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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Mum friends or frenemies? Can't get over it

171 replies

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 04:30

I am tired of speaking about this with my friends and my husband literally shouted at me for bringing this up again today. Please, if someone can tell me how I can get over this I'd be forever grateful

So, during my pregnancy I connected with around eight other mums to be, to form friendships and companionship during our upcoming mat leave.
One in particular, lets call her Ava, I thought I'd got on well with: Ava is lively, friendly and goes out of her way to help all of us. Her generosity is unmatched.

At some point into our mat leaves, some drama happened in the group where two of the girls were somewhat unkind to another. They basically accused her of knowingly bringing her sick children to a gathering where most of the babies got ill, and Ava's baby caught bronchiolitis as a result.

This girl, lets call her Helen, was mortified. She apologised profusely and swore she didn't realise her kid was ill. I believed her and took particular umbrage at how she was made to feel.

When I next saw one of the unkind girls, we can call her Polly, I didn't hide my feelings and when she asked if I was OK I was honest and told her how she'd made Helen feel. She gave a qualified apology, saying Helen is a disruptor, doesn't take advice from us when her children fall ill and maybe if she did they would be healthier. Her tone was that Helen is a neglectful mum.
Nonetheless, she messaged Helen directly and apologised which was good because they sorted things out between themselves. Good.

Now Polly is the mums I was least close to. I found her to be quite self absorbed. One of those people that talk over you and is only quiet so they can think of the next thing to say. She's also really negative, and pretty dramatic which I found draining. Id always offer to help anyway, as we all did, but it just never seemed enough.

I never spoke about Polly, about how I didn't like her, to anyone, until one day Ava and I were out together and Ava broaches the subject of the whole drama with Helen. I felt Ava was safe, so I told her about my feelings towards Polly. Ava joined in, saying how she also finds Polly negative, that her partner finds her super negative too and that when she visits, always overstays her welcome to the point that Ava feels she needs to feed her because she's there for so long.

A few weeks go by, Polly and her friend had become somewhat frozen out of the group because the others also felt they were too negative and a bit judgemental.

Then one day Ava messages saying she's very worried about Polly, how she is really remorseful about what happened, and that shes feeling isolated as if she had no friends at all. I was sceptical. Polly has 5000 friends on facebook and friends irl who help her and her family. However she insisted that Polly is vulnerable and susceptible to the influences of others and thats why she acted that way.

So the other girls and I warmed up to Polly again and thought Ava was being noble, by helping someone in a bad position.

After that, Polly and Ava seemed to have become best friends. They would often share picture of them together and their babies with the group, sometimes to things none of us had been invited to. Ava started saying things like "come to my house, ill cook for you" or "youre welcome to a playdate at mine" whenever Polly would hint she was lonely or had no plans.

There are other friendships in the group but no one else behaves this way. Things arranged between individuals are kept between them and no one fawns over their mates like this. And there are other good friendships there, that's a fact. Its gotten to a point that if Ava goes anywhere and invites the group, Polly shows herself availably immediately. I personally don't want to spend time with her and noticed the others will often not join either. I only really see them when we arrange to all meet which usually happens about once a month.

To begin with I thought how nice of Ava to help someone in need but as their PDAs carried on I started to wonder if any of what she told me was true? I began feeling as if I had been manipulated into saying how I truly felt. That maybe I had been spied on?

All I know is it makes me sick to see them be friends. Maybe I am jealous, that Polly despite her shortcomings found herself a good, true friend and I didnt?
Thing is I was genuinely OK to begin with, but as the PDAs kept coming in I found myself more and more annoyed.

The chat is on mute, and Ive not gone to recent gatherings, mainly because Ava doesnt think anything of bringing her kid out when he had just recovered from HFM (still had blisters and my baby caught it off him) or RSV and that's annoyed me anew.

Ive been told me to just leave the chat and cut ties but I feel the right thing is to continue pretending all is well , not show my feelings again, otherwise if I do then I lost the game, I am weak and pathetic.

Thank you if youve made it this way. I know you will say I just need to get over it, but believe me, Ive tried. Ive made other friends, I have my own interests, I love my life. They just annoy me and I dont know why!

AIBU and crazy and just completely insane?

OP posts:
MyHangryWriter · 28/11/2024 07:44

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Fleaspray · 28/11/2024 07:44

Managed to read a whole paragraph before I got bored. Reads like chat GPT has written this. On the off chance it’s true and you just have a very weird writing style then just back away from these people, they are living for drama and it’s just not worth it. Oh - and leave the group chat, you’re just picking at the scab staying in contact. Leave and move on.

1AngelicFruitCake · 28/11/2024 07:45

Are you still on maternity leave?

2weekwait · 28/11/2024 07:47

You sound like my old SIL where everything was a drama. Honestly in real life I would roll my eyes at this. If this is your biggest issue in life right now you are blessed and can’t see the wood through the trees.

I don’t have the energy to even think like this, be friends with who you want. Your friends can be friends with who they want. Life isn’t this hard and you sound like a drama queen

MyDeftDuck · 28/11/2024 07:48

I have seen this happen all too often over the years. In fact, I have personally experienced this quite recently - a number of us of varying ages set up a local support group, we would support various local charities, the church, school etc by holding sales of hand crafted goods, nearly new books etc. We would also re-distribute unwanted clothes, toys to families who didn't have much and needed a bit of a leg -up. This not only helped our community but also gave us all a focus and was a hugely positive impact on our own mental health as personal illness had affected some.
Everything seemed fine to begin with but over a period of time one particular woman has become rather a nasty individual and has openly excluded others, especially me. I found this hurtful to begin with but I am a bit tougher than she realised. Now, when we meet up, as we often do to check in on projects, I smile and rise above her - I will not leave the group because being involved has given me some sort of an outlet where I can share joy in creating beautiful items that I sell to raise cash for local charities or simply give away to make people smile.
Anyone who might watch Mrs Browns Boys will know that when she says "that's nice" she really means "F**K OFF! Try it, it is very uplifting.

Losingthetimber · 28/11/2024 07:49

Oh op. You can’t see the wood for the trees. You tried to be the mean girl bully, ostracising polly and failed. And now you’ve realised the real queen bee is kind to her and they are good friends, you see your failure writ large, and it’s pissing yoh off.

the issue here is you tried to bully and ostracise Polly out. You. Not the others, and they didn’t allow it, rightly. You were bad mouthing her and trying to get the others to exclude her.

im curious if you also behaved like this at school? Did you try to keep a close group of friends and ostracise other girls?

MumblesParty · 28/11/2024 07:50

Ava didn’t like Polly, but then she got to know her better and now they’re friends. Isn’t that all there is to it?

redskydarknight · 28/11/2024 07:50

I think there is a huge narrative when you have a baby about all you'll get to meet loads of other mums with babies the same age, and you'll spend your maternity leave going to coffee and baby groups with them and be friends for life.

Similar narrative when your child starts school and everyone says how easy it is to make lots of friends with other parents then.

<NEWSFLASH> Neither are true. You might meet friends for life, but you are as equally likely to meet some people that are perfectly nice to hang out with for a bit but don't form any sort of connection with, or people that you don't really have much in common with at all.

I admit to being guilty of believing this narrative when I had a baby and I then couldn't understand why I didn't have loads of mum friends, and in fact the mums I met often weren't interested in getting to know me and/or had their own separate lives that didn't involve other mums with babies.

By your own admission, OP, you haven't even tried to become closer friends with others in the group. But I wonder if you were expecting them to happen anyway?

If you'd like to get to know someone better, than invite them out individually. If you have other friends, then focus on them. "Mum friends" are weird. They are people you are thrown with due to circumstance. Particularly at school age you probably need to get to know them at least superficially for the perspective of play dates etc. Maybe best to think of them more of work colleagues? You wouldn't start a new job expecting all the colleagues to be your friend - you'd just expect them to be pleasant and professional.

Allihavetodoisdream · 28/11/2024 07:51

Also HFM is everywhere and most nurseries still let you take your baby in with it. I would never give another mum a hard time for unwittingly passing it on to my baby, or RSV. An NCT mum’s baby gave mine Covid when he was about 3 months and she was so apologetic even though I couldn’t see what she was apologising for really. The thought of making her grovel about it didn’t even cross my mind. The whole group sounds very immature.

Ruggsey · 28/11/2024 07:51

Really good advice from @Hell
ebborres

This has been a very cheap lesson.
Stay bright and breezy with them, and learn from this.

Its a rare person who doesn't learn this.
Good luck.

Namechangefordaughterevasion · 28/11/2024 07:54

TLDR. But from skimming I get the impression this group has run its course.

'Friends come into your life for a reason, a season or a lifetime'. It sounds like this group had both a reason and a season but now it's over. Move on.

gannett · 28/11/2024 07:55

I believed her and took particular umbrage at how she was made to feel
I didn't hide my feelings and when she asked if I was OK I was honest and told her how she'd made Helen feel
I felt Ava was safe, so I told her about my feelings towards Polly
Polly and her friend had become somewhat frozen out of the group
So the other girls and I warmed up to Polly again

All of this is some cliquey Mean Girls shit, except extraordinarily tedious because you're not actually in a film. And you, OP, have played a huge role in shit-stirring all along, by your own admission. You were OK when the group was freezing someone out en masse, then warming up to her again (what childish nonsense!) but an actual friendship is beyond the pale?

You are the frenemy. I'm not surprised your friends are bored and your husband shouted at you.

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 07:55

redskydarknight · 28/11/2024 07:50

I think there is a huge narrative when you have a baby about all you'll get to meet loads of other mums with babies the same age, and you'll spend your maternity leave going to coffee and baby groups with them and be friends for life.

Similar narrative when your child starts school and everyone says how easy it is to make lots of friends with other parents then.

<NEWSFLASH> Neither are true. You might meet friends for life, but you are as equally likely to meet some people that are perfectly nice to hang out with for a bit but don't form any sort of connection with, or people that you don't really have much in common with at all.

I admit to being guilty of believing this narrative when I had a baby and I then couldn't understand why I didn't have loads of mum friends, and in fact the mums I met often weren't interested in getting to know me and/or had their own separate lives that didn't involve other mums with babies.

By your own admission, OP, you haven't even tried to become closer friends with others in the group. But I wonder if you were expecting them to happen anyway?

If you'd like to get to know someone better, than invite them out individually. If you have other friends, then focus on them. "Mum friends" are weird. They are people you are thrown with due to circumstance. Particularly at school age you probably need to get to know them at least superficially for the perspective of play dates etc. Maybe best to think of them more of work colleagues? You wouldn't start a new job expecting all the colleagues to be your friend - you'd just expect them to be pleasant and professional.

Yes I definitely and naively thought we'd all be best friends and hang out together like a happy commune. Honestly.
I'm living and learning

OP posts:
BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 07:58

Ruggsey · 28/11/2024 07:51

Really good advice from @Hell
ebborres

This has been a very cheap lesson.
Stay bright and breezy with them, and learn from this.

Its a rare person who doesn't learn this.
Good luck.

Absolutely. Thank you

OP posts:
LetsNCagain · 28/11/2024 08:02

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

I disagree. Things don't get much harder than trying to navigate your first maternity leave. It is a huge shock to the system and desperately isolating.

Op is reminding me of how I was, anxious and even a bit paranoid.

She writes about "maybe I've been spied on". "Have I lost the game".

She's isolated and that makes her ruminate and overthink.

Op, honestly, go back to work, at least part time. You'll have intellectual challenges for your mind to consume, so it doesn't self-consume.

Don't be afraid of cutting your leave short. I'm so glad I did with my second. I've still co slept with him every night and spend 4 days a week glued to him, so he's not missing out on mummy time. And I'm bright and cheery because I've got interesting (work related) problems to think about, and a feeling of achievement at work. (And a bit more money than when I was on leave, so I can do soft plays etc without worrying about the cost!)

You're not a weirdo, or immature, op. This is a standard reaction to being on maternity leave for some (not all) mums

TheaBrandt · 28/11/2024 08:02

It’s a journey! My lesson from coming out of the other side of this is low expectations. I take the positives from friendships and don’t deep it. I have dh and sisters for the deep stuff. Friends I have a great time with. Sometimes they do stuff without me - I have taught myself not to care. That is my tip!

Mine are late teens and I have friends for life from the playgroup / primary years but have not seen my nct group since 2016.

NineDaysQueen · 28/11/2024 08:07

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 07:23

They see me rollin, they are definitely hatin

Pritti!! You're back!

TimeForATerf · 28/11/2024 08:07

I had years of this with my DD…….right up until she left year 9.

This is really teenage stuff, find new friends and continue with the once a month meet ups.

Kool4katz · 28/11/2024 08:09

OP, you’re the one with issues, not Polly or Ava.

Now Polly is the mums I was least close to. I found her to be quite self absorbed. One of those people that talk over you and is only quiet so they can think of the next thing to say. She's also really negative, and pretty dramatic which I found draining. Id always offer to help anyway, as we all did, but it just never seemed enough.
I never spoke about Polly, about how I didn't like her, to anyone, until one day Ava and I were out together and Ava broaches the subject of the whole drama with Helen. I felt Ava was safe, so I told her about my feelings towards Polly.

You've been the ‘mean girl’ in the group trying to ostracise Polly and now it’s back-fired on you and clearly you’re upset. Good! Hopefully, you might learn a valuable lesson from this.

You’ve got to stop projecting your own insecurities onto others and assuming negative things about other people.

You don’t live inside someone else’s head so you can’t possibly know why someone says X or reacts in a certain way so it’s counter productive to presume otherwise.

Step back from social media and learn to just enjoy your friendships at a superficial level for now.

SprinkleCake · 28/11/2024 08:11

That’s far too much petty drama to read through. I think you need to stop boring everyone around you with it.

NewFriendlyLadybird · 28/11/2024 08:13

In future:
Be friendly to everyone
NEVER gossip behind someone’s back
Don’t get involved in others’ friendships/fallings out
Scroll by anything on the chat that isn’t practical arrangements

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 08:14

Losingthetimber · 28/11/2024 07:49

Oh op. You can’t see the wood for the trees. You tried to be the mean girl bully, ostracising polly and failed. And now you’ve realised the real queen bee is kind to her and they are good friends, you see your failure writ large, and it’s pissing yoh off.

the issue here is you tried to bully and ostracise Polly out. You. Not the others, and they didn’t allow it, rightly. You were bad mouthing her and trying to get the others to exclude her.

im curious if you also behaved like this at school? Did you try to keep a close group of friends and ostracise other girls?

Not at all. I simply called out bad behaviour to Polly directly, not others. I was direct and as a result she sorted things out with Helen. That has to be a good outcome.

Do you know how hard it is to be Frank with people?

I choose not to spend my time with Polly, as do the others seemingly, bar Ava, if shes such a queen bee why don't the others follow? No one was told to freeze Polly out. Everyone makes their choice

OP posts:
InSpainTheRain · 28/11/2024 08:15

Come off rhe WhatsApp group. Stop following them in social media. Stop going over the drama in your mind and find something else to do. Concentrate on your family and DH (not surprised he sounds sick of this). Do you work or have some other way of filling your time more productively? Sorry ro be harsh but you sound deranged!

MyHangryWriter · 28/11/2024 08:15

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

pictoosh · 28/11/2024 08:18

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 07:55

Yes I definitely and naively thought we'd all be best friends and hang out together like a happy commune. Honestly.
I'm living and learning

Genuine friends do not come in a handy multi-pack. Social groups can be very tricky. There is always someone (or two) who you wouldn't be friends with if they weren't part of the multi-pack. By the same token you might well be that person to someone else.

Our differing experiences mean that we see and understand different nuances in other people...so the person you find glaringly offputting is the person who has most in common with your favourite group member. They form a bond and you feel left out in the cold.

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