My mum is the biggest conflict in my life-i dont know where to go from here

[Helpmeout99]

Where to start? I am in my mid 40s with a good job, 3 fantastic children and a husband I have been with since my teens who is my best friend and loves me to bits. We have a good life and great relationship and I feel blessed for that.
Now to the issue… my Mum. My Mum is a very intelligent woman who can be very nice and to all outsiders would seem lovely but she has always been a very controlling and critical woman behind closed doors and has had many bust ups with myself and older brother over the years. She used to write us awful letters when we displeased her, my husband recently found some and burned them as he didnt want me to re read them. It always follows the same pattern of her being nice, helpful with the children etc then if we dare to disagree with her on anything she will blow up, it is always nasty comments that she knows will cause the most hurt. My brother has little to do with her and we both suspect she has a personality disorder- namely victim narcissistic disorder. She will never ever accept she does any wrong, gaslights constantly and fires about how we could treat her so badly! In the past this has led to me always apologising just to make things right and as a result i am an anxious people pleaser. She will the accept apology and be overly lovely- trying to buy affection with money, of which she has plenty.
my dad passed away a long time ago and although he loved her very much i suspect he was aware that she had issues as he was the only one who could stop her when she was at her most vicious. My brother and I both got an inheritance from my dad and this is frequently used against us … ie it paid for the extension and all she has done for us etc etc.
in recent years I have tried many times to talk to my mum as an adult about this behaviour but she completely denies it or accuses me of hating her and constantly bringing up the past, I do bring up things she has said as they hurt so much but she will never apologise and always puts herself in victim mode. She is currently staying in our spare room while waiting to move, brother refused to have her, and things are awful. She criticises everything and makes out she doesn’t and has no problems being vile to me when I end up getting frustrated and snapping. She ensure to only be like this when im alone with her, infront of my husband she is all sweetness and light. It came tp a head last week and my husband made everyone a cuppa and spoke to her about how her “fun comments” as she calls them affect me. He told her to stop with the nasty comments but she just repeated as always how difficult i am and how he must find the same and she feels sorry for him living with me! This did not go down well and that was her aim. My children are all aware of how manipulative she is- everything is a competition to her about why she is the best but also the most hard done by.
i currently feel uncomfortable in my own home and am counting down the days to her leaving.
I want to have a relationship with her as I love the nice side of her but the other side reduces me to a wreck. Everyone things she is wonderful and will tell me how lucky I am to have such a lovely Mum. How do I navigate this relationship?
I have already decided minimum contact once she is gone but It hurts my heart when I hear her tell my Uncle and her friends how awful and difficult I am and how badly I treat her when all she tries to do it help. All I want is a normal relationship like the wonderful one I have with my children. I could never contemplate treating them like this.
where do I go from here and how do I stop her getting under my skin the way she does? She is Jekyl and Hyde and I am constantly trying to navigate this very unstable and unhealthy relationship.
sorry for the long post but I could provide examples of behaviours that go one for days.

Bloody hell.

Please believe me when I say that you DO NOT have to tolerate this sort of abuse from ANYONE, no matter who they are. Tell her that you have had enough of her attitude towards you, she is no longer welcome in your home, and she will have to stay in a hotel instead. As of today.

Have you ever wondered why your father made sure that you and your sibling received your inheritance directly, rather than leaving his whole estate to your mother, so that you would both inherit it all on her passing? He knew. He knew what she's like, and he made sure you both got his bequests direct, so she couldn't hold it over you and blackmail you with the threat of her cutting you out of her will.

She does not deserve you. She does not deserve any kind of relationship with her adult children. Her behaviour is disgraceful.

Kick her out of your house, and let your DH back you up.

I’m not being mean but what do you actually need her for? What does she bring to your life?

From what you say, not a lot. You’ve got a good husband, lovely children, and a brother you get on with, so why let your mother’s unpleasantness override all that?

Stop expecting her to turn into the person you want her to be, it’s never going to happen. However nice you are, she just can’t be. It’s not you, it’s her. Get her out of your house and aim for a superficial relationship with her. Don’t argue with her. Don’t enter into discussions with her. Don’t tell her anything about your life that she can have an opinion on. Start cultivating a very thick skin.

It won’t be easy but it will be worth it.

Why is your mother so deeply emotionally insecure that she has to bully you to make herself feel better?

You need to pity her and detach. People like this are preschoolers in their maturity. They expect you to fix their anxieties and problems and they emotionally dump. If you realise she is 3-5 years old in her head and pity her for it, that could help if you can’t get her out of the house. When she has a toddler tantrum that is all it is. Leave her to do it until she calms down.

She sounds like my dad - and I'm in a very similar position to you. Really recommend reading Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents. Incredible book that explains a lot! Think I highlighted nearly all of it!

This sounds just like my mother. She’s been diagnosed with borderline personality disorder. Low contact is the only way I can maintain a relationship with her and maintain my own mental health. She used to be very co dependant I would have to talk to her daily otherwise she would get upset and feel abandoned but since having children myself it’s now just seeing her once a week. She lives close and compared to previously this is low contact for me. She didn’t like it at first and still often likes to have a pitty party about not being so involved in my life but you have to have strong boundaries with mothers like this. They are forever the victims and that will never change so once she leaves just slowly start limiting contact to whatever you are comfortable with.

She sounds very similar to my mother (not the letters but constant amazement that DH puts up with me etc etc)& I can't deal with going on holiday together I have no idea how you've coped with her in your house for 5 months.

The only thing that works for me is to keep contact to twice a month in a neutral location with at least 2 of my kids (either home occasionally but not regularly). IME she behaves better if I see her less. Typically she gets better over time & I fall into a mistaken belief that's it's all in my head/she's fine then see her a bit more often & wham she destroys me.

she is the kindest most considerate friend imaginable & everyone thinks she's wonderful. She's sweetness & light to my DH but after years of him thinking I was just over sensitive she started using text...

You need to get her out of your house that should be somewhere you can relax 💐

Time for her to go to a hotel or Airbnb - immediately. She does not get to act like this in your home. People may or not see what is happening with her - you may be surprised at how much others see. But whatever it is, there needs to be no tolerance for what she is doing. You have told you it upsets you. And she has seen fit to ignore that. You dont need any further information than that.

How do you navigate this relationship?

If it were me, I'd stay as far away from her as possible. She's poison.

@Morwenscapacioussleeves ”Typically she gets better over time & I fall into a mistaken belief that's it's all in my head/she's fine then see her a bit more often & wham she destroys me”

This is exactly my experience! She behaves herself the less I see her. I then fall into a false sense of security and start thinking she isn’t so bad. Then contact increases and bam huge arguments with the most viscous and vile things said to me. Hoping to move further away so can limit contact even more.

Its so hard because when beomg nice she would do anything to help us and says how much she loves having the children and they are her world but then she will be cruel and spiteful to me and make it seem like it is all my fault- to say it messes with my head is an understatement. She will also say things like “your dad always said how difficult and stroppy you were” when my dad is not hear to say otherwise. I loved him so much and I always thought our relationship was good but she tries to make me think otherwise, it is incredibly cruel.

If it helps I have my mother restricted to one day a week & we are busy every second week on that day (not really - we were for a short period of time & I stuck with it). If she/we are sick/on holiday/unavailable for whatever reason we DO NOT RESCHEDULE just keep the once a fortnight date.

she pushed back constantly at first & lots of comments about how cruel I was to keep her grandchildren from her etc but she's finally mostly given up

my life is so much better for it (during covid lockdown I realised how happy I was to be unable to see her - not far away but over Sturgeon's bonkers council boundary rules)

it doesn't always work & I had to stop seeing her at all for a couple of months early this year when she went utterly rogue & made horrible comments 😩

She is abusive. Abusive people are not nice - the nice face they put on is a mask. You have to let go of hoping she will be that nice person for real and accept that the nasty her is the real her. As for telling you about other people - that is what abusers do. She is trying to keep you hooked in so she has access to you in order to abuse you.

She will be cruel to your children in time. Protect them, if not yourself. Low contact, neutral places only, structured time, you leave immediately if she starts with the comments. And she needs to be out of your house now. She does not get the behave like this and stay with you.

I could have written this post. It doesn’t get better. Cut contact as much as you can and save yourself. She will never ever change.

If im honest I feel bad for the help she has given over the years with babysitting, and its odd because I know say if my boiler went and I couldn’t afford to fix it she would help. The reality is she likes to have a hold over me in some way and there is no such thing a no strings attached in her book. She sees me as an extension of herself in some way.
I know no that she is very manipulative but I have fallen for it in the past, now I see how unsafe this relationship is I am grieving for the mum I thought she was. She would tell me other mums dont love as much as she does and i believed it and felt i must deserve her wrath and awful words as after I used to apologise for my perceived wrong doing she would comfort and tell me she loved me. As I write this I aware how messed up it is!!

Exactly this, the logical part of me knows she will never change…
I am so sorry you too have experienced this x

This 100% is absolutely spot on!

Im so sorry you have been through this too x

Narcissistic parents often see their own adult children as an extension of them when infact the adult child is or should be totally separate from said parent. Any and all help she gives you is loaded with obligation and guilt attached; its not help at all.

Part of the healing process is grieving for the relationship you should have had rather than the one you actually got.

re your comment in quote marks:
"Its so hard because when beomg nice she would do anything to help us and says how much she loves having the children and they are her world but then she will be cruel and spiteful to me and make it seem like it is all my fault- to say it messes with my head is an understatement".

This is precisely what abusive parents do; make all help conditional. She is not nice to your kids precisely because she is not nice to you; she was a terrible example of a parent to you and she is now a terrible example of a grandparent to your children. Women like this cannot do relationships at all. Giving you spaghetti head is par for the course when it comes to abusive parents.

"She will also say things like “your dad always said how difficult and stroppy you were” when my dad is not hear to say otherwise".

She is outright lying about your dad; I daresay he never said such things at all. You probably remind her of him; a man she always hated.

You all need to stay well away from her. She outstayed her welcome in your home the day she arrived in it. She absolutely needs to go now from your home never to return, you have to get her out and keep her out too.

I am reading a book called 'Stop Walking on Eggshells' - it's about navigating a relationship with someone with Borderline Personality Disorder (which I think my MIL may have - certainly she is very difficult and exhibits a lot of the symptoms of BPD). I think you might find it helpful as it sounds like your mum is similar - possibly worse! If I had my choice, I would just cut off contact with MIL but DH isn't ready to do that so I'm hoping that both of us can get some tips on setting boundaries with this book. It's easy for people on here to say 'She's abusive, cut her off' but actually it's not always that simple and often there is SOME good in the relationship. In our case, despite how awful MIL can be, and how difficult we find it to be with her, she is actually the one who suffers the most as her behaviour stems from her own unhappiness, and DH is not willing to cause her the genuine suffering that us cutting her off would create. So we stay in touch and are just trying to manage it a bit better.

I won't advise you to kick her out or on how to deal with her, as only you can really work out what to do. I will say though there is next to no chance that your Dad ever said any such thing about you. She is projecting how difficult SHE is onto you and saying that to make herself feel OK. It's not even about you. You're doing so well to be in a happy supportive relationship with your DH given that she raised you, and to be a functioning adult who KNOWS that you don't deserve this treatment, that's a really hard thing to achieve when you've had this kind of upbringing. You absolutely can find a way to detach and be happier, I'm sure of it, though it won't be easy.

You need to follow the grey rock method.

It worked perfectly with fil. Basically we became uninteresting to him because there was no drama to be found in is.

Oh OP, I do feel for you. Having a difficult relationship with a parent carries so many emotions, often the biggest being guilt. Until I went no contact with my dad, I would assume that our difficult relationship was due to my failings and it's only since becoming older and wiser, that I realise these are his failings not mine. You've already said the truest thing - would you ever treat your children the same way? No. That tells you everything you need to know.

So, for now, you have a couple of options about what you do right now, as her being in your house, making you feel terrible isn't sustainable. The biggie is that you ask her to leave, but I totally understand why that will feel hug and you may feel it's not doable. Firstly, do you think you could say that it feels a little claustrophobic and could she hire an AirBnb for the last month? If this is a big no, which I understand, are there any family or friends she could visit or stay with to give you some respite? If she's the one saying she doesn't feel welcome - use that as a reason for her to leave, as she can barely argue with the things she's said herself. Except, of course, I know she will...

If her cutting her stay short isn't possible, what can you do to protect yourself and your time so you're away from her? Are you out at work during the day? Are there particular times she tends to be around the most? If so, how can you be elsewhere and away from her nasty words? Can you, DH and your lovely kids be busy in the evenings and weekends? Meals out? A trip to the cinema (especially on two for one nights!)? Visit friends? Swimming? Do your kids do activities that you can stay out at, and grab food afterwards? Even an evening walk to the park with a bag of chips will get you out of the house. Can you pick a city and visit each weekend so you're out of her way? I fully appreciate you shouldn't have to, but at least you won't be a sitting duck waiting for her next jibe or sly comment.

Well done to your lovely husband for seeing exactly what she's up to and holding her to account. If all else fails, just keep doing the same, again and again and again, and she may tire of it. Please know you're not alone, and that you don't deserve this. Sending love x

Stop trying. Let her go in your head. Keep contact to a minimum. There is no cure for narcissism.

This is what I have done.

OP this sounds unbearably difficult. I am adding my voice to the chorus to say that this relationship is absolutely not your fault.

If kicking her out is not an option I suggest you get yourself some therapy ASAP. Start to unravel how this has affected your life and what beliefs you may have about parent child relationships. Also, there are many books out there about children of narcissistic parents..
good luck.

Echoing what all others have said. Get her out your home. Like today!

Go no or very low contact. What low contact looks like for me is weekly messages or brief calls. we discuss the weather, and dms friends (and their collect ailments or family issues). That’s it. She gets no real information about my life. If she asks, oh we’re just busy, this and that type of answers. No opportunity to comment or have an opinion on anything.

you don’t owe her anything. Her previous help is not something you need to repay to her especially if she treats you this way. stop letting her rile you. Stop engaging in a way in which she can upset you.

You sound like a really lovely person. You’ve said you want to have a relationship with her as you love the nice side of her. I think you need to accept that the ‘nice side’ is as destructive to you as the other aspect of her. It keeps you hoping that you can have a normal mother-daughter relationship, it keeps you apologising for things that aren’t your fault. You’ve said that she switches on the extra nice when you’ve apologised - it’s because she’s gotten her way. Both ‘sides’ are part of the narcissistic whole.

You are never going to have a normal relationship with her because she’s just not capable of having one. It doesn’t matter what you do, you can’t fix it. It’s sad but accepting that and even allowing yourself to mourn the loss of the mother-daughter relationship you wanted is only going to make you stronger.