Husband depressed after birth of our second child ten weeks ago, says I make him want to kill himself

[AmberMoose]

My husband is depressed, regrets our baby and told me that I make him want to kill himself. I don't know what to do.

First time posting. Not sure what I'm looking for exactly, perhaps some outsider perspective. My husband (41) and I (38) had our second baby 10 weeks ago. We also have a six year old daughter. Conceiving our second was fraught; I really wanted another baby, he was hot and cold. Two miscarriages, two years of trying etc...

Second baby is significantly harder than our first - lots of crying, up 1000 times at night etc - and my husband is not coping. He has checked out and I feel like I am solo parenting our baby. He says he is depressed (post partum depression perhaps?) and is having a major existential crisis. He is so unhappy with our -admittedly, charmed - life and feels like I've been calling the shots over our ten year relationship.

He's recently gotten really into DJing and one of his main complaints is that he is now a servant to our family and has no time for himself. I've been doing all I can to ensure he has free time - I took both kids out of the house when the baby was just a couple of weeks old to give him space when I was still sore and recovering and just wanted to be on the couch. He has taken several trips away to do various things related to his music, I have looked after the kids without complaint, I ask about how he's feeling, listen to him complain (about me and our life), take on additional life admin tasks to take them off his plate... All things he has expressed in the past make him feel loved and cared for.

Two nights ago when I got home after four days away (with both kids to give him space and free time) he says that the key to him feeling better is that he needs to better compartmentalise all his responsibilities and ensure he has enough time for all of them - i.e., more time. For him to have more free time, I need to exchange mine and I feel I have nomore.to give. I am feeling so much resentment towards him. I have been out of the house only twice by myself; I barely have had enough alone time to blow dry my hair over the past two and a half months. I have never asked for help ( I did once and it sent him on a spiral); not even in the middle of the night when I am so exhausted I feel I am about to crack. Never once have i handed him the baby and bottle and begged for an extra hour of sleep. The few times I have told him how hard it is he has essentially told me that ive gotten what I wanted (a baby) and to suck it up. He takes the baby every now and then for like ten minutes, baby cries, husband is like "urgh, no thank you! This baby is hard work!", never once stopping to reflect on what it's like for me during the other 23h and 50 minutes of the day.

He has said once before that he is becoming suicidal. Last night he raised it again and said .. this is a quote " you are making me want to kill myself". I want to say it's the depression talking and I am trying to be compassionate but I am also furious and trying hard not to be. The worst part is that he's not the first person to say that to me, my mum said something similar when I was like 10 (she had significant trauma that was never dealt with I now know and is generally not ok). This morning he hugged me and said he felt like there was a weight of, I hugged him back and we cried but I am left feeling like total shit - a truly horrible person that makes people want to kill themselves.

I am bouncing from rage to guilt to deep shame and I don't know what to do.

Im sorry but i agree with most of the other posters! How do u make him want to kill himself? Oh by trying to be a loving partner and doing everything for your children? By trying to help him ?!oh fuck off ! This is abuse he clearly doesn't want a family and ties and wants to run about galavanting his life having space and time and living his best life djing were does he consider u in any aspect of life or u kids for that matter ! And letting u do everything and still wants more! Selfish twat! What a horrible man he sounds how dare he blame u for being a coward and not just saying it how it is! Please put YOU first your worth so much more !

I know it seems to make sense that a psychologist could work on his own mental health the way a mechanic might work on his own car. But it's more akin to a brain surgeon operating on his own head. He doesn't have the perspective to really see everything he needs to.

Having some self care tools is great for general mood. But I wouldn't mess around with apparent suicidal ideation.

Psychologists and therapists need to have therapy from more experienced professionals than the average lay person, not less experienced or DIY. They have the language, knowledge and experience to bullshit themselves and their therapist more.

The good news is that you don't have to figure out whether he's genuinely suicidal or a manipulative bastard (the two aren't mutually exclusive anyway). You just refer him to professional help and more generally to his close friends and family for support.

And you do what you need to to keep you and your kids safe and well. I'm glad you've been able to talk to a friend about this and I hope you can get some practical support around you. It's tough, I've talked up thread about my husband who became depressed after our second child was born (though the pregnancy was much longed for by both of us) and though in his case it was absolutely genuine, it was still hard to not have the support from him when our youngest was small, and especially before I knew he was suicidal, it was hard to ask other people for help with the things he ought to have been helping you with.

You need practical and emotional support and it isn't going to come from him.

So, he’s checked out of being a dad. He needs to grow up.
hope you get some support

My husband had depression after our daughter was born, to the point of being suicidal; he had horrendous migraines to deal with on top of baby. He struggled and missed his old life. I took over most things for several months and mostly felt compassion but also exhaustion and resentment. BUT 1) he was ill and depressed but wanted to get better, he went for therapy and got a lot better after a few sessions; he was grateful for the time to rest I was giving him and actually rested rather than going away with mates for some music; 2) even when he felt shit, he was doing his best to help me - whatever he was able to do, and was incredibly grateful for me stepping up. As soon as he got better, he started doing his proper share.

Your husband sounds like a twat rather than a genuine depression, I’m sorry. You need to find support elsewhere. Family if available. Nanny - the least he can do is give you some nanny hours if he isn’t prepared to parent himself.

Absolutely agreed 👏 👏 👏

Hi OP,

I can relate to some of what you are saying and the following might not relate to you but it opened my eyes after a friend sent it to me. It’s from Lundy Bancroft - Why does he do that? I find it a bit over simplified and it’s quite blaming in an unhelpful way, I think, but I’m wondering if this might be what you are experiencing? It’s that you feel your needs and emotions should be put to one side that made me think of this. My DH is in a helping profession too and no one would have a clue what he’s like at home…. Over to Lundy…

Mr. Sensitive is soft-spoken, gentle, and supportive—when he isn’t being abusive. He loves the language of feelings, openly sharing his insecurities, his fears, and his emotional injuries. He hugs other men. He may speak out about the absurdity of war or the need for men to get in touch with their feminine side. Perhaps he attends a men’s group or goes on men’s retreats. Often he has participated extensively in therapy or twelve-step programs, or reads all the big self-help books, so he speaks the language of popular psychology and introspection. His vocabulary is sprinkled with jargon like developing closeness, working out our issues, and facing up to hard things about myself. He presents himself to women as an ally in the struggle against sex-role limitations. To some women, he seems like a dream come true.
So what’s wrong with this picture? Nothing obvious yet. But this is exactly the problem: Mr. Sensitive wraps himself in one of the most persuasive covers a man can have. If you start to feel chronically mistreated by him, you are likely to assume that something is wrong with you, and if you complain about him to other people, they may think you must be spoiled: You have the New Age man, what more do you want?
The following dynamics are typical of a relationship with Mr. Sensitive and may help explain your feeling that something has gone awry:

1. You seem to be hurting his feelings constantly, though you aren’t sure why, and he expects your attention to be focused endlessly on his emotional injuries. If you are in a bad mood one day and say something unfair or insensitive, it won’t be enough for you to give him a sincere apology and accept responsibility. He’ll go on and on about it, expecting you to grovel as if you had treated him with profound cruelty. (Notice the twist here: This is just what an abuser accuses his partner of doing to him, when all she is really looking for is a heartfelt I’m sorry.)
2. When your feelings are hurt, on the other hand, he will insist on brushing over it quickly. He may give you a stream of pop-psychology language (Just let the feelings go through you, don’t hold on to them so much, or It’s all in the attitude you take toward life, or No one can hurt you unless you let them) to substitute for genuine support for your feelings, especially if you are upset about something he did. None of these philosophies applies when you upset him, however.
3. With the passing of time, he increasingly casts the blame on to you for anything he is dissatisfied with in his own life; your burden of guilt keeps growing.
4. He starts to exhibit a mean side that no one else ever sees and may even become threatening or intimidating.

Mr. Sensitive has the potential to turn physically frightening, as any style of abuser can, no matter how much he may preach nonviolence. After an aggressive incident, he will speak of his actions as anger rather than as abuse, as though there were no difference between the two. He blames his assaultive behavior on you or on his emotional issues, saying that his feelings were so deeply wounded that he had no other choice.

This gentle man style of abuser tends to be highly self-centered and demanding of emotional catering. He may not be the man who has a fit because dinner is late but rather erupts because of some way his partner failed to sacrifice her own needs or interests to keep him content. He plays up how fragile he is to divert attention from the swath of destruction he leaves behind him.
The central attitudes driving Mr. Sensitive are:
• I’m against the macho men, so I couldn’t be abusive.
• As long as I use a lot of psychobabble, no one is going to believe that I am mistreating you.
• I can control you by analyzing how your mind and emotions work, and what your issues are from childhood.
• I can get inside your head whether you want me there or not.
• Nothing in the world is more important than my feelings.
• Women should be grateful to me for not being like those other men.

• Lundy Bancroft

Yeah quite often people get this diagnosis when something distressing/traumatic has happened but they don’t fully meet dx criteria for PTSD. Most people who have a traumatic experience don’t actually have PTSD in its true form but they’re still impacted significantly by it.

IMO it’s often used for ‘a thing happened and it’s caused distress but this person doesn’t have a diagnosable mental illness as such’.

of course mental illness diagnosis is not an exact science and is subjective and open to interpretation.

Thanks for the explanation, I did later end up with a diagnosis of CPTSD mainly as a result of the attack being yet another thing that had happened to me in a rather turbulent life plus there was an extra layer of trauma re the crime which I won't go into here. My GP was brilliant and the original diagnosis was a sort of "holding" one as I had to wait until the trial was over before I could start therapy.

Next time he says he wants to be a DJ, tell him to change the record.

This. Just read your update OP.

Fucking hell he’s a nasty, manipulative cunt.

You sound very intelligent with your head screwed on OP - he doesn’t deserve you.

More women attempt suicide than men.

Men who have countless resources and campaigns aimed at them and their mental health. I’ve never seen a campaign urging women to talk - they just carry on in the background, shouldering the overwhelming burden of raising children, running a home, working. It seems to be expected that women will tell all and sundry their problems or be more willing to seek therapy - and if that sounds dismissive that’s because that’s how I think society treats women.

im not saying men don’t need or deserve help but the op is also entitled to expect that her husband should seek help for it without judging her for it.

My money is on an affair to be honest.

I agree. I didn’t want to say it at first as I dont want to cause the OP further upset but honestly? Friends of mine who’s Dh’s have had affairs, it always starts like this.

Have you read the Script OP?

Could someone also post that circle of different types of abuse picture? I’m not sure how to do it and it may help the OP.

OP - Im really sorry you are going through this when it should be a lovely time for you 💐

It seems to me that your marriage will break up at some point. I would ask him to leave now before the baby is old enough to sense that their dad doesn’t like them. So he has two choices: leave, or go to his GP for antidepressants.
I was in a similar situation years ago but it wasn’t a baby it was a house. My ex h got a really well paid job so I thought we should buy a house. It made complete financial sense but he had to be talked into it. After we moved in he got moody and depressed and blamed me because I had wanted to buy the house and he hadn’t. We weren’t struggling, there was no reason why he felt so negative except that he found the responsibility of paying a mortgage overwhelming. I worked as well but we had got the mortgage because of his pay. In the end I left with my son and rented a house. He sold up and rented a flat. The irony is that the mortgage was only £400ish a month and if he had kept the house he would have been laughing now. Instead he pays three times that in rent.

Oh, so many red flags here. He wants to be single, so show him the door. Please, for your sake.

Oh no I'm so sorry. Even if he has depression he should not be saying you caused it. For this I'd ultimately want to leave.

Wow that's chilling.

Less women kill themselves as they wont leave their children or responsibilities behind. We are much more likely to suck it up and get on with things despite feeling suicidal. We have to drag ourselves out of it if there is no-one else to take care of the children and do all the cooking/life admin. Husbands are often next to useless, mine certainly is.

It isn’t that women suffer any less.

My df committed suicide and I always thought it was a very selfish act, my dm was left behind with 4 dcs and all of his debts.

If OPs dh really is suicidal he needs to get help. It is not on the OP to take the responsibility for that on on top of everything else she’s doing.

Women are not responsible for curing men’s MH.

This is true, so many men especially men's rights activists use the fact that more men actually succeed in killing themselves than women as a stick to beat women with and to try and claim that men have it worse than women. I think it is possible to both advocate for men's mental health without dismissing the needs of women who as you rightly say are mostly expected to just deal with it themselves, or talk it out with friends or go to the GP for a prescription and a 6 week block of counselling if they are lucky.

Far from it. In fact mental health diagnoses have very little reliability and validity. It doesn’t mean the distress isn’t real of course. But using a medical model just doesn’t work. The question should always be ‘what happened to you?’ Rather than ‘what’s wrong with you?’ In 30 years of working in mental health I’ve never met anyone whose difficulties aren’t understandable given their history and context. That said, none of it means dickish behaviour is ok and should be tolerated.

You saying that made me feel a bit sick. About 90% accurately describes my life. The word chilling has made me feel ill. Nothing like an objective outside perspective to wake you up! 🥺

When I was growing up (in the 70's and 80's), you rarely, if ever, heard anyone talk about mental health, or mental ill health.

Whilst it's good that we now have more awareness, I honestly feel like we have gone ridiculously overboard, and I think that this has led to thousands of people self diagnosing themselves with a mental condition, instead of realising that sometimes a particular situation might be difficult, or make you feel anxious, but it's about that one thing, and it doesn't mean you are mentally ill.

It's almost expected for people to have a mental health condition these days, and it actually gives people a get out of jail free card, in many cases, especially with their partners and in the work place. Look at Op's husband. Can do lots of things like travel and DJ, but the minute he needs to do a chore at home, "oops sorry no, that will make me mentally unwell".

I also think we are poisoning the young minds of our children and teens with all of this, almost forcing them into thinking that it's the norm to be mentally unwell.

I set myself a secret mission, to see how many days I could get through, without hearing someone refer to "mental health", be that in person, on the radio, on TV or on the internet. It's been a few weeks now, and so far my count is Zero.

I'm sorry you're going through this OP. My first thought was that yes it might be depression but lots of mums go through severe post-partum depression but they don't get the luxury of checking out of parenting or of focusing on their music/DJing. You have been very kind and accommodating but he's only able to check out because he's a man and you're able to (literally) stay where you are, holding the baby.

Yes, some forms of Mh can make a person seem very self-focused and selfish but he still has choices to make and he's choosing to DJ instead of being a dad to your youngest.

It sounds as though time apart will be good for you as you'll have time to think and evaluate what you want.

Oh no I'm really sorry to have upset you 😥and I'm sorry you're living with someone like that.

I said chilling because i hadn't read this profile before, I've seen a few from the lundy book but not this one. i know someone who is like this and it strikes me as the most insidious because everyone else thinks he's such a great guy - I've seen his mask slip a couple of times and it was a bit of a gut punch to see him described here so accurately.

And also that it sounds just like the op's husband.

Great post, and I say that as someone not unsympathetic to men's MH (I've fundraised for veterans as I have ex-Forces family members).