Does having children make you happy? Would you have them even if unhappy in your marriage?

[Henriettana]

Does having children make you happy? If you've had them, do you think you're happier than if you didn't?

I am in a marriage which makes me unhappy. It's not abusive and he hasn't cheated. But I don't feel he values me or desires me, and I feel disappointed by the whole thing. I was hopeful at the start, but now I regret it and feel sad about it.

But I have always wanted a family. If I leave him, I may never have one. If I have children, I would plan to stay with him so would likely be in a difficult marriage forever. But I think he would be a good dad and would love any kids we have.

I'd be interested to hear what others would do - and what others have done?

How very odd @josuk that you think that people shouldn't plan and want the very best for their children and not just have them because 'they feel like it' to fill some void. There's plenty of evidence to show that children who grow up in less than desirable circumstances do not lead very fulfilling lives. Yes, some will thrive but most will not. Any child deserves to at least start off with two parents who at least like each other surely. We don't need to judge the selfish people who don't care as their kids will judge them when they are older anyway.

@Nofilteritwonthelp

Not odd at all.

The fixation on two parents household as if this is one and only way to ensure child’s happiness is, in my opinion - much more odd.

There is all kinds of research showing all kinds of things as to what ensures success and happiness.
Focusing on just one component -2nominal parents present - and making it important above and beyond all else; and putting moralising spin on it to put women down is completely ridiculous.

Sure - in an ideal world its great to have two loving parents.
Just like its great to be rich, beautiful and healthy. Also great to win a lottery, etc

But it doesn’t mean that other paths in life are not available to people who happen not to be as fortunate.

Instead of helping women, who did not win the lottery - help them best navigate along paths that are actually available to them - some people here just tear them down.

It is absolutely a valid choice to have a child as a single or divorced parent.

Children will make a bad marriage even worse and will therefore not bring happiness. You say he would be a good dad, but how do you know? The strain of a bad relationship with the added bonus of screaming kids and the endless money pit they bring to the table isn't going to improve his personality I can assure you. Children complicate life more than you can imagine which is OK (ish) if you are on solid ground but it is a disaster if you are not.

Children are very very challenging. Even for the strongest marriages. I speak from my own experience. They are much more work that I had ever imagined. Of course they bring joy and happiness and the type of love you have never felt for someone else before but they did not make me happier. You need to find happiness within yourself, don't expect you will be happier if you have kids, or if you have a partner, etc... otherwise, it will only get worse.
If you are married and you want to have your own family and make it work, you need to be able to trust your partner and rely on them.
But at the end of the day, it's your choice and only yours. Being a mom is amazing and unique and it made me a better person, but it also brought a lot of problems to my marriage.

My husband is a great man and a wonderful person but when our son was born I realized he had no clue how to be a dad. He didn't want to help, take responsibility, etc... so you never know how it will turn out once the baby is born. It took 2 years of fights and training to make him a better dad. He just wasn't ready for what came and it was all on me. You might be surprised. I also know men that were awful partners but became the best dads.

I appreciate it's a tough decision, so I don't say this lightly.

Rule nr 1 of being a parent is putting your children first. Putting their needs ahead of your own. And as much as you want to have children, it wouldn't be fair to knowingly bring children into a situation that isn't working. It isn't good for children to live in a home where mum and dad are tolerating each other for the sake of the children. And children learn about their own future adult relationships from their parents - their parents relationship is their default model of 'normal'. Would you want a future child of yours to accept your model of a relationship? Staying together despite not being happy?

I wouldn't want to parent alone, no way!!!!

And i also certainly couldn't bring kids into a crap relationship either.

When my Mom had me - she was loving with my Dad, but it wasn’t the strongest relationship. She already had one abortion with him before when he wasn’t hugely enthusiastic. Got pregnant with me in mid-30s and decided it was her one and last chance to have a child.

Subsequently my Dad started drinking seeing what he was turning into - my Mom threw him out when I was tiny.
He proceeded to addiction and i barely saw him.

She was the best and most dedicated mother a child can ask for. I never felt she wasn't there for me, or that I wasn't a priority.
She raised me, she worked, she was there for my important concerts and competitions.
I have honestly never wished I had a father.
I had my family and it was great - had my mother, grandma, aunt and cousins.

I think all the people who are in marriages and say how hard it would have been on their own and how they’d never do it - are not the right people to judge. As they don’t know what they are talking about - as are unable to imagine how it’ll feel wanting to have a child and not being able to.
It’s like a healthy person trying to tell a leas fortunate ill person (who wants to try experimental risky therapy) that health is not all that important. You just don’t get it.

A few of my friends struggled with infertility. And then a few others struggled finding a partner within fertility timeframe.
And went donor egg and /or sperm way.
And of course there are lots of divorces in my age category.

Most situations can be made to work - and kids don’t suffer if they have a loving and devoted parent. (Two is great too - but one can already be enough)

I have always known i’d want to have kids. In a relationship of that worked out - or on my own. As i know it can be done and done well.

Of course it’s hard work - and need help and family.
But - for me personally - hard work isn’t a reason to not have kids. For me - it’s worth it.
It is a personal choice.

As a child who grew up with parents in a "difficult" marriage, please don't do this to them.

Its bloody selfish, you're putting your wants before your hypothetical future children.

Thanks for the comments on this thread and sorry that I didn't reply earlier.

Some of you have given helpful advice on this based on your own experiences and observations. Thank you for that.

However, there's also a lot of judgement on this thread - with posters saying that if I decide to have children with my husband, where our marriage is difficult and not perfect, then it is selfish and unkind / cruel / manipulative.

To these posters - such as @Lifeasiknowitisout@Whatsgoingonwithmyhead @HowAmYa
@Jackfrostnippingatmynose @nmchg @Unexpectedlysinglemum @Passingthethyme @TwoMoreBoxesJayne @gannett@Bobbotgegrinch

I would like to ask: do you really think that women should only have a child when her relationship is perfect? And that the child is going to be messed up as a direct result of their less-than-perfect marriage?

And do you think that the child, when older, will be saying 'I wish my parents never had me and that I didn't exist, because their marriage wasn't great'?

That seems to be the logic behind what you're saying.

What if a woman has one child, then the partner starts being a less-than-perfect partner and their marriage gets difficult. Going by your logic, it sounds like you would tell her it is selfish to have another child and she should leave.

I find your thinking very simplistic and judgemental.

Surely at least part of the reason why most people have children is that they think they will bring some happiness. Is that selfish too?

Thanks @jsku - I agree with your point that some MN women are so quick to judge other women. Thanks for your points too @josuk and for understanding the dilemma.

'Less than perfect' vs 'perfect' is very different to the way you described your marriage and the awful way it makes you feel in your op, op. Thats what these comments are about- you aren't looking back in hindsight - you already know this is a miserable situation before conceiving. 'Would this child wish it never existed' is also very extreme- human beings don't often think like that, but sure the child might think 'I wish my mum had left dad and got into a happier state of mind with a decent support system before she had me rather than raising me in this miserable home.' My own child might think 'I wish I had parents that were together or at least liked each other' and I regularly think 'I wish I had my baby with a decent man I would be so much happier if I had.'

If the only or main reason you're unhappy is that you're childless and desperate for a baby then a baby of course can make you happier (although not always - look at all the threads on here of people who did ivf for years then feel so guilty for not enjoying motherhood and having pnd).

But you're already very sad and you blame that sadness on your marriage. Creating a reason to pressure yourself to stay in that marriage is unfair to your self. And hundreds of women here have told you from experience that babies make things harder not better so there is so way the child will make the relationship improve. You would just feel more lonely and isolated and on top of that have mountains of mum guilt. You're free to ignore that advice at your peril.

You're obviously in a sad place and this isn't meant to judge you but to help you avoid a bad decision that will make you worse. I would really recommend counselling xx

Ps rather than perfect think about 'good enough' - is this situation 'good enough' for you and a child ?

I was born to unhappily married parents, and it is VERY unfair to add a child to that situation. Children notice a lot more than you may think, and it is much better (and less damaging) to be raised by a happy, content, single parent than by two people who don’t like each other and don’t get along.

I think my family unit makes me happy(ier), a Dh who is loving and hands on, my DD is brilliant and watching her grow and learn is wonderful (it took me a while to get to this point tbh, the first few years I was quite u happy).

Echoing previous posters on this kids are hard work and I think you can get into a negative loop. If your marriage is unhappy you are always a little unhappy, your kids can then make you a bit a bit unhappy just because they are kids and can be difficult and it can feel like just another difficult thing you have to do. The strain of having kids can usually make things a lot worse in an already fractured relationship, you rely on the goodwill and love of the other to get you through sometimes.

All children deserve a happy home, none of us are perfect and people make mistakes all the time but if you know for a fact that what you are offering a child is not a happy secure home then if I’m blunt you probably shouldn’t. I waited a long time to have a child, I came form a dysfunctional home and I had therapy etc before I could contemplate having a child without some sort of dread. It’s not just about you and what you want it’s about what kind of life your child would have because it will impact them later.

No I wouldn’t have had children if I didn’t have a secure, happy marriage. I love them, but without my husband’s love and support life wouldn’t have been intolerable. I may have considered having children solo (with a donor) as an alternative as I feel that’s the next best option.

Children do not exist to bring YOU happiness. I understand wanted them, but they are people in their own right and deliberately bringing them into an unhappy home is selfish.

Your logic is so topsy turvy to me. I had children because I love my husband- I wouldn’t have had them otherwise. Even then, the baby and toddler years were tough at times for both of us - and we started from a good place. I think I’d be far happier without children than trapped in an unhappy marriage.

Children make you happy in the same way exercise makes you happy. It’s bloody hard work, without the right support or circumstances it’s relentless, you sometimes wonder why you bother, it’s for the long-haul, but ultimately it will enrich your life immensely.

Children do not make you happy in the same way chocolate cake, wine or spa days do.

Should let it be about the children and not you? Is it fair on the children to do this?

What is best for them? Having a child is not the same as beach or snow holiday?

The idea of having children to make yourself happy seems so upside down to me. Surely the point is whether you can give them the gift of happiness? I'm not saying you have to be in a traditional nuclear family setup for that but if you're in an existing unhappy situation, I can't imagine wilfully bringing a child into that.

And yes, children brought up in toxic families do resent it.

And yes, not having a child in an unhappy marriage may mean never having one. That's life. We don't all get what we want.

DO NOT INFLICT THIS MAN UPON YOUR FUTURE DC OP.

I stayed with my ex and had dc2 and my biggest regret in life is lumbering both of them with him as a dad.

Parenthood will strip away even the strongest, loving marriage to it's bones - if you already don't like him then you will destroy yourself and your parenting experience, just for the sake of having kids, which rather defeats the object - kids can be a delight but they're also a fucking nightmare sometimes - they cannot fix a broken relationship, fix your wobbly mental health or prop you up.

Move on OP before you bring kids into this toxic relationship

Personally I would only, by choice, have children in a happy, strong fulfilled relationship. Or on my own. Never in a bad relationship.

OP what qualities does your DH have that lead you to believe he’d be a good dad? Are those qualities ones which could be worked on to improve your relationship with him before considering bringing children into the mix?

Ive reread my earlier comment and id double down on what I've said.

I do think it's selfish and deceitful to have a child when you are knowingly in a poor relationship. Of course I don't think you need to have a "perfect" relationship (do they even exist?)
The problem with knowingly bringing a child into a poor relationship is that it's unfair on the child and on both the parents. Children need to be in happy homes that can be provided by couples, single parents or separated parents. It's all ok but bringing a child into a household where the parents don't get along with each other is a recipe for disaster.

What happens if you split up and then you have to co-parent with someone you don't like. Maybe someone that wants to do 50/50 . Are you really up for having a child then not seeing them for 50% of the time? Why would you do that to yourself.

I also think it's manipulative and deceitful to purposely have a child with someone you are unhappy with. Surely you can see that is horribly dishonest. Even if you don't much like your partner using him to have a child in the knowledge you may split up is awful. Yes I am judging.

To be honest, I had such an overwhelming desire for children that I would have had them in an unhappy marriage. I wanted children more than anything. However, obviously children are very likely to make an unhappy marriage even more unhappy. They put a strain on even the best relationships. If it was me I would have thought "Ok, my marriage might end but at least I'll have children."
My cousin had a child in a not very happy relationship. I mean he isn't awful but he certainly doesn't bring her joy! I can see she has no regrets. Her child is the best thing to have happened to her and she's a wonderful mother.
By the way, the above probably isn't sensible advice. I would never bring a child in to a relationship that was abusive or where I thought the man would treat them badly.

I think it depends- in one way children do make you happy, by themselves they are delightful and funny and everything else. As everyone has already said they expose cracks, but it’s what you do about that. Most people simply don’t realise how selfish, how self-centred and how difficult they are. Children expose this. The question is what will it do to you? Does it make you want to work hard at being less selfish, less self centred and less prone to lashing out? Or will it provide you with an excuse?

only you know how you will respond (and maybe not even you), and your husband also. Children can reinforce a marriage if they prompt the parents to address their short comings- if they provide an excuse to indulge your selfishness then they can make everything worse.

To answer your question @Henriettana , I don't think a relationship needs to be perfect for people to have kids, because I don't think a perfect relationship exists.

I do think that the people in the relationship should be happy at the very least. Anything other than that is selfish. You want to bring a child into a family that's already dysfunctional, that's unhappy. You're not doing that for the benefit of the hypothetical child, you're doing that because you want a kid. How can that not be selfish?

If you want a kid, then find someone you actually love, or use a sperm donor, go it alone. At least then they might have a chance to grow up in a happy family, even if that family is just you and your child.

Think about your potential kid rather than yourself.