 year old training notes from a course you didn’t go on, for an industry in which you don’t work, before throwing them away?

Right.

Yes. When I have cleared out my old training materials it is interesting to see how certain things were described. But more importantly I always flick through those sorts of things because if something else was slipped in you may not be throwing away just training notes but something else that was just put in as a “safe place” which you later forgot.

If looking to snoop on someone the last place I can imagine anyone looking is decades old training notes. This is the only example I have ever heard of where there was anything to raise any suspicions. If someone was reading a diary that would make sense, bit skimming old training notes?

Perhaps your training is far more exciting than any I have ever been on, but that would be the last thing most people would expect to find. You would be looking for something like what a good business model Blockbuster was or how great the HR policies of the Miramax were.

That’s your own notes. Why would anyone be looking someone else’s 20 year old training notes from a course they didn’t go on, for an industry in which they don’t work, before throwing them away if they weren’t snooping?

Additionally, this *Oh and given the nature of the notes, prob best to go through and remove anything that might be confidential. *would indicate that the nature of the notes is such that he shouldn’t have been reading them, anyway.

As to why - because jealous people snoop. If MN has taught me anything, it’s that. Logic, reason and best use of time be damned. They snoop.

Yes, when we last moved house five years ago I had to look through craploads of DPs old stuff because she just would not sort it out herself. We'd still be dealing with it now otherwise.

maybe i’m naive but i think there’s a good chance she was using humour and flirting to set boundaries without hurting his ego so it’s not awkward at work.

haven't we all done that with people we have zero interest in? “oh i would love to but alas I have a partner..”

You mentioned having DC now but this was 20 years ago. Could I ask how old you both are? It sounds to me like she likely got married before she was ready to, and given you are happy in your relationship now she has likely grown up and this is firmly in the past. My advice would be to move on from it rather than throwing that bomb into yours and your DC's lives.

Someone else’s work notes are not something people are expecting to be confidential. Lever arch files of generic printed material are unlikely to have anything people are worried about others reading. However, as I said sometimes people put other documents in (as the folder protects whatever the added insert is) for safe keeping.

Is flicking through someone’s old textbook “snooping” in your view? If someone flicked through an old “introduction to employment law” text book have they violated the owners privacy? Or if they were just curious what things looked different form how we would express things decades later, is this unacceptable? If they also fanned the pages to ensure there weren’t any loose papers in there does that change it? How about an old novel someone has? Is that expected to be private?

I’m curious what you deem “snooping” it seems very broad.