DP friends with ex-wife

[CarrotyO]

I've been with my DP almost 2 years. He's been separated from his exw about 4 years bu they always stayed friends. At the start of our relationship he was still married to exw and didn't see the need to divorce as "it's just a bit of paper". They were still very close - lots of texting conversations through the week, shared a car (it was her car but he had free parking so she parked the car at his place and he used it more often unless she wanted it, for example if she wanted to do something at the weekend she would take it), and met each other weekly to have dinner together and catch-up, or to go on nights out to the pub/bars with her and her DP.

I really struggled with their meet-ups because he had a habit of meeting with her and I would only find out afterwards, and often by accident because I had tried phoning and couldn't get through to him, despite asking him to be transparent and tell me in advance when he was meeting her.

I was very uncomfortable and pressured him to reduce contact and divorce. He has divorced now. It became a bit frosty between them during the divorce, and (slightly before the divorce) because he began to limit contact with her (for example, she had asked him to drive her and her cat to the vets, I was uncomfortable with it, he delayed in agreeing and she took a taxi instead).

The divorce was amicable and very straight forward as they have no DC, no shared property, no shared-finances etc. Things seem to have warmed up again now, they are texting each other to wish each other happy birthday, happy new year, sharing photos of their Christmas dinners with each other, giving each other updates on promotions at work, sharing youtube links to things she knows my DP is interested in. They have a long history (over 20 years together) and I think my DP would be happy to go back to weekly meet-ups with her if I wasn't so upset by this.

I feel like he is still attached to her. I want him to cut contact with her and focus on our relationship and building a relationship with me. I'm worried that even if we marry and have children he will still have a relationship with her. I don't want to be reminded of their long history together and want him to leave his past in the past.

My DP was with his ex for 10+ years. Not married, but might as well have been. When I met him they were so close they lived only streets apart and met up all the time. And you know what, I hated it too at first. But eventually I came to realise they were exes for a reason and I learned to be respectful of their friendship. I got to know her and then we got to know her now DH and, years down the line, our kids know each other and we socialise every now and then. So my advice is don't sweat it - he's with you now, she's with someone else. If they were meant to be together, they'd be together. And it's good that he has the maturity not to turn toxic with his exes.

Maybe against the grain a bit here but it’s always been one of my favourite things about my dp that he still has really good connections with his exes. 2 of them - both have become friends of mine and I am proud of him that I know both will come to him when they need a friend. People change and move on sometimes and want to change their relationships but i
to me it’s a lively thing if they can do that like adults and keep the bits if the relationship they still really value.

We all have a right to have things that are a deal breaker for us, and our partners have a right to know them so that they can either agree, or we separate without wasting each others time.

I'm on the opposite thought. If they were separated 2 years before he met you and have always been friends I don't see a threat. Surely they would be together if they wanted to be.

I wish I could be like this. It was affecting me so much when he was refusing to sort out his divorce and meeting her without telling me that it became clear that something had to change. He initiated the divorce and cut down on the contact and it became frosty between them. I thought that was how it was for the past year, but I saw that they had actually continued messaging each other and it hit me again. I wish I could view things in a different way but I have a very strong emotional reaction and feel really insecure and feel like my feelings don't matter to him.

He saw how unhappy I still was today, after discovering this yesterday, and he said he will cut contact with her, that he chooses me, and that he thinks he was being a people pleaser with her. I think we're in a really impossible situation, because as PPs have pointed out, it isn't fair for him to cut contact, I feel guilty, and like a terrible person for making him do this. But I really struggle to accept his friendship with her.

You never should have gotten involved with him.

This is your own doing.

He was a legally married man, that had no business being involved with anyone, especially when he needed to end the first relationship, and be completely single for a few years.

You knew about how close they were and have remained beforehand. Not understanding why you thought it would be different and would come to an end with you in the picture.

They are both perhaps in love with one another, and have a long lasting history. No other man nor women will ever get a fair chance, nor a healthy relationship.

Ending things is long overdue.
End things, or continue to be miserable and accepting of this.

Perhaps therapy would be beneficial for you. Clearly there are some issues with you to make you intentionally self sabotage, and treat yourself very poorly.

There are billions of single available men who would treat you right and who are serious about relationships...

but you intentionally picked a married man, and helped him cheat on his wife.

This was doomed from the start, and he was never going to be committed nor faithful to you..nor would you ever gain his genuine love and affection. Respectfully, you are just an readily available backup option.

End things, and learn how to treat yourself better. Love and respect yourself.

I agree with this poster. Exes are exes for a reason and we usually feel funny about them because of our own insecurities. Being jealous of the past is a little psychotic. In the present she is his friend. She might even become your friend ?

Is it worth trying couple counselling to work thru this issue?

It doesn’t sound like they have a friendship any longer though. They exchange messages on significant dates and that’s it. What more do you want? Total blanket ban on him communicating with her? I fear that would backfire. He’s already divorced her to keep you happy and limited contact. That’s surely shown you he loves you and is putting you first? I urge you to seek therapy for your insecurities because you might be torpedoing a great relationship here.

Double standards are not a good thing, but they do exist.
I was sorry to cut contact with my female friends and former GF's, but it is something men are generally expected to do.

What a shame. If a woman posts saying her new partner wants her to drop all her male friends he’s called controlling. Because it IS controlling to ask someone to cut a person they’ve known for 20 years out of their life and are platonic friends with now just because you can’t get a handle on your jealousy.

feel like her relationship with her new DP is less serious because he is much younger than her (26) and wants kids. She is happy childfree (41), so they are both living apart presumably because at some point, when he's a bit older, he will find a woman to have kids with.
What's the age difference between you and him? @CarrotyO

I am not sure we can make a direct comparison.
I cannot justify why part of me would have been hurt if my wife had not wanted to take my name, but part of me would have been and it is just social norms.
On the other hand, if my wife cooked and cleaned and I said she never did, if I told her what to wear or took out a bad day on her that would be abusive of me.
These things are not equal, but we are left ith them.

Tbh, you need to end it in that case.

You're notngoing to feelnamy less insecure as time goes by and it's notnfair to issue ultimatums. You either accept the whole package or you don't.

It's pointless thinking it would be perfect if only x, y, z weren't an issue becaise it is an issue for you and you have no control over it.

I wouldn't be friends with someone who was such close friends with an ex because I like my life to he simple. It doesn't matter that other people would disagree with that or would be ok with the friendship. You're not.

If a woman posts saying her new partner wants her to drop all her male friends he’s called controlling. Because it IS controlling to ask someone to cut a person they’ve known for 20 years out of their life and are platonic friends with now just because you can’t get a handle on your jealousy.

That. If you can't handle your jealousy, you get help with it or you leave him. You don't get to control his friendships, even if one of them is with his ex.

He's gone to great lengths already to cut down contact, but it wasn't good enough for you. Now you've made him cut her out completely, I'm really not sure what effect that will have on your relationship. And I suspect it'll only be five minutes before you find something/someone else that will trigger your jealousy.

If you want to be with him, getting help for your issues would have been much more useful and much fairer than making him cut a twenty year friendship from his life.

I have a friend who has a relationship like this with her ex H - we all thought it very odd tbh, but it's worked for them. Married 20+ yrs, now divorced 20yrs, they still socialise with each other plus new partners. They do have DC and GC though, so making it work as friends had an added push.

She says he's like the brother you adore, happy to see and socialise with, only want the best for them, but are very relieved you no longer have to live with them and their very annoying habits, and have no sexual feelings at all towards them.

Partners who have not been able to accept their relationship haven't lasted very long.

It only works as a friendship though if things are not hidden from new partners eg being completely transparent about meeting up, not having a problem with the new partner potentially being around on some occasions (not all by any means), not having a problem with answering the phone etc.

If there's an element of the friendship being secret, it still strays into emotional affair territory and will undermine the trust within the new relationship because things are being hidden!

My best friend of 30+ years is male, but I'd never dream of hiding that friendship from future (or past) partners. Sometimes I spend time with him alone, sometimes with both him and his wife, sometimes with him and my new partner. That's normal and healthy.

My ex-partner and his ex kept their meetings secret, I only ever met her twice (after insisting, since they were still such a big part of each others lives). That dynamic wasn't healthy and undermined our relationship because their relationship was still too enmeshed and neither were fully moving on emotionally. Too much of their emotional support was from each other rather than getting it within the new relationship. Basically it felt like they were carrying on as before, but she'd just outsourced the sex aspect to someone else!

OP He is supposed to be your partner but in realty he is a lame duck attaching itself to anyone willing to be it's crutch holding mother.
I do not think this man will bring you one stitch of happiness long term to be brutally honest.

They don't want to be with each other but each thinks they have power over the other and this relationship will continue until one of them gets a partner that refuses to tolerate it and they have to make the decision if they love that person more. Chances are they won't cut ties no matter how alluring the new partner is.

I would find someone who is not involved in this kind of set up.

Why? Because he's still on good terms with the woman he was once married to? Given how many threads there are on MN about toxic divorces, why is that a bad thing?

I do agree with PP that the friendship needs to be out in the open though. If he's hiding their contact, that's demeaning to his current partner. Although, if the current partner is like OP and very jealous, you can see why they might feel they can't be open.

I'm really good friends with both my ex husbands. We spend time together and there are no feelings. It took me 8 years to divorce number 1 as I didn't see the point until I was getting re-married. I will probably get divorced a second time if either him or myself get married or he wants one. It's a waste of money for a piece of paper! I have no sexual feelings towards either. I am not a threat to future women. I fell out of love I still like them as people though!

This exactly.

You don’t need to be “very jealous” or insecure to not want your partner /future husband to be close with his ex wife so I don’t get why some people are calling the OP that.

Many if not most women wouldn’t accept this kind of set up OP, but tbh it doesn’t really matter even if most would accept it or not.

@CarrotyO you don’t like it and you are the one who matters here in this situation so you should take action now or forever hold your peace really

Because he was engaging in addictive behaviours and had lied about it too many times / not sorted the issue.

Well, he's still addicted to his ex wife

Yep. And he's still lying to you about meeting her, etc.

I'd throw this one back.

My best friend of 30+ years is male, but I'd never dream of hiding that friendship from future (or past) partners. Sometimes I spend time with him alone, sometimes with both him and his wife, sometimes with him and my new partner. That's normal and healthy.

@Mushroom2023 I agree, one of my best friends of 2 decades is a man and I’ve spent time with both him and his wife as well as him alone. But because he is my friend that I care about, if his wife ever had an issue with our friendship I’d wish him well and end our friendship or draw back so we become more like friendly acquaintances who text each other every couple of years.

I’d be of the opinion that our friendship as dear as it is to me, shouldn’t trump his main relationship and I wouldn’t be happy if I was causing stress in his marriage.

The fact that both of them are so willing to continue with this when it risks his current relationship says a lot

People posting to talk of long standing make friendships (either always platonic or with exes), where the friendships are open and transparent and all people concerned socialise and are friends together are missing the point.

The OP isn't in that situation.

In her situation, her boyfriend/partner meets up with his ex in secret and excludes her. I'd be really surprised if anyone would honestly be happy in that scenario.