Frustrated with friend who is making the worst decisions

[Jazzjazzjazz]

I really just want to share this to see if there’s anything else I can do here. My friend is a single parent, she’s always been a great mother and her child was her world. Last year she met a guy, and he’s completely destroyed her world. A couple of months ago it all came to a head, and she just isn’t listening to reason. She’s not a young mother and she has a good career! The guy is jobless and moved himself in pretty quickly. He’s a drug user and he is always falsely accusing her of things and treating her like crap, and then suddenly they are loves young dream again. Since she met him she’s let her house go, it’s a tip, and I’ve been helping her sort it out because she would make excuses for me to not go round and for us to meet elsewhere so I got suspicious and since then, have been helping her get things in order.

ok so I don’t want you to think I’m looking down on my friend, I’ve been in an abusive relationship myself, but at that time I was a single woman, without kids. I’m upset about this next part, this is what is crushing me. Her ex husband was recently contacted by a mutual friend of theres, who told him enough to make him come over to her house, forcibly remove the child, and he will not give her daughter back to her. Prior to this I didn’t realise her new boyfriend is a drug user, or the extent of his abusive behaviours, I just thought he was a bit of a user and didn't trust him.

The thing is, my friend is more focused on appeasing and “sorting things out” with her boyfriend, than she is on getting her child back! I feel like I don’t know her anymore. She’s ringing me for hours and it’s all about him getting the help he needs and how he’s texting saying he needs her support (she kicked him out) I told her- screw him- keep him far away from this situation, now that social services are involved, you’ll never have custody of your daughter again if you move him back in. He’s manipulating her to live back in and doesn’t seem to care less that he has been a big contributor to her losing her daughter. I just hate this guy so bloody much, I don’t want to listen to her anymore rambling on about his good qualities and how he’s not all bad, it’s like- your daughter is gone!!!! I’ve told her she has a good job, doesn’t take drugs, and she should get her home in order and get her child back, and tell them this guy isn’t even in the picture anymore so there is no safeguarding issue but she seems too thick to understand any of this. I said if she wants to date him (makes me sick to even say it) see him every weekend when her daughter is with her dad, and assure social services that he will never be anywhere near her daughter and she won’t be seeing him in the week. Nope it’s not going in at all. I called her ex with her permission, and he is fully willing to cooperate with coparenting if she just doesn’t have this guy around the daughter. I really don’t want to walk away from a friend in need and I love her but why am I feeling so tearful, resentful, angry, and pissed off whenever she goes on about his stupid guy. Why has this not been the wake up call she needs! I 100% think despite all I’ve said, she’s going to move him back in because he’s been manipulating her so much and she keeps saying “if he moves back in he’ll have to to abc” and I just want to hang up the phone. Her energy should all be going towards getting her daughter back, cleaning her home, talking to her ex- she’s ignored calls from her ex!!! I just don’t get her anymore. Anyone know of any services I can refer her to to help her understand what is at stake here and to help her become stronger because deep down she does know this guy is bad news!

I’m sorry but it’s time to be brutal with her. Tell her you will always be there for her, but you cannot spend time with her until she sorts her shit out. Tell her that the fact she doesn’t care about her little girl in comparison to this tosser is devastating for you to witness so you are stepping back.

Agree - telling her what she should be saying to SS is a massive overstep. Especially when you know she's not actually making any effort to change her situation. By doing this you are helping her try and circumvent measures which are designed to keep her child safe.

This. Sure, be there for her if she finally gets free of this loser. But it’s not in the little girl’s interests to be back with the mother at all right now! Haven’t you heard all these news stories about poor children abused and killed by stepparents and the previously devoted mother does nothing?

Just wanted to say you sound like an amazing friend OP. You have been there for her more than many would have been and more than she deserves. I don't know what the right answer is. I think for me I would say I will always support you when this man is gone and you want to rebuild life for your daughter but I cannot support you whilst this man takes priority.

But I just wanted to say make sure you look after yourself in this. Supporting someone who is or may be using drugs is hard. Supporting someone who's life has fallen apart who won't listen to reason is hard. Don't give everything you have to saving her. Your wellbeing is vital!

Take care.

I was wondering this too. And maybe he's supplying her which is keeping them in contact?

What wake up call does she need? Thankfully for her daughter her dad has stepped in and done the right thing.

The last thing her Daughter needs is going back to her Mother's home as she is clearly still in contact and in what seems like a toxic bond with the drug user who is leaching off her.

Sorry OP, but stop thinking of your friend as the person you once knew, she is now a totally different person - drugs transform people and drug users lie and manipulate.

Time to step away and be glad her Daughter is away from it all.

This! If there's drug taking in the house, and abuse, not to mention it being a pigsty, why would op want the little girl back in that house?

I think gentle only works for so long. Sometimes people need to hear the truth in short blunt terms - doesn't mean you can't end it with "I'm here for you and always will be but you had to hear this" but sometimes it can shock people into action if a close friend just tells it as it is. But I agree that the child should stay with her father - the mother has proven her judgement isn't reliable at the moment.

There is a book called ‘women who love too much’ it’s all about this. Get the book for her. Hopefully she will see the light.

Honestly? I’d dump her.

I would say I can’t support you in this, he’s a piece of shit and you care about that more than your child. We don’t have the same values. Crack on.

I would be stepping back.

I think you’ve been very gentle with her and it’s time for the gloves to come off. Because as well as the things she’s fucked up in her own life, she’s now wasting hours and hours of your time talking utter rubbish. You think you are ok to suck this up /be a good friend, but you shouldn’t. These hours of rubbish are too much - I’m sure you have a productive use for them - teaching your child something/spending time with your child, improving your life/home in some way.

I would sit down with her and say: “you are not seeing sense - this man is a total evil loser and you must not have any contact with him ever again. There is no way that you can help him or change him. You need to never contact him ever again. You need to realise that he has cost you your child - and the next thing he is going to cost you is our friendship. I cannot be involved in any further discussions about him, unless it relates to you cutting him off or having cut him off.

and if she continues self destructing, protect yourself and your time by cutting contact with her. Don’t make this as a threat, keep it in mind as a personal boundary. You are having a part of your life sucked out by this cunt of a man as well.

Completely agree. How could you prioritise a man over your own child? It is disgusting and so sad.

I wish more mothers had your mindset.

A pp said drugs are the only thing that can make a mother act so selfishly and I’m not sure if it was a typo and they meant are not the only thing? But I wanted to say no, it’s not only drug addicted mums who are selfish.

Mothers aren’t saints they’re normal people from all walks of life who happened to have sex and create a baby or sign legal papers to become an adoptive parent. Of course many of them will be selfish, just like there are MANY selfish fathers and childfree people.

I can’t say if OPs friends is using or not but generally speaking when I worked in social services and education, the number one thing that mothers would sacrifice their kids welfare for was a man. It was absolutely depressing The amount of kids sidelined, neglected or outright abused by “mums boyfriend” and how it impacted them.

but if she’s not going to fight for her child, and then she loses her for good, I am not going to believe that she was totally helpless to prevent that.

Exactly this. She is not helpless and will one day have to answer to her child for why she didn't fight for her.

I bet she's using. The next step is that she'll lose her job. The minute the money runs out he will be off.

I'm glad the child isn't with her and I wouldn't advise her how to get them back. I also wouldn't sugar coat things with her but be available for when this crashes which it will.

My ex neighbour was a coke head and had a succession of men through her child's life. Her child was removed to her father and it didn't affect her at all. She had no shame about anything. You and I would be horrified and do anything to get our child back. Some women don't care they just want a man, any man.

I had a similar relationship and if I was scared of what happened when I had to leave the house and he'd neglect her, it was absolutely dwarfed by the fear of what he could possibly do without me having any oversight whatsoever. I was very concerned he'd hurt her to hurt me.

I too wondered if she'd started trying out these drugs. It's a very odd thing for someone who actively doesn't take drugs to partner up with somebody for whom this is a lifestyle.

That she's funding that disgusting man makes no sense to most people but it obviously does to her. She must be desperate for him which is very sad.

I'm glad her daughter is with her father, he appears to be the only parent who loves her.

I agree with the posters advising you to take a big step back. It probably seems harsh to you as you can put yourself in her position having been there yourself (when you didn't have children) - but that 'acceptance' of her position isn't helping her. Not a bit. The child is safe; your friend needs to hit rock bottom herself to get out.

I’m a very blunt person , I’d be telling her that unless she gets rid of the boyfriend she will never see her daughter again and that no mum who loved their child would put a man before them and the safeguarding of their child.

id not be pussyfooting about, if she can’t see sense then she doesn’t deserve her daughter in her life, I’m also not sure I could still be friends with someone who disregards their child's safety, secure home and loving relationship like your friend has.

edited to say I’ve had that very same conversation with my sibling who hasn’t changed and who I have no contact with now. Their children now have nothing to do with their mum or dad and are gradually rebuilding the relationship with family who they weren’t allowed to see when younger. It’s a horrid situation,

Hi Op

I agree with previous posters she’s using drugs as well and to answer your previous question no she wouldn’t get rid of the boyfriend and use in secret, the dependency on drugs and the toxic abusive relationship will go hand in and hand and nothing will come above that including her daughter I’m sorry to say.

Im glad in a way that her dad went in and got her out of that environment he acted fast and had his daughters best interests at heart something she probably hasn’t had for a while because of the way your friend has exposed her to the environment she was in.

Youve done all you can, if I was in your shoes I would message and say you can no longer support her decision to enable her choosing her boyfriend over her own daughter and I would take a step back. I would then keep in contact with the dad to ensure you support him and the little girl I think those two are more deserving.

You can’t help everyone OP and at the end of the day she’s made her decision despite how serious this situation is, there is no more you can do and that’s the crux of it. Take a step back cos the more you listen to her about the boyfriend the more you’re enabling it.

No I’m not, I’m telling her (if all she has said is true, that she’s not taking drugs, he is) that getting him far away and out of the picture is the only way she can sort things out, because social services (at the moment) have an issue with him, and if he was removed from the situation (if she isn’t taking drugs) she could get her life back and her child. Perfectly decent advice- essentially remove the problem and stop mothering a drug addict who is using you for a place to stay. I’m not convinced she is using drugs, she always had low self esteem and feels like this guy really loves her. She always felt it was her pursuing any man she’s been with, I would say that is the heart of the problem. I have made it clear that it’s a clear choice between him or her daughter. She should know that anyway. I feel like her drug, is him. As long as I’ve ever known her she’s had a interest in fixing people and a distaste for drugs so I’m not going to start accusing her of something that I am not convicted is happening here.

You’re not really reading the thread, my advice to her was very clear, it was:

Dump this guy and cut him off, at the very least never have him in your home or around your child.
clean your home
show social services that your priority is your daughter.

she always had a clean home, she has a good job, and while the father is a good father, like most of them they don’t really know the reality of caring for a child full time. The daughter is very attached to her mother.

you should really try reading the thread properly, I haven’t suggested for a second that the child comes back on these conditions! I wouldn’t want that at all for the child, I’m asking her to sort her life out so that that can happen, before it’s too late.

I haven’t pussy footed, and I’ve said all of that, my exact words being “if you choose him, you’ve likely lost your daughter forever, he’s a man child who is using you as a mother, but you already have a child, so cut him off completely before you fully lose her”

Would you trust your friend that the weekend she has her daughter she definitely would not be seeing the guy ?! I think the daughter is safer left with the Dad and only with Mum under supervision .

I understand you want to help your friend. But the impetus and decision to change - and take positive actions - has to come from her. If she's not taking drugs and genuinely wants her child back above all else, then all she needs to do is engage with SS.

The fact that she doesn't have her child back indicates that she's still prioritising her relationship for whatever reason, whether that's fear, guilt, love, or addiction. She is the only one that can decide to change.

If you haven't done so already I'd really recommend you read the AMA thread that someone linked to earlier. It's a good outcome, but it took the OP in that thread five years to get her children back from SS - and she was very clear that the motivation to change can only come from the person themselves. The reason for that is that it needs to be self-sustainable, rather than dependent on someone else (such as a supportive friend) propping them up.

So if you have told her that unless she leaves this piece of shit of a human and sorts herself/ her house out she will lose her daughter permanently…..what does she actually say to this comment? Does she just agree and then move on? I’m just confused how if you have said this and she understands why she continues to try and tell you this guys “good points”. And if she does keep doing this why you don’t just shut it down each time and refer to the earlier comment “sorry X but I can’t continue to listen to this rubbish about this guy, HE IS COSTING YOU YOUR DAUGHTER! Do you understand this?? If so what are you going to do about it! Stop talking/thinking about this twat and put your daughter first because right now you are being a fucking AWFUL mother!”

she can’t ignore these comments surely??

So you say father doesn't know the reality of being a good father but your friend is spiralling out of control and had her child removed because she is supporting a crack head and lives in a pig sty...right. You should stay out of it. The daughter needs to be with her dad