The Script - is he too far into it to pull him back to me?

[IAmNotDarling]

H is 42. Last year suddenly started getting interested in his fitness and went for it with running, weights and buying a fancy bike. We’ve been together 25 years and had a happy and loving relationship.

He started pulling away from me around November and made excuses about being busy at work, tired, etc..

He works away periodically; a night or two at a distance and has done for years. Usually accompanied by a colleague (as necessary for the work he does).

He went to his work Xmas do alone, after we couldn’t get a babysitter. He then decided to socialise twice with work over the last the month, involving staying out. Both completely out of character. He started working late and all weekend.

I joked to my Dsis he was probably having an affair. She asked who and I named OW because she’s the only one he works with who has no DC (recently divorced) and I just got a weird vibe when he recruited her 3 years ago. I said nothing to him except I was worried he would burn out. He bought expensive new clothes. I said “oh they’re nice.” He pulled away more. He started getting touchy about his phone. Before he would leave it out and not fuss over it.

I went out for a few drinks after work last night and came home earlier than expected to spend sometime with him before bedtime. He pulled away and made excuses about being uncomfortable after exercising.

Today I’ve been out all day with DD at her hobby and when she went to bed I went to snuggle up to him on the sofa. He pushed me away and said “I can’t do this anymore, I don’t love you.”

I was calm. I asked questions. He quickly fessed up to sleeping with a colleague he travels with. Says he hasn’t been happy for more than a year and that’s why he started exercising. Said he feels alone - DD has a very intense hobby which involve me taking her most evenings.

H says they have fun together but claims it’s only been going on since early January. I don’t believe this. Why would you throw your family away for something going on for only 6 weeks? He says he wants to move out locally (although he works a distance away, as does OW) and be on his own, but also wants to explore things with the OW. He is adamant he doesn’t love me. I asked if he still thought of me as his best friend. That was a resolute no.

I love him and want to save my marriage. Is it too far down the track to pull it back? I can forgive the sex - yes it was unprotected - so I have an STI test already in the post, but it’s the re-writing our history I am struggling with.

My heart is racing. I can’t sleep. I have to be up and out for DD in the morning to help with a big event for her hobby. He’s getting up to fuck off to work early, she has also been going in at weekends to be with him. I bet they’ve been fucking in his office.

I know it’s a total cliche but I never ever suspected he’d cheat.

I’m not trying to cling on because I’m financially dependent on him or because of pride. I am actually very worried he’s lost the plot. OW works for him (his business) and he’s now in a precarious situation. I’ve told him I’m not leaving the house, this is our home and DD needs the stability.

It’s fucked isn’t it?

Of course it would destabilize your payments if he lost his job, but I am pretty sure that his & her work performance will have dropped plus the shagging in the office thing would be something HR wouldn’t love. If OW works beneath him there are other issues with power disparity that could get them both in the shit. Would be tempting to mention this if he gets narky about paying his fair share.

I really feel for you, he’s left a huge gap in your life and you miss him. And there is the feeling of being abandoned and betrayed as well. I cannot say anything to make it better but I do want to give you advice so I’m the future when you are ready to meet someone hopefully you have the space to do it.

I do not think at this stage you can have an informal agreement re DD with your ex as at this point, she doesn’t want to see him. Also, if there were to be an agreement where she was with him EOW, how would that work? If it was to stay at the OWs house I don’t think it would work so much .., like would there be her own space ect or does he have his own place? The latter better as she could have her own to ect. If you get a consent order to cover where you are now, it will mean if have her the majority of the time, then the maintenance payments will need to be higher. It’s a consent order and not a court order which means you can go back and change it as situation changes vis solicitor not the family court.

You can use mediation to get to an agreement for the arrangement for you DD.

Also you don’t have to see his cheating stupid face at parents evening next time, you can request a seperate one.

For now, if his DM is on board I think it beneficial she has you DD for over night stays to give you a break in place of him doing nothing for DD. You sound like you need space and even though it’s great your DD has you, if you create this small world of codependency that only falls on you, it will be harder for you to get out there and meet someone when you are ready.

Sorry for the long essay, I hope some of it helps x

Feeling so sorry for you and your poor daughter. Your ex will realise one day in years to come, what a mistake he's made. He'll try so hard to bond with her, but it will all be too late. She'll have been so used to life without him, and she'll be a teen going out with her friends. It will all be too late for him. Take comfort in the future when everything's going well for you and your daughter, your husband will realise what he's done. I wish you all the happiness in the world.

@Beautiful3 it’s hard to think that far forward. I’d rather DD had a good relationship now with her F than having to build one with a broken man later on.

I can’t believe he’s prepared to give up his daughter for OW. As much as it hurts he cast me away without a thought, DD deserves so much better.

He will sorely regret it. It's unforgivable to just dump your child like that. Heartbreaking for her.

Just wanted to say you sound really strong and capable op. He’s not worth your upset - you are grieving for what you had and that’s understandable but try not to focus on the OW - she has won the booby prize. They’ll never trust one another.

When they’ve been together a while and the humdrum daily grind sets in and she’s washing his undies and they’re bickering about things he’ll have a moment of realisation that he’s now in a normal, everyday relationship with its problems and it’s not exciting or thrilling any more.
And he’s going to be worse of financially and with a ruined relationship with his dd. And you hopefully will have moved on and be stronger than ever.

He will regret his actions. I feel so sorry for your daughter. I wish you both the very best x

I mean, honestly, when you lay it out in black and white like this, it just beggars belief. Some men are so fucking weak, they blow their and everyone's lives around them up to Kingdom Come because they "deserve to be happy too", rather than do the hard yards of fixing what it making them malcontent. It's all so cliched and cringey.

OP, you sound like a wonderful woman and mother. Sending you so much support and unmumsnetty hugs until you and your DD come out the other side of this. And I have no doubt you will

You just know the OW is soothing him saying it’ll all blow over, she’ll come round, don’t let them emotionally blackmail you - you can’t stay in an unhappy marriage for your child’s sake.

as long as he gets told he’s doing the right thing by her, he’ll carry on doing it. He’s weak and unkind and shortsighted.

Yes, she does deserve better. And you will give it to her. She'll have a life full of love, happiness, and adventure all given to her with love, by you.

This happened to me when my DD was 14 and my DS was 12. The tremendous pain I felt on my own behalf was multiplied many times over because of the distress it caused my DC who felt completely betrayed and who were old enough to understand where their father's priorities now lay. My DD refused to speak to him for 3 years and my DS never initiated contact with him and saw him very reluctantly and infrequently.
I am not going to lie, there was a big part of me that was pleased and wanted my DC to punish my exH by cutting him out of their lives because I knew it would cause him pain. However, the better part of me recognised this would not be in their best interests in the long term. He is the only father they have and they had a right to have as much of his love and attention as he was willing to spare them.
So, although it was tough for me, I made it clear to them that they did not need to take sides and that I would not feel they were betraying me if they saw their father. My DD continued to refuse to have any contact with him at all but in the end I persuaded her to see him because I knew it was in her best interests.
Twenty years on they both have a relationship with him which is good for them. It is not the same as their relationship with me and I am very sad for them that they regard him as a weak and rather ridiculous man. I have remained NC with him myself throughout this time and the thing I find myself unable to forgive him for is the effect his behaviour had on my DC.
But having contact with him was the best thing for them and I am so glad I resisted the very natural urge to use my DC as weapons to hurt their father. If I had done so, I would only have hurt them more.
They are both now happily married with families of their own - and determined to keep their families intact.
So I feel so much for you OP. It will get better for you I promise, but in the meantime try always to act in what you know in your heart to be your DD's best interests in relation to her father.

RTT @Godesstobe I am not using DD as a weapon. My life would so much easier if they had a relationship. I’m burnt out.

I have continuously and consistently encouraged him to reconcile
with DD. She isn’t taking sides. She has boundaries and not being exposed to his fuckery at this is one of them. Also she recognises that the OW is toxic as fuck. So no, it’s not about taking sides.

In time she may change her mind; but at this point in time she is resolute and I respect that.

I’m glad you feel content with your choices but I have no doubt there’s only him who will look back with regret.

Dear OP, I wasn't suggesting for one moment that you are using your DD as a weapon. I am so sorry if that is how it came across. I have been in your position and the last thing I would want to do is add to your pain. Plus it is clear that you are a great, loving mother and that a good part of your pain - as was the case for me - is due to the damage you know your H has done to your DD. I know you will be doing your absolute best to look after her.

I was being honest about my own feelings at the time and how a part of me found it satisfying that my DC rejected their father. And how I had to make a conscious effort at times to put the needs of my DC first. And how very glad I am that I did.

It may help you to know that my ex does look back with regret. He wrote to me about 5 years ago saying he was sorry and actually acknowledging that he had rewritten the story of our marriage at the time to justify his behaviour. I did not reply. I realised that although I could forgive him for the terrible hurt he caused me, I simply could not forgive him for the damage he did to my DC.

He tries to be a part of their lives now and that is good for them because, as I say, he is the only father they will ever have, but they will never forgive and forget. If anything their contempt for their father has increased now that they are adults with families of their own and know that he had choices and made selfish ones.

It might have been different if he was still with the OW and she was clearly the love of his life. But their relationship didn't last long. She was just a selfish woman who broke up her own family and caused immense hurt to her own DC. She tried to go back to her H but he wasn't having it.

So, I was trying to be helpful by sharing my story. I know how incredibly tough it us. But you and your DD will get through this, and I wish you all the very best for the future.

You're in the trenches right now and it will be next to impossible to look past the immediate "what comes next" and see a bright future for yourself, but things will get better and smooth out eventually. For you, at least. Your idiot ex has hopefully got a rough road ahead of him when the shine wears off the OW and he realises what he's lost with his daughter.

You sound like a great mum and your daughter is so lucky to have you. She sounds a tough cookie too, respect to her for being strong enough to set boundaries that make her comfortable and stick to them, that strength will serve her well in life.

Hang in there, rooting for you and your DD.

Godesstobe FWIW I didn’t read your post in that way, my kids don’t see their dad but I’m glad your kids found a way forward that works for them, and they’ve got you as a secure constant.

OP yeah it’s completely shit. My EXH didn’t go off with another woman, but still doesn’t bother with his kids. At the end of the day it’s just the carryings on of a deeply weak and pathetic man, OW or not. I know what you mean re wanting a break, I was shattered after my ex left and I had no help at all, but as children get older and start to heal in some way from the betrayal of abandonment, they become more self sufficient and you will feel less burnt out. It takes so much out of you, though. Not sure if it’s been mentioned but when I told my boss about my situation way after the worst of it was past, she said I should have taken a break from work at the time and it was more than justified to do so. I don’t know the ins and outs obviously of your working, but maybe to get yourself above water, time out could be something to look into.

Taking on your child’s pain is absolute agony, and honestly the frustration and rage I’ve felt on towards my EXH for abandoning his children has at times threatened to drown me. I could have powered a small country with the sheer bubbling energy that was swirling in my in probably the first year. If someone asks about EXH even now, I can feel it rise up to my throat when I say he doesn’t see the children. Fucking bastards, these men.

I've RTFT and I'm sorry you are going through this too. I am a little behind you in that teenage DCs haven't been told yet plus he is still living in the same house while GCSEs happen. It is horrendous and I am amazed at my restraint. His OW was much younger, junior to him at work and he lost his job over it so that complicates everything too.

I both dreading and desperate to tell DC and move things forward. I made an instant decision when he told me that it was over because that level of weakness and stupidity is of no use to me.

If you can bear it - and DM me if better - can I ask what you both told DD when you told her what was happening? I am wracking my brain thinking of the right words.

I know your boiling rage (very very justifiable) will keep you going but I know too how exhausting it is to be at that level all the time. Take care of yourself

As hard as it is, I think you need to leave his new relationship/OW out of it. Yes it was an absolutely shitty thing to do, but your anger for towards them as a couple is clearly rubbing off on your dd. Making demands and ultimatums for them to split up so that he can have a parental relationship again with his dd is going to do nothing but unite them and strengthen their resolve. The best thing that either you or dd can do is completely ignore the OW, make it clear that you don't give a shit about that and leave her out of it completely. It's fine for dd to tell him that she doesn't want to meet OW or have contact with him in her presence. But you can't also require him to do 50/50 parenting under those conditions either. It's basically an attempt to blackmail him into ending breaking off with the OW. There's clearly no chance of the marriage recovering so leave them to it. They probably won't last anyway. Remember the old adage that when the mistress takes the man she creates a vacancy.

OP are you having any counselling?

If you truly want ex to have a relationship with DD, you do need to try to rise above some of your very understandable feelings about OW when DD is around. How in earth does she know/think OW is toxic?

This man has hurt you both, and while you are there to help DD, please also take some time out to get support for yourself. You are still in an angry place which is natural. Have you got someone to help you work through acknowledging to accepting this new situation? You’re going to be ok and you have exciting new times to look forward to. I know it feels shit still now and it will while you work out the financials etc. but it will get easier.

💐

Thank you @Godesstobe thank you for sharing and sorry I misunderstood your intentions. I’m doing my best to stay neutral with DD over this.

@altmember I’m making no demands.
My DD will not be ignored so he sext OW or have plans cancelled on her so he can have dinner with OW. DD doesn’t want to spend any time with him so 50/50 isn’t on the cards.

Yeah, I’m angry. Those selfish wankers destroyed two families to get their end away and are living in their fantasy bubble.

@Catoo yes both of us are having counselling. I don’t need the clinches rolling out - new and exciting times? Seriously? No, it’s not fucking exciting to have your future thrown into disarray. I was happily married and looking forward to a lovely future until these two fucking selfish arseholes started stroking each others egos.

DD knows directly from her F how this affair came about. That OW has a family and did all this while her own DD is in the middle of her GCSEs. DD doesn’t understand how OW could be with her F when he is behaving the way he is. She’s got her own views. She knows her F and how his personality has changed entirely.

@yawnanotherone I’m sorry, what an awful situation. I made him tell DD. It is not your job to explain his actions and choices.

If I tell him it’s over then I’m doing the hard work aren’t I? He’s the one who wants to destroy our lives, why should I make it easier for him?

I think allowing him to stay is making it easy on him and letting him do everything on his own terms, instead of you taking back power and control of your own life.

I'd rip that rug right out from under him. Not only would I be telling him that he has to leave, I'd make sure all the family knew that you thought you were happily married - he is claiming otherwise but instead of being a real man/husband and talking to you about whatever issues he is now fabricating, he chose to just stick his dick into somebody else instead.

This is also how you know his rewriting of history is a lie/the script. I bet there weren't issues - he has to justify himself so that he doesn't have to reflect on what a piece of he actually is. Unfortunately for him, he can't get away from the truth of that because even with his excuse, there was no reason for him to have an affair instead of trying to work on the relationship with you.

Tell him to go. Also tell him that he is a coward and you don't accept his excuse for the affair. If he felt there were problems, a person with morals would have tried to repair the relationship or end it before sleeping with someone else. I would say this to him and then not allow any further discussion.

I'm sorry that you are hurting. This really sucks. But try to remember that you are in love with the person you thought he was and not who he has really shown himself to be. He is selfish and not a nice person.

Hi OP - my above comment was based on your initial post. I have just read your updates and see that he has already left and that people know.

I'm so sorry he is being so awful to your DD. If this is his new way of life/behaviour she is honestly better off without him. Although I appreciate that everyone is currently hurt/confused and it may not seem like that right now.

Stay strong OP - your DD will be ok as she has such a great mum she can always depend on.

It’s 13 weeks since this started. 92 days.

8 weeks of NC with DD. She’s had a birthday. He bought her ridiculously expensive gifts, dropping them off with his parents. He included a note saying he missed DD but would not chose between her and OW, which she commented on reading that clearly he does not love her enough to chose her.

I made her birthday as fun as I could. Day out with family, silly fun, hugs and kisses, holding her hand and telling her how much she is loved. She is struggling.

I’m still so angry. I can’t be this angry forever. I miss my DH. I miss the man he was. I’m still waiting notification of the divorce process starting but I’ve initiated mediation to start untangling from him

You're not waiting for notification from him for the divorce to start, are you?

And of course you miss him. You will miss him, your family life and all of it for a long time. It's painful. Pain like you've never known. It's horrendous. His cruelty is beyond the pale.

Has he filed already do you know?

In my situation, I filed for the divorce so that I could take charge. It made me feel better being in control of the process.