Parents subtle racism / discrimination

[Eva90]

I guess this is more of a rant than anything but I am just feeling so drained and would be grateful for any advice.

My parents (age 72 and 65) are unconscious racist.

I feel like every time I visit them I end up in a bad mood over something one or both of them has said that is discriminative. A few examples below:

Whilst watching the news (about certain crimes, stabbings etc) "I'm not racist but it always seems to be the [race] people"

Forever getting worked up on the topic of immigration/illegal immigrants and zero empathy towards them. Convinced they are taking all benefits.

Making comments how "no one is speaking English" on the train.

Telling a story and using race to describe people but in such a way that is like "the Indian nurse, but she's a lovely lady". Why wouldn't she be?

I call them out on it most of the time but it makes zero difference so sometimes I just ignore them but I can immediately feel myself wanting to leave. They are so ignorant to white privilege and systemic racism that they just get defensive if called out.

My husband's mum is actually foreign and they love her to bits, love telling everyone about her being from said country, and learning about her culture. They are your typical "I'm not racist I have a friend who is black, Indian, etc) but they often make ignorant racial comments.

I know it's a generational thing but I don't think that is an excuse for it. I cringe inside and actually feel anxious when my husband spends time with them as I know they will probably make some kind of comment at some point. They are only getting worse the more time they spend at home now retired, constantly watching the negative news and glued to their phones.

They also live in a very white area that is slowly become more multicultural and they don't like it.

It's such a shame as they are my parents who I love dearly, are kind hearted people but this makes me really dislike them and dislike spending time with them.

Can anyone relate

This is my uncle all over. I think it is weird. He also talks about the "lady doctor".

CTW23 · Yesterday 11:36

Omg my MIL is the same. 'I met this lovely lady in the park, she was black. She had the sweetest dog'.
Why is the fact that she's black even in the conversation?!”

My mother used to talk in public about the “P… shop.” I was constantly telling her that she couldn’t say that and how offensive it was but she just didn’t get it. To her mind, it was like shortening British to Brit. She would go on to say what a nice man he was and how the shop was always open.
She still says it but barely goes out now, which in some ways, though sad, is a relief.

MrsSkylerWhite · Today 12:21

CTW23 · Yesterday 11:36
**
Omg my MIL is the same. 'I met this lovely lady in the park, she was black. She had the sweetest dog'.
Why is the fact that she's black even in the conversation?!”

My mother used to talk in public about the “P… shop.” I was constantly telling her that she couldn’t say that and how offensive it was but she just didn’t get it. To her mind, it was like shortening British to Brit. She would go on to say what a nice man he was and how the shop was always open.
She still says it but barely goes out now, which in some ways, though sad, is a relief.

My parents are a similar age to the OP's. They were in their late teens when the Race Relations Act happened. When I hear people saying "It was generational" and "People's education and life experiences were different" and "Everyone thought like that then" I want to know who exactly they mean by 'everyone'. Do they think my parents were totally OK with the existence of a colour bar that meant they could be denied service in cafes and pubs or rejected from jobs on the basis of their skin, nothing else? That they really didn't mind the way other people spoke to them? Or do they just not count as part of this mythical 'everyone'?

I guess when people talk about it being generational, what they mean is that what is considered racist has changed - and is continuing to do so.

When my grandparents (who were avowedly anti racist) were younger, ‘racism’ was considered the racism of Oswald Moseley and others. Talk of pure blood and keeping different races out, violence and overt hatred and hostility. In comparison to that, making comments about people’s racial differences was not considered racist where it would be now.

Equally for my generation, raised that neither hostility nor covert comments are ok, we’re still learning and improving. Thinking about representation in period drama - it’s only the last decade or so we’ve seen mixed casts in period pieces? And it now being pretty unacceptable for people to be cast out of race where pretty recently you’d have white ladies playing cleopatra and so on.

It’s all a learning journey. The difference is those who are willing, and those unwilling, to learn.

You have hit the nail on the head. Of course people have grown up with different upbringings etc, my grandparents shared similar (if not worse) views so this had made its impression on my parents. However, as you said people should be willing to learn and change. I am 41 and can remember thinking in a similar way to them about certain things when I was probably 13/14 years old which I am horrified about now.
My parents always told me they'd be disappointed if I brought home a POC boyfriend... how awful is that.

I must say they have come a long way since that but I can't them ever fully changing or being willing to learn. I suppose the only good thing is the people who are in a similar position to me that have commented, we will bring our children up completely differently

But, depending where you were brought up etc it can be a generational thing. It’s definitely a generational thing for my relatives annd other old people I know ie friends parents admittedly not very well educated, left school at 15 don’t read books or have any real emotional intelligence. The p word was a thing in the house I grew up in , as was an anti semitic slur they’d use as well as the old “play the white man”. No n word it was (I don’t know what I am allowed to type!) that da*kie for them. My mum was watching the news with us a few years ago when the Oscar’s was on and quite a few films with black actors, directors etc were winning . “It’s getting a bit ridiculous now” was her contribution as she’d had a drink.

does the classic I’m not racist but to which I say to her you are racist, she just shrugs and says well I am then. Have pointed out to her that all the racist slurs she used with gay abandon are not acceptable.

I think it's the older generations. Lots of old fashioned ideas my grandparents were catholic, subtly and not so subtly homophobic and thought everyone should join the army straight after leaving school. Totally different generation

I do think there's a misconception that White brits are uniquely racist or something. My BFF who I've known since school is Arab and she would profusely apologise when I went round hers for her parents racism and homophobia and ask me not to say anything to anyone at school. They even had a word for the n word "abeeb" and she wasn't allowed black people in the house!

*abeed sorry.

@TorroFerney

Your post is as profoundly ageist as the OPs.

By all means share the stories of your ownracist relatives.

But when you assign those same characteristics to an entire generation then you are ageist.

Just because your relatives are racist it does not follow that these are traits shared by an entire generation.

To assert that it us is ugly ageism.

@DesperateMousewives My ex FIL was South Asian, would talk about the old days of having to deal with racism from whites, yet had nothing but awful sterotypes to say about black people and disowned his daughter who loved a black guy. There is a huge problem with anti-Blackness globally.

@GintyMcGinty I said homophobic, please read it properly if you're going to attempt to pull me up on it. Recognisig instances of misogyny among men does not mean I believe all men are misogynistic. In the same vein, noticing more homophobia in the older generation compared to the present is simply an observation, not ageism.

My mums the same OP, 79 and is always saying something inappropriate (luckily only to us indoors) Only today watching the football she had to point out a group of black men in the crowd and how unusual it seemed (???) TBF where we live there hasn't been a very diverse range of nationalities until recent years and it is still a little unusual to see a very dark person (this isn't condemning anything btw)

I shouted at her a few months ago cos she was going on about a woman on the news in a niqab, she's definitely getting worse and I don't really know why.

She too reads the daily mail and watches GB News, maybe this is why. As a PP said they're poison

Its NOT AGEISM! Ageism is ascribing the behavior to the person’s age as in their diminished capacity. “People over 60 shouldnt learn to drive because their reflexes are bad” is ageist. Referring to generational differences is not ageism but historical or cultural awareness. People over 80 in (small rural island) speak their original dialect is just a sociological fact. The negative attribution you make is on you.

Everyones a little bit racist.
Very likely a little bit sexist, ageist and all the others too. Are they kind people? Do they make the world a better place? It's the most that most of us can aspire to

If you can't get them to change their attitudes, you can at least try to get them to change their behaviour. 'Mum and dad, I've explained that it offends me when you say these things. It matters enough to me that I feel too uncomfortable to be around you when you say them, so if you carry on I'm going to leave'. There is a theory that if you change behaviour attitudes will follow, so you never know. And at least you won't have to feel you're colluding.

@pikkumyy77

Use CAPITALs all you like but it is ageism to assert that an entire generation is ageist.

@DesperateMousewives

Oh I'm sorry. In that case reread my post with homophobia swapped out for racism.

My point stands.

Of course there's people on here going 'be understanding, they've had to deal with a lot of change, it's hard to keep up'

What a decent person would do if they used (for example a racist word) and someone said to them 'hey, xxx is actually considered an offensive word now'
Would be to go:
'Oh god, really? Sorry, I never realised - whys that then? Thanks for telling me' and they'd be horrified that they'd said something that might upset people.
And then they would make great care not to use the word again, or if they do use it by accident, they go 'ah, oops - sorry'. Because it is a learning curve, after all!

Because isn't that what you'd do, as a decent person?? You'd be horrified and embarrassed and work to change it.

However that seems to be rare - much more likely they get defensive, go on the attack, or double down on it, or ignore you.

And someone whose being told 'that's upsetting' who then continues to be upsetting, completely unessecarily (as none of it is bloody necessary) is not a decent person, are they?

These are all people who can learn the names of new characters in TV shows, drive, work through recipes, work, and seemingly remember not to go 'ugh, what a dick' to colleagues or acquaintances they aren't fond of, but apparently can't struggle with simple concepts such as 'xxx word is offensive'? Give over.

I totally agree with this.

My parents are pretty right on (and grandparents, dead now, really believed they’d fought hitler to fight against bigoted views and considered it s failure of our victory that so much racism persisted in the uk after we’d fought side by side with other nationalities and races… anyway) - and my dad always says ‘show me the line between political correctness gone mad and kindness. If it’s someone being kind and empathetic, what on earth is wrong with that’.

And he’s right of course. Most of the people who whinge about changing standards are whinging because they somehow think their right to say whatever they want is more important than if they hurt someone. Which is madness, why would you want to go about your life hurting people’s feelings?

I don’t think anyone is saying a whole generation is racist by saying ‘it’s a generational thing’. Most people using that expression are referring to the fact that (1) in prior generations things which are considered racist now, were not and (2) levels of casual racism which are rightly unacceptable now were socially more acceptable.

Look at the ‘comedy’ from the 70s and 80s. Sure loads of people complained and switched off at the time (including my own family, the older generations of which are thankfully anti racist), but many watched and it was broadcast on mainstream tv. ‘Comedy’ like that would never be shown now, and if it was no one would watch.

Standards have changed for the better x

I’ll cope!

It's not an age or generation thing. It is a personality and situation thing.

One of my DGMs was very much anti racist (marches in the 1970s etc). She would have been 105 now. The other was open about not liking the way her neighbourhood changed.

The area she had lived in and raised her children in changed massively due to immigration. Her local shops and amenities closed down and were replaced by shops that served her new neighbours instead. She was very unhappy and vocal about it.

No racist language particularly, just a deep distrust of the foreigners and their culture, cooking etc. It wasn't just her. Several old neighbours moved away due to 'white flight'.

@Foxblue Exactly, the number of times I have corrected family members (not that old - 60s in some cases) about not using coloured or half-caste and they get offended at me. I can't imagine what they would do if they said it outside the house, say in a pub or restaurant and they really upset someone. How would they answer them then? I've been accused of picking on them!