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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Mum friends or frenemies? Can't get over it

171 replies

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 04:30

I am tired of speaking about this with my friends and my husband literally shouted at me for bringing this up again today. Please, if someone can tell me how I can get over this I'd be forever grateful

So, during my pregnancy I connected with around eight other mums to be, to form friendships and companionship during our upcoming mat leave.
One in particular, lets call her Ava, I thought I'd got on well with: Ava is lively, friendly and goes out of her way to help all of us. Her generosity is unmatched.

At some point into our mat leaves, some drama happened in the group where two of the girls were somewhat unkind to another. They basically accused her of knowingly bringing her sick children to a gathering where most of the babies got ill, and Ava's baby caught bronchiolitis as a result.

This girl, lets call her Helen, was mortified. She apologised profusely and swore she didn't realise her kid was ill. I believed her and took particular umbrage at how she was made to feel.

When I next saw one of the unkind girls, we can call her Polly, I didn't hide my feelings and when she asked if I was OK I was honest and told her how she'd made Helen feel. She gave a qualified apology, saying Helen is a disruptor, doesn't take advice from us when her children fall ill and maybe if she did they would be healthier. Her tone was that Helen is a neglectful mum.
Nonetheless, she messaged Helen directly and apologised which was good because they sorted things out between themselves. Good.

Now Polly is the mums I was least close to. I found her to be quite self absorbed. One of those people that talk over you and is only quiet so they can think of the next thing to say. She's also really negative, and pretty dramatic which I found draining. Id always offer to help anyway, as we all did, but it just never seemed enough.

I never spoke about Polly, about how I didn't like her, to anyone, until one day Ava and I were out together and Ava broaches the subject of the whole drama with Helen. I felt Ava was safe, so I told her about my feelings towards Polly. Ava joined in, saying how she also finds Polly negative, that her partner finds her super negative too and that when she visits, always overstays her welcome to the point that Ava feels she needs to feed her because she's there for so long.

A few weeks go by, Polly and her friend had become somewhat frozen out of the group because the others also felt they were too negative and a bit judgemental.

Then one day Ava messages saying she's very worried about Polly, how she is really remorseful about what happened, and that shes feeling isolated as if she had no friends at all. I was sceptical. Polly has 5000 friends on facebook and friends irl who help her and her family. However she insisted that Polly is vulnerable and susceptible to the influences of others and thats why she acted that way.

So the other girls and I warmed up to Polly again and thought Ava was being noble, by helping someone in a bad position.

After that, Polly and Ava seemed to have become best friends. They would often share picture of them together and their babies with the group, sometimes to things none of us had been invited to. Ava started saying things like "come to my house, ill cook for you" or "youre welcome to a playdate at mine" whenever Polly would hint she was lonely or had no plans.

There are other friendships in the group but no one else behaves this way. Things arranged between individuals are kept between them and no one fawns over their mates like this. And there are other good friendships there, that's a fact. Its gotten to a point that if Ava goes anywhere and invites the group, Polly shows herself availably immediately. I personally don't want to spend time with her and noticed the others will often not join either. I only really see them when we arrange to all meet which usually happens about once a month.

To begin with I thought how nice of Ava to help someone in need but as their PDAs carried on I started to wonder if any of what she told me was true? I began feeling as if I had been manipulated into saying how I truly felt. That maybe I had been spied on?

All I know is it makes me sick to see them be friends. Maybe I am jealous, that Polly despite her shortcomings found herself a good, true friend and I didnt?
Thing is I was genuinely OK to begin with, but as the PDAs kept coming in I found myself more and more annoyed.

The chat is on mute, and Ive not gone to recent gatherings, mainly because Ava doesnt think anything of bringing her kid out when he had just recovered from HFM (still had blisters and my baby caught it off him) or RSV and that's annoyed me anew.

Ive been told me to just leave the chat and cut ties but I feel the right thing is to continue pretending all is well , not show my feelings again, otherwise if I do then I lost the game, I am weak and pathetic.

Thank you if youve made it this way. I know you will say I just need to get over it, but believe me, Ive tried. Ive made other friends, I have my own interests, I love my life. They just annoy me and I dont know why!

AIBU and crazy and just completely insane?

OP posts:
BlastedPimples · 28/11/2024 05:36

You wish they didn't plaster it for everyone to see?

Why shouldn't they? People can do what they like. They're not committing a crime.

Are you jealous? Do you not have any good friends?

JJLA · 28/11/2024 05:36

You sound jealous of their friendship, and it’s verging on obsessive considering that your husband has had enough of you talking about it that you now come on here and post a long post about a complete non-event.

It’s very possible that Ava didn’t like Polly but once she got to know her, she did. And freezing Polly out of the group was a very shitty thing to do yet somehow you’ve managed to write a long post about how you’ve been wronged.

You need to get over it. Stop talking about it, stop thinking about it, and move on. Sounds like it’s an NCT group you’re talking about, and it’s very normal that some people find friends for life and others don’t. That didn’t happen for you, and that’s ok. So move on.

CatalinaLoo · 28/11/2024 05:38

Why do you care they are posting pictures?? Seriously this is a non-issue. Stop talking about it. Your poor husband having to listen to this juvenile nonsense.

Newnamehiwhodis · 28/11/2024 05:39

When people get on my nerves this much, I usually just take a step back for a while. You’re wise to put the chat on mute.
as for Ava- it sounds like fawning, a bit, and it doesn’t sound like she “baited” you. For her own reasons, she felt guilty and she’s being a bit over the top now, and maybe Polly is working on herself, who knows.

there was someone in my close friends group who drove me absolutely nuts like this- she was so self absorbed, and she changed the tone of our outings. I distanced, and only went to outings when I knew there were enough of the friends group present to sort of water her down… and I just learned to kind of ignore her. Then later, when I had chilled out about it a bit, I tried to view her with more compassion -

but I still didn’t subject myself to her demands (hours’ long dumping phone calls, constant mooching etc) I just had a firm “no” to her demands. Knowing that I would have a strong boundary with her somehow helped me feel less bothered when she was around - I think sometimes feeling safe that you won’t be trampled by someone helps some of that anger go away. Anger can be a boundary emotion, after all, and show us where someone has overstepped in a way that interferes with our well-being.

as for the constant pda, it might be slight jealousy. Can you have fun outings and photos of your own, and celebrate your own good times with someone too? That might alleviate the flinch every time they post their stuff … although that constant kind of sharing is a bit ick anyway …why do they need to do it? Wonder what they’re trying to prove.

Seems performance-y… and sometimes I wonder if people do it to get back at others they feel left out by.

andfinallyhereweare · 28/11/2024 05:39

I’m not sure of the issue here? Dig down what do you really feel the problem is? Two adults are friends after one person said she thought she was negative? Maybe she spent more time with her and her opinion changed? Why does it bother you? Is there a history for you of being left out? Because of the info you’ve shared nothing really happned.

853ax · 28/11/2024 05:44

I can't understand how you all have time for this during maternity leave.
Are you back to work soon ?
I would leave group entirely you do not need these 'mom friends'. Live your life as it was with your other friends and enjoy time with baby.
I even found it hard keep up with regular friends no time adding more when minding new baby.
See if there any local meet up baby group one where you just rock up lim see people & babies maybe bit chit chat often library.
Then enjoy rest of your maternity leave with your baby. Play, chat, do your Christmas shopping, sit around house day time TV ... You will never get this time again. Few years you will be rushing school & activities collecting work ... Kids demands

LouiseTopaz · 28/11/2024 05:46

If you have no interest in meeting up with them as a group, mute the group chat and there's no point confronting anyone or sharing your feelings, it would just be causing trouble for the sake of it. If you like some members of the group meet up with them 1-1 if you don't even want to do that then it seems pointless giving this headspace?

I've muted group chats before and just met up with people one on one not everything has to be as a group.

Kittylickingplate · 28/11/2024 05:48

I am sorry OP.
Mumsgroups are a funny minefield and there is nout as queer as folk.

The best bit of advice I can give you is that you can only change you, no one else. If you are unhappy move on. I am sorry your fun little group has gone tits up, I really am. I have been there.

Can you hash it over with your Mum or an Aunty, someone not connected? I get you want to talk it out to get it out of your system.

Big hugs.

Twiglets1 · 28/11/2024 05:49

leafybrew · 28/11/2024 04:52

Sorry OP - but I got bored around halfway through the post and couldn't finish reading it.

Plus I don't know what a PDA is?? [behind the times here]

It doesn't sound like you should meet up with them if you don't want your baby catching any new diseases.

But then again - when or if the baby starts nursery or preschool - watch out - cos all you get is new diseases....

PDAs are public displays of affection.

Usually between lovers but sometimes (immature) friends who want others to see how close they are.

It can be irritating but you can’t do anything about it. @BloomingOrchidea is feeling an irritation that Ava & Polly are making it so obvious that they like each other best out of everyone in the group, which can feel like excluding others from their special bond. In an ideal world everyone would be more sensitive to other’s feelings but it’s not an ideal world and Polly herself has experienced feeling excluded at times.

LiptonIcedMe · 28/11/2024 05:49

@BloomingOrchidea So, you feel shitty because Polly has that close friendship you so desperately hoped for from that group and you don’t (Jealousy).. and the catalyst for her getting that and you now feeling like she’s rubbing your nose in it was your initial back stabbing? (Regret)

You feel like you have done this to yourself. Some sort of accidental self sabotage.

NCT groups are a such a raffle of people. Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you don’t. If you stick it out it can be great as the kids start to become friends, and it’s a lovely thing that they’ve known each other since bumps. Your call only if this group is worth suffering through.

RawBloomers · 28/11/2024 05:52

You don’t want them to “plaster it” for everyone else to see…You mean their friendship? You want them to hide the fact they’re good friends? To not mention the things they do outside the group? To not engage in PDAs? (What do you mean by PDAs? That’s a term I’ve always associated with romantic relationships, so kissing, stroking, etc. It’s not something I’ve heard in relation to a regular friendship)

Why? What is wrong with them being friends? Is it disrupting the group? Are they shutting everyone else out? Are they shutting you out?

You put in a lot of back story about how you feel about Polly and why, and possibly it’s related to your issue with Polly’s friendship with Ava, but you haven’t shown a link. If you didn’t dislike Polly, if you hadn’t bad mouthed her to Ava and/or if Ava hadn’t seemed to agree with you - would their friendship bother you?

Like many others, I’m struggling to see what the problem is here other than you seemingly wanting to control other people’s relationships.

RosieLeaf · 28/11/2024 05:53

I just wish they didn't plaster it for everyone to see but I suppose it's my fault for looking.

😳

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 05:54

@sparkleshinerainbow Thanks for taking the time to respond so comprehensively. I think you made some really valid points and agree that inadvertently I made a power grab.
Thankfully in the year I've known them this was the only time I spoke about someone in the group to someone else in the same group, its definitely a bad idea.
I never meant to secure a friendship with Ava, I liked her but never made an effort with her. Polly did and, she reached out and really pursued time together so they bonded. That's great.

I'll take your advice and keep things friendly. I don't want to hang out any more but won't burn bridges.

OP posts:
stayathomer · 28/11/2024 05:55

it seemed like they grew into good friends, thst will always change the dynamics of a group but it doesn’t mean there was manipulation. And sometimes people make bad choices around children’s sickness, sure the amount of times doctors have told me my kids are free to return to school when they’re in splurging everywhere with horrific coughs etc! Op friends come and go because of changes in life, Id try and get back to real life, none of this is anything other than drama

tolerable · 28/11/2024 06:04

step outta that circle.no announcement,no drama,no bitchery just gently fade off n stay in touch with who you like.
not sprized husband is sick listening to it- shouting still a no thnkyou...

OrangeSlices998 · 28/11/2024 06:04

Group dynamics in these situations are always tricky, especially if you’re only friends because your babies are the same age and you live locally and don’t actually connect on any other level.

Focus on the women you do get on with and think you’d be friends with outside this group dynamic, often little splinter groups or friendships naturally form from a bigger group. My mum friends I made during mat leave are still friends now 3 years on and I feel really lucky we’ve been able to navigate toddlerhood together and get on outside of the baby groups and chats about weaning and birth and all the rest of it!

BloomingOrchidea · 28/11/2024 06:08

Wow so many responses THANK you everyone!

Definitely a jealous 10 year old here, if not in body definitely in mind and spirit 😊

Conclusion here is, I'll continue to keep distance as I have done so far. The chat is muted but I won't leave as a matter of principle

Thanks again all xx

OP posts:
LurkingFromTheShadows · 28/11/2024 06:12

I do not recognise all these "high school" school mum stories. And I'm glad. I couldn't be bothered dealing with this as an adult too.

AmICrazyToEvenBother · 28/11/2024 06:13

Is this a group for 14 year old mums or something?

What a load of nonsense.

freshlaundrysmell · 28/11/2024 06:13

I think when someone or something this relatively minor bothers/niggles at you this much it's a good sign that there is something in you that needs attention/dealing with.

I would ask yourself why this bothers you so much, if it's that they are posting about their friendship- why? if it makes you feel jealous or annoyed- why? and keep asking yourself why until you get to the root of it, and you will if you are able to be honest enough with yourself. Its likely this is stirring an emotion in you that has come from somewhere.

You said And it's great. I just wish they didn't plaster it for everyone to see but I suppose it's my fault for looking - why would two people gushing over each other that neither you said you particularly want to be friends with bother you so much? its not affecting you in any way so what exactly is it about this that is making you feel so annoyed?

That is the real issue here, not two people you dont seem to like that much anyway being friends. It's worth addressing within yourself because if you dont, it will keep on repeating the pattern until you do take notice. Jung once said "Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate".

I dont think this is about them at all, I think this is something being triggered in you and thats why you cannot seem to let it go.

Guest100 · 28/11/2024 06:14

I feel for you, I often find myself in the same sort of situation. I have friends, but the friends all coupled up into best friends. And while I have an amazing friend group I do still feel a bit shit to see all the best friend catch ups on social media. In my experience I am to blame. I can be a bit lazy in contacting friends, and it takes me a while to be myself.

I think as much as it hurts you need to see this group as more of a playgroup than a group of close friends.

Dont follow them on social media. You will find this makes a big difference to your mental health.

I don’t think there is anything wrong with catching up with them, but I really think you need to branch out and meet other people. Join lots of baby activities like playgroup, kindergym all that stuff. You may still feel like the single person in the room of couples, but you never know when you will find your place.

It’s very important that you don’t mix the old group of friends with the new. Find baby groups in areas the others don’t go to. Otherwise you risk the same thing happening again. Don’t isolate yourself, parenting can be a very lonely time. Once you find a new group ditch the old one. They sound a bit toxic. And don’t get dragged into being best friends with one of them when they inevitably fall out with the group, because you will just get ignored when they make up.

Your husband doesn’t understand and probably just got sick of you venting. His life hasn’t changed like yours has. DHS tend to feel like your life is all roses because you get to stay home, so he isn’t the person to talk to.

1smallhamsterfoot · 28/11/2024 06:19

Do you fancy Ava or something? Refering to PDAs and acting like it's an ex?

Oreyt · 28/11/2024 06:22

@Kittylickingplate

nout as queer as folk.

You're not from Yorkshire are you? 😂😂

GiraffesAtThePark · 28/11/2024 06:22

I thought this was going to end with Ava turning on you and freezing you out the group but no - it seems she just became friends with someone you both seemed not to like at one point.

People can be like that. Not like someone and then suddenly things have changed for them and they like them now. It can be confusing and annoying but it’s life.

You being this obsessed speaks to issues with you. You just need to accept this is how it is and just ignore them. Go hang out with other friends or baby groups.

Aberentian · 28/11/2024 06:23

I think some part of your subconscious is worried by the fact that this group dynamic is weird and childish and is trying to worry at it and work it all out. you say you have other friends so it's not like you're lonely and need them. I don't think you'll ever get it all worked out OP, it sounds like fourteen year olds, I would just stop speaking to all of them. Where there is good faith friendships are not like this.

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