Married to someone with Asperger's/ASD/ND: support thread 12

[Daftasabroom]

New thread.

This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.

It's complicated and it's emotional.

The old thread is here.

Hi @CinnamonTart I have a dh like yours. It took me such a long time to realise that, as you say, i was talking into thin air. Any attempt at a conversation was met with him unable to take his eyes off his phone/tablet/tv for more than a few seconds and a yes, no or mmm answer. Him literally getting up and walking away was the killer.
I gave up in the end as it was obvious he just wasn't interested in anything I had to say. I stopped talking into the void, a conscious decision about 2/3 years ago. If I have information to share or a practical matter that needs to be relayed i talk to him, other than that we don't talk. He will 'tell' me about his job, which only requires me to listen, but other than the basics we don't talk to each other. Dh did not change, he very rarely/never asks about me or the kids (teens). He never initiates a conversation, just relays information if needed. I actually dont think he has noticed that i stopped talking. 😳

I've stopped talking too.
Last night dh got angry with me because i hadn't told him I changed a email to an account he wants to access. I did it months ago, but he never listens.

@CinnamonTart i have too.

But not as a way to ‘make him see’. I’ve tried various ways of doing that before and it doesn’t work. This is who he is. He either can’t or can’t be bothered to.

Plus he doesn’t see the double standards.
eg he grumbles about the dcs not saying anything about what they are up to. But he never says anything about what he is doing himself (like he can’t be bothered to tell me if he’ll be at home at the WE).
And he doesn’t make the effort to stay in touch with them regularly.

But I have stopped because I have enough to be speaking to a wall.
I simply have enough and can’t be bothered to make the effort to have some sort of pretence of a relationship.
It’s just another sign that the marriage is dead, on my side at least.

@HowIrresponsible so he can appreciate how it feels to be treated that way and then hopefully take on board when I say how it makes me feel and that it isn’t a sustainable way to live.

@Ohdostopwafflinggeremy @unlikelychump and @SpecialMangeTout I’m really sorry to hear it’s for you too - it’s good to know I’m not alone though. Perhaps we’re all deadly dull to listen to 😀

@CinnamonTart @SpecialMangeTout
Count me in this too .

My DH comes in from work and doesn't shout hello just merges into a chair to check his phone . I respect he needs down time, he works hard . I have a meal ready if hes confirmed he's coming home to eat as I'm not cooking and chucking anymore meals away because he's decided to eat out after work . After eating in silence he will put a movie on and that's it for the night .

On Thursday evening I was packing to take our 2 Dd on a trip next day . I dared to ask him to find me a travel towel that he'd borrowed and not put back . He said he would , I asked him again an hour later , or tell me where to look : which bag . Again "no I'll get it later ", while drinking beer . I knew he would fall asleep . So I asked when the film finished , he started storming around , found it in 2 minutes and threw it at me . I thanked him and left him alone .

Our eldest Dd aged 16 was working and we agreed that we would pick her up at 11 because I don't want her walking back past pubs on her own , he left at 10:30 , despite the rain earlier he walked to pick her up . At 11 I got a call from another number , our Dd calling because her phone was dead and nobody there to pick her up . He'd walked up and sent a message for her to meet him across the road in the pub but her phone was dead . So she started walking home . I met her en route , it's a 10 minute walk but a girl was beaten and raped last year behind the shops my Dd walked past .

He followed half an hour later , according to him she was at fault for letting her phone die, she was lazy ( she is not ) she was going to have her phone removed.

I said I thought it would have been better if he had just gone and picked her up from where she was expecting

A massive argument ensued because I argued against his actions going to pub instead of meeting her at agreed place . and we haven't spoken since Thursday night !

Tonight it's a family bbq at my cousins
I've told him I don't want him to come after the way he blamed our daughter and behaved towards me . I don't want the drama .

Hypocrisy is a MASSIVE problem in our house. It’s the single thing which drives me insane more than anything else. How can someone criticise people for x and yet be completely unaware of themselves doing this more than the person they’re criticising!

I have pondered this a lot! And I think there are several factors at play: lack of self awareness, an element of delusion and a good deal of projection.

First the lack of awareness. They just don’t see what we see. They don’t see fault in themselves and don’t spend a lot of time questioning or examining their own behaviour.

Second is the delusion factor. Eg. my DP criticises ME for always having the last word. And yet I am very careful not to do this. In fact it is HIM who cannot stop himself from having the last word. And I’ve wondered how can he not realise he’s doing it? He is so critical of me and yet has zero awareness he himself is the one doing it!

I think perhaps in his head, and I suspect in your DH’s, the thing they criticise isn’t what they think they’re doing. So you can see DH is being a rubbish conversationalist. He doesn’t ask anything or show any interest when you speak. And I can see my DP has to have the last word. But to them what they’re doing has a different justification. So your DH isn’t showing a lack of interest, in the way he criticises others for, he simply isn’t responding to questions. Because there were none to respond to. I can see and you can see that the flow of conversation isn’t just sitting there waiting for a question and then responding. That it involves an amount of “oh really? Did you?.. Then what happened?…..I see” etc. but to him, he simply isn’t responding to questions. And that’s different to not showing an interest or not asking about someone’s day. You and I know they’re part of the same thing. But he has made a distinction and is therefore deluding himself to en extent that what he does is different to what he dislikes in others.

Same with my DP. When he has the last word he is simply expressing his view at the end of a conversation to finish it off, having silenced me with his “well we shall agree to disagree then” Me: “ok that’s fine”
DP: “all I’m saying is bla bla bla” .
Me: “I thought we were agreeing to disagree?”
DP: “we are! I’m just saying bla bla bla”
Me: “but you’re not agreeing to disagree! You’re shutting me up so you can have the last word as you always do!”
DP: “you just have to have the last word don’t you?”
Me: “me?”
DP: “always the same!!!”
Me: “no, I am pointing out that you couldn’t leave the conversation without having the last word! It’s you who was having the last word”

Although I can see that saying “agree to disagree” and then immediately following it up with “all I’m saying is….” is precisely him having the last word. But he can’t see it. To him he is just expressing his view at the end of the conversation and somehow this is different to having the last word.

I think there is also an amount of projection going on as well. I know from my experience my autistic DP finds any form of perceived criticism utterly intolerable. Even the thought that he might potentially be criticised, so he projects onto others as a preemptive defence strategy.

Do I think there is any merit in you giving him a taste of his own medicine? Honestly no. My gut feeling is he won’t see it that way. When HE shows a lack of interest this is just him not responding to a question, but when YOU do it, you’re being deliberately unkind and not taking any interest in him. I suspect he would be unlikely to draw a parallel. (See: lack of awareness + delusion).

Awful behaviour. Very typical. Not being able to acknowledge he made a mistake (changed the arrangement). He is blaming someone else (your DD) for his mistake. And he has reacted angrily to someone else pointing out his error (the dreaded criticism which can never ever be due!!!). And has had a complete over reaction (threatening to take away your DD’s phone!). And is now doing the silent treatment (emotional shut down as he feels criticised and blamed and instead of saying sorry there will just be avoidance).

Textbook pattern of behaviour in our house too.

Sending hugs! 🤗

there is one good thing about not engaging is that our clashes are much reduced.
Im not asking anything from him. Less demands means less issues.

It’s just not a partnership. Or at least not how I consider a partnership and a marriage.
Im not sure he sees that.
Or maybe he does which is why he is always nicer/more communicative when one of the dcs is around.

(Note: only able to do that now because the dcs are at Uni)

@SpecialMangeTout yes I can relate to all you’ve said. The question I have is why am I querying whether I’m good enough for him? And what will happen when our kids leave home and it’s just us?
Will he then announce it’s time to split as I no longer serve any purpose?

The question I have now isn’t ’am I good enough for him?’
But rather ‘is he good enough for me?’

And what does he bring to my life?
The more it goes, esp now that the dcs have both left home, the more it feels he doesn’t ’serve any purposes/doesn’t meet my needs.
Ive changed. I’ve matured. The dcs have left. And it feels like our lives are further and further apart.

@SpecialMangeTout you’re absolutely right. And taking that perspective, I think I will try calling him on everything and see how that goes.

I haven’t - because any reasonable person would know how aggressive and argumentative that would be and so we take the hit to protect them. But I can’t take any more and maybe me saying something each time (kindly - I hope!) will make him think ...

These messages are so supportive to read , knowing I'm not alone .

I posted about my anger at my dh changing plans and blaming others and drinking . After our argument on Thursday I have been busy with activities with one child and he's with other . I told him I didn't want him coming to my families bbq and showboating after I few drinks and that as he took holidays alone I also expected to have my time alone without the stress of his unpredictable behaviour .
This morning he's subdued and has made a full breakfast . I'm taking our eldest to a garden party and he's staying at home with our youngest . No argument and no fuss , he also picked our eldest up from work last night as arranged. Maybe there is hope .

@upto10andbackagain I’m so sorry you’re going through this too.

‘Maybe there is hope .’

... just for a while. Until you’re the enemy again.

Im not asking anything from him. Less demands means less issues

This. Our eldest spent four nights in hospital recently and me and H got on really well then. It was actually nice. No demands. Just hanging out in the hospital, with nothing to do. .

Back home and the demands and expectations of running a house and family, the demands of planning and cooperation, and him being able to parent his own children, all this is too much for him and the rows start up again.

Awful behaviour. Very typical. Not being able to acknowledge he made a mistake (changed the arrangement). He is blaming someone else (your DD) for his mistake. And he has reacted angrily to someone else pointing out his error (the dreaded criticism which can never ever be due!!!). And has had a complete over reaction (threatening to take away your DD’s phone!)

All of this. The inability to admit fault and the blaming of others for his mistakes.

It really, really upsets me how H cannot ever apologise to the kids. When he does if pushed, but its an angry, resentful, shouted out 'Sorry!' that he clearly does not mean. Not only does he not apologise but he blames them. Its horrible.

I’m struggling today. I’ve made the decision that I can’t carry on and we’ve had the discussion to separate.

I now question. Is it that bad? Does it matter if we don’t have any emotional connection? Can I live like this for the next 20 or 30 years?

Why is this so hard?

Even harder when the emotional connection isn’t there. I guess that’s all I am ever looking for. The more I read into Alexithymia, the more I realise it will never be there. Emotional blindness even in the face of separation.

I need to be brave and take the next step.

@ANiceLittleHouseByTheSea This is so hard. But you have to crawl out if the brambles to see the sunny uplands! If you make this decision you have a chance at living for yourself, attending to your own life. If you don’t then nothing will change and it doesn’t sound like status quo can long endure.

Hi there, I've posted on the thread under other names but back now with a name change!

I'm 9 months post-separation from my husband who has dx autism. We co-parent well, it is an amicable split.

I am realising, however, that I have been deeply affected by his physical rejection of me and that this has now solidified into intense low self esteem and feeling that no man would ever want to touch me :(

STBXH was extremely touch sensitive and would visibly flinch at any kind of physical affection, quite often would physically brush or flick me away (he came round yesterday and I watched him doing this to our family dog, who was pleased to see him and was just confronted with this visual of what me being rejected over and over again physically must have looked like).

I just wondered if anyone else had experienced this and can relate to how it affected them? I don't really see how I can ever date again now that I have this internalised sense of being the most hideous thing that ever walked the planet (apart from when I was briefly his special interest, of course, then he was very happy to touch and be touched by me).

Thank you@pikkumyy77 . I am going to write that in my journal as a message to myself.

This thread is a lifeline.

To outsiders, everything looks fine. He’s not unkind (I know that I am very lucky) but the lack of connection and empathy slowly destroys. Drips away…

Sending love and strength to everyone here.

@tickabillia ohhhh I have this same issue. I’m so so sorry that you do too. I can’t help but just wanted to say you’re not alone.

Why is it Autistic Man (my DP but maybe other DPs as well?) react so badly to being asked why they’ve done something? I mean, I know the answer really.

I am coming from the point of view of ‘that’s unusual. Why have you done that?’ out of interest. But he ALWAYS sees it as criticism.

This morning I go downstairs. There’s a packed lunchbox on the worktop. Kids have broken up from school so it’s an unusual thing to see. I say “there’s a lunchbox”. He slightly irritably says “yes. DD is out at an activity today”.

Then I notice another packed lunchbox and wonder if maybe her DB is going as well.

me: oh, here’s another lunchbox!
dp: yes!
me: why are there two?
dp: (annoyed) can we not??!
me: (confused) not what? I don’t know what you mean.
dp: Can you not go on about it?
me: I wasn’t. I just wondered why there were two lunchboxes…..
dp: (snaps angrily) one is for cold food and one is for hot food, ok!!!??!!
me: ok. I don’t know why that annoyed you so much
dp: because you’re questioning me
me: I was just interested why there were two lunchboxes out…..
dp: it’s the way you do it, your tone of voice and the look on your face!

If this were the other way round and I had two lunchboxes prepared and someone asked why I had two ready, it wouldn’t even occur to me to feel annoyed at being asked. Isn’t this just normal married chit chat?

I know what the issue is. His DD is overweight. He’s had a letter from the NHS about her weight. The diet he feeds her is awful! It’s baked goods and chocolate and white bread with butter and jam and mountains of pasta. He thinks the odd piece of fruit he throws in makes it healthy. She eats double what my DD eats and they’re the same age. I spoke to him a couple of times about it months and months ago as I was getting a bit worried about her weight. He acknowledges the issue and said he would start trying to make her diet more healthy. But he didn’t do anything about it. Carried on treating her to pancakes and clotted cream teas ever few days. He likes to treat her like his princess and give her things that “make her happy”. I stopped mentioning it as what was the point? I haven’t said anything for months. He knows she’s overweight. He’s had a letter about it. He’s had to buy her a new wardrobe full of clothes. I know me asking about two lunchboxes he has taken as “criticism” that he’s feeding her too much. He is sensitive to this as he knows he’s doing it so is on his high alert for someone else to notice it and criticise him.

To me, I was just asking why there were two lunchboxes. It was an innocent question and nothing meant by it. To him, he’s constantly on the lookout for criticism. Everything I say must potentially be criticism. So he barks his angry retort at me, and then blames me for the way I asked, the look on my face (there was no look!) and the tone of my voice (no tone!). But nothing can be his fault.

This only cements my view that it isn’t tolerable to live like this. Another nail in the proverbial….

Thank you so much for your understanding! I'm sorry you're going through it too.

This isn’t an issue for me but it sounds really shit and I can well imagine how it must make you feel. Nothing to be said that can make you feel any better really. His issue 100% but I know that won’t help you feel less crappy. Xx

I promise you aren't hideous. After ending my marriage it took a while to 'unlearn' all of the expected behaviours to make my marriage work including convincing myself that my personality and body would not be desirable to anyone else. Guess what....couldn't of been further from the truth ;) How I got here was a lot of work finding me again, taking time to myself, including lots of self care. I bought some nice underwear that I felt good in - then really looked at myself in the mirror. The good bits I inwardly noted (I've got a cracking rack lol). Yes I've got wobbly bits but everyone does. It's not big headed to feel good about yourself. Its not vain to notice when your hair is behaving. It's not bad when you feel good full stop.

When I started dating, I did it for fun. If it wasn't fun, then I didn't do it. This included enjoying the anticipation of meeting new people (even if they weren't right for me after the date), getting butterflies again. Take things slow. Oh and lastly, you will unlearn this, but first say it out loud to yourself - I am worthy of love. I am worthy of joy. It sounds like BS, and it feels strange but I promise you'll get there.

What lovely advice. And well done for finding yourself again ☺️