Buying a house, living with DP-finances?

[thebartenderatethethief]

Sorry, I know this topic has been done to death but I can't find a thread for my own circumstances.

I want to buy a house, and DP wants to move in.

I've heard that if a DP was to contribute to any house repairs/maintenance etc, that means they can claim part of the house for themselves if you ever split up, is that right?

DP currently lives with Mum and Dad and doesn't have savings, so wouldn't be a good idea to share the mortgage. I'd not feel right charging half the mortgage either-that's for me to pay as it'd just be in my name.

I thought, half of all bills and a small contribution to other costs? Would that be fair?
I earn slightly more than DP but only slightly and my outgoings are currently far higher obviously. DP also gets a lot of job perks, discounts, shares etc whereas I don't so we're not far off equal there (if that's relevant).

If he is going to be paying bills then he's contributing to the household so not like lodger but a partner?

Well, I'd knock any talk of him paying half the mortgage on the head for a start. He needs to pay rent, not your mortgage.

Maybe if I just charge slightly more than DP currently pays parents.
That's just less than half the mortgage.
And half the bills. That could be fairer.

DP's idea is to go completely halves on everything. So pay half the mortgage each, half the bills each, half any repairs/maintenance/food etc each.

@thebartenderatethethief does your DP actually know what this will mean for their finances? It sounds like something they've said because they are keen to move in/as a grand gesture akin to their gift giving propensity, but they haven't really thought it through properly.

Your DP also doesn't seem to realise that in the possible event of a split down the line, they would walk away with nothing, while you'd be in full possession of (another) valuable asset.

Add up all your current bills (plus loss of single person council tax discount, food for two plus a bit extra on utilities) divide it in half, and present it to your DP. Just before you do that, compare it to the £250 they are currently paying at their parents, and think about what their response could be. It would be interesting for you to watch what their actual reaction to that is.

As much as you love your DP and want to live with them, you will probably need to be prepared to be the one to make financial compromises if you let DP move in, given the way you have both managed your finances to date.

Re the DIY, yes I can confirm that if a non-owning occupant puts a lot of time and energy into improving the house and treats it as their own then it is possible (by no means certain) that a judge might eventually award them a percentage of its equity. It is rare but absolutely it has happened, I remember studying that in my law course. Something about accidentally creating an equitable trust I think.

Re the shared finances I don’t know what to suggest as it’s such a personal decision. I would never set up home with someone unless we both owned the house, but perhaps your partner will feel differently.

It is a weird dynamic though if you are the landlord and your partner is paying you rent and as the house rises in value you are basically making a profit out of your partner while also preventing them from investing in property. I’m a romantic so I’d either take a risk, get married, and combine finances, or walk away. But clearly I am not you and something might work great for you that wouldn’t work for me.

@Starseeking I have tried to talk to DP about this as like you seem to be saying, I am not convinced myself!

DP does tend to not think things through at all. Currently has 'too much month at the end of money' now, even paying out just £250 p/m. If I look at the mortgage prices on 'rightmove' for the type of house I'd be buying and the amount of deposit I can get together, the mortgage would be just under £700 so £350 each even before bills/other associated expenses.

DP also says that money wouldn't be as tight because of not having to travel to visit me so often, which when we factor in going out for food/drinks/other activities, that can cost a fair bit.

As for the being left with nothing, DP hasn't ever thought about owning a house, and wouldn't care at all about having nothing to show for living with someone for however long if we were to split up. Just not bothered AT ALL. I know that sounds bizarre, it does to me too. But it's just the truth. I dont think this means I shouldn't be mindful of that scenario.

I am going to do as you suggested. I'll look on Rightmove at the sort of mortgage we might get and then use what I pay now (although we'll probably buy a slightly larger house than the one I live in by myself) and see what happens!

Ignoring the house thing though for a minute, DP's approach is quite worrying.
Do they have no savings? What about pension? Are they an only child so expect to inherit their parents' estate? Or some other plans for retirement?
If they had an accident leaving them unable to work, what would they do?
Have they really reached their 40s with no consideration of any financial planning at all?

It sounds like you have extremely different approaches when it comes to money - you are quite conservative and have clearly made some conscious financial decisions with the future in mind. Your DP seems totally oblivious to the fact that life can change on a dime and hasn't considered their own financial security at all.

You, from your posts, seem more indifferent that I would expect from someone wanting to move in? You say it would be nice, you say the alternative is starting again - you don't say you can't possibly imagine living without them, or it's driving you crazy the distance, etc. Perhaps because of the practical topic at hand - but I would really REALLY reflect on whether you think this can work long term. Because significant differences in views on money often equal significant differences in views on values, what's important in life. Which is storing up trouble for later, if you ignore it.

No savings at all. Some debt, not a lot.
Work pension. Two siblings but parents who do own a house are leaving everything to grandchild.

If injured I guess just live off benefits? Yes-no financial planning whatsoever.

The distance absolutely DOES drive me crazy. I hate it, hate being apart, and hate being supposedly in a relationship but living what feels like a single lifestyle, practically but also in terms of how solitary it feels to be long distance. I guess yes as you say this is a practical topic so I hadn't mentioned anything like that, didn't feel especially relevant.

@Leyenda thank you for clarifying. I will be careful with that.

I don't think I would want to be in DP's position. But, if we want to live together this is going to have to be how It's done. I certainly don't want to rent, and that would cost more money-the market's so unpredictable at the moment. DP isn't bothered at all. And if we didn't do this, I really don't think would EVER buy a house. I take the point about it preventing an investment but it'd just never happen.

I think unless I wasn't around and a partner with their own place came along, so same as me, or perhaps renting somewhere with someone. But I really doubt DP would ever buy a house-after not a penny to show even after living with parents for two years. Dp isn't paid a lot, but more than enough to save a few hundred a month I'd haev thought.

On paper, you are asset rich.
He has fuck all.
He could stand on his own two feet and find a cheap place to rent near you.

I wouldn't move in together until you have a better sense of where his money goes. Because soon that might be your problem too. What if one month he doesn't have enough to cover his share of the bills? You'll end up paying it rather than getting into the red, and so on.

It might be that he's fine with this sort of thing and just lives paychque to paycheque. But you don't currently know and that's risky.

I would ask him to sit down together and do a "financial open house". Go through your finances together. What you bring in, what you currently pay out, any debts and what the plan is to pay them off and by when, any savings, pensions - share EVERYTHING. You may not plan on merging your finances, and I agree this is wise, but your finances will soon become codependent and if you don't know where each of you stands it'll make it much harder. And these things will simply come out in the wash, usually at moments of tension or stress, such as if one of you can't make a bill one month. Get it out into the open now.

In terms of your specific question re mortgage: what are his long term plans and your plans together? Would you like to own a property together one day? One option could be that he pays what he would be paying in rent into a savings account instead. If things go well between you, he could use this lump sum to either pay off some of your mortgage and go in on the home you're currently in, together, or for you to buy a different home together in future. If things don't go well, he will have a lump sum which he may well need to find a new place to live, since he won't have the security of a tenancy agreement the way he would if he were renting.

This approach will also show you if he can actually be disciplined about money in the service of shared goals, which is a pretty essential characteristic for a partner to have.

Everything @laclochette said.

But especially this:

You may not plan on merging your finances, and I agree this is wise, but your finances will soon become codependent and if you don't know where each of you stands it'll make it much harder. And these things will simply come out in the wash, usually at moments of tension or stress, such as if one of you can't make a bill one month. Get it out into the open now.

@FoxtrotOscarFoxtrotOscar that's true I guess, I've always made sure I had assets really. I dont feel rich by any stretch but there's some security there isn't there.

Not really an option for DP to rent near me, DP is afraid of leaving a fairly decent job when doesn't have many other options for work, and we live around 130miles apart.

@laclochette thank you for the advice. I will do that. A lot to consider.

I think if we work well living together then yes, I would like to own a house together one day but that would be a long way into the future. Good idea about saving-although I am certain DP would give ME the money to save! Not disciplined with money at all.

I'm sorry but this is a disaster waiting to happen to be quite honest with you.

He is completely financially incapable and yet you want to basically take the place of mummy and daddy (he's f'ing in his 40's for goodness sake) and look after him.

Your funeral to be quite honest, you will regret it. No offence but you sound like someone in their teens who has a really rose tinted view of what it's actually like to live with someone. All the things that aren't that much of a problem right now WILL become a problem.

Please don't let me stop you though... feel free to find out the hard way and see how easy it is to kick him out when you're sick of his shit.

I do find it very weird, I won't lie. But then I am from a much more privileged background so I guess I can't fully understand it. I couldn't live with my parents-I guess maybe VERY temporarily if I was in between houses or buying somewhere and something went wrong-but I've actually had that happen before and stayed in a friend's house that happened to be empty!

A few people have said things to the lines of me sounding immature, on this thread and I am genuinely intrigued as to why. I've been independent since I was 16, I have assets, always had decent jobs and responsibilites....

If I want to live with DP this is the way I'll have to do it, I can't stay living apart forever, the long distance not seeing one another thing, I find it absolutely awful.

@thebartenderatethethief You sound like you’ve made some good property buying decisions, and I applaud you for buying another place for you.

However, you chose to post this question in the Relationship threads as opposed to somewhere like Property.

So, it’s either a mistake on your part or you DO have some misgivings about how to play this.

Post this in Legal or Property, and you’ll get some pretty level headed business like advice.

Post the question (as you have done) in THIS area of MN, and you’ll have a lot of people who have been financially burnt going down this route, and are advising you to tread with extreme caution.

They say that Love is Blind… and it seems like the love you have for this guy is clouding any judgement.

That's why you are coming across as naive.

I know someone suggested that you rent together. That could give you the assurance that this guy can actually handle money…because so far I’m not getting the impression that he can.

But ultimately it’s your call

The problem with renting together is that they will jointly and severally liable for the rent. So, when he (almost inevitably) doesn't come up with his share, the OP will have to cough up - or risk eviction and potentially a CCJ.

Personally I'm at a loss to understand the attraction of this man.

I would live together first in rented accommodation. It is the only way to really know if you are compatible without it being high risk.

If you still want to buy and live with him then, you need him to specifically waive any interest in the property unless you specifically agree otherwise in writing.

My friend did very similar to you in the sense of buying a house and her partner moved in at the same time. Like yours he was bad with money but good with DIY and cooking.

She ended up paying all essential bills because it was the only way to be sure it would get paid. Fine at first, as he just needed a few months before being debt free. Then it didn't happen. He remained great at what he was great at before and really rubbish with money. That never got better. The relationship didn't last as she got fed up after the first flush of excitement of moving in passed and she was stuck with the reality that she was taking all the financial responsibility while her got to spend freely. She too was keen to have it all fair and agreed up front, but the reality was different.

A few people have said things to the lines of me sounding immature, on this thread and I am genuinely intrigued as to why.

I think it's because you don't seem to be acknowledging that having such vastly different approaches to money is likely to be a big problem. You don't seem to be giving any thought as to how living with someone with such a different approach is going to work, in practice, and giving much thought to the risks. You also don't seem to think it's a particularly negative trait on behalf of your DP, despite considering this major move.
That would be understandable in a first big relationship in your 20s, but - as per PP - you've posted in Relationships, and most people have been around the block a bit by the time they've reached their 40s, and it's obvious to most posters that you are likely to have issues with your DP's financial approach that you aren't really thinking about, according to what you are posting. That's why (to me at least) your writing seems to be from someone much younger.
I really do hope it works out for you.

Why has everyone assumed that the DP is male? I think the OP hasn't mentioned that anywhere. Not that it makes any difference.

I've asked how, when currently not having many household expenses and still having not managed to save, things will be when there are responsibilities and expenses!

And what was the answer to this? Also, with so few expenses what's he actually doing witth his money?

I'll be honest; a 40-odd year old still living with parents and being bad with finanvces would be a complete non-starter for me anyway, but each to their own.
Just be very, very careful here and certainly don't assume he'd be happy to leave with nothing if it came to it

Because the general assumption is a heterosexual relationship, but you're right, it doesn't really make any difference so I don't know why you bothered asking.

Lol - wait until you've lived together for a while and are dealing with paying for everything and you'll be back here saying how do you get them to move out! Long distance makes you yearn for more, being in their faces makes all the issues 100x bigger and you're ALREADY bothered enough to post here.

Yes I think you're immature because your outlook on the impact this could have on you is immature. It's all about wanting to live with them and not what the logistics of that actually looks like in real life and how it could affect your life negatively.

wait until you've lived together for a while and are dealing with paying for everything and you'll be back here saying how do you get them to move out!

I thought the same, roses321. Just the thing about him finding it fun to cook because he doesn't get much chance at home is a red flag, suggesting he's been looked after hand and foot, and anyway the "fun" has a habit of wearing off if there's someone else in situ to do the work

After all if he's done it with his mum, why wouldn't he repeat the pattern with OP?

I'd understand if i was responeding to a 20 year old... or even someone who never lived with anyone before but a 40 year old? I honestly have no sympathy and think both of them need to grow up!